Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • Makers of insect-based animal feed hope to be able to compete with soybeans on price.View the full article
    • Thank you for posting up the results from the sar. The PCN is not compliant with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4. Under Section 9 [2][a] they are supposed to specify the parking time. the photographs show your car in motion both entering and leaving the car park thus not parking. If you have to do a Witness Statement later should they finally take you to Court you will have to continue to state that even though you stayed there for several hours in a small car park and the difference between the ANPR times and the actual parking period may only be a matter of a few minutes  nevertheless the CEL have failed to comply with the Act by failing to specify the parking period. However it looks as if your appeal revealed you were the driver the deficient PCN will not help you as the driver. I suspect that it may have been an appeal from the pub that meant that CEL offered you partly a way out  by allowing you to claim you had made an error in registering your vehicle reg. number . This enabled them to reduce the charge to £20 despite them acknowledging that you hadn't registered at all. We have not seen the signs in the car park yet so we do not what is said on them and all the signs say the same thing. It would be unusual for a pub to have  a Permit Holders Only sign which may discourage casual motorists from stopping there. But if that is the sign then as it prohibits any one who doesn't have a permit, then it cannot form a contract with motorists though it may depend on how the signs are worded.
    • Defence and Counterclaim Claim number XXX Claimant Civil Enforcement Limited Defendant XXXXXXXXXXXXX   How much of the claim do you dispute? I dispute the full amount claimed as shown on the claim form.   Do you dispute this claim because you have already paid it? No, for other reasons.   Defence 1. The Defendant is the recorded keeper of XXXXXXX  2. It is denied that the Defendant entered into a contract with the Claimant. 3. As held by the Upper Tax Tribunal in Vehicle Control Services Limited v HMRC [2012] UKUT 129 (TCC), any contract requires offer and acceptance. The Claimant was simply contracted by the landowner to provide car-park management services and is not capable of entering into a contract with the Defendant on its own account, as the car park is owned by and the terms of entry set by the landowner. Accordingly, it is denied that the Claimant has authority to bring this claim. 4. In any case it is denied that the Defendant broke the terms of a contract with the Claimant. 5. The Claimant is attempting double recovery by adding an additional sum not included in the original offer. 6. In a further abuse of the legal process the Claimant is claiming £50 legal representative's costs, even though they have no legal representative. 7. The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety. It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all. Signed I am the Defendant - I believe that the facts stated in this form are true XXXXXXXXXXX 01/05/2024   Defendant's date of birth XXXXXXXXXX   Address to which notices about this claim can be sent to you  
    • pop up on the bulk court website detailed on the claimform. [if it is not working return after the w/end or the next day if week time] . When you select ‘Register’, you will be taken to a screen titled ‘Sign in using Government Gateway’.  Choose ‘Create sign in details’ to register for the first time.  You will be asked to provide your name, email address, set a password and a memorable recovery word. You will be emailed your Government Gateway 12-digit User ID.  You should make a note of your memorable word, or password as these are not included in the email.<<**IMPORTANT**  then log in to the bulk court Website .  select respond to a claim and select the start AOS box. .  then using the details required from the claimform . defend all leave jurisdiction unticked  you DO NOT file a defence at this time [BUT you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 ] click thru to the end confirm and exit the website .get a CPR 31:14 request running to the solicitors https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?486334-CPR-31.14-Request-to-use-on-receipt-of-a-PPC-(-Private-Land-Parking-Court-Claim type your name ONLY no need to sign anything .you DO NOT await the return of paperwork. you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 from the date on the claimform.
    • well post it here as a text in a the msg reply half of it is blanked out. dx  
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
        • Like
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
        • Like
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

Got a PCN for overwrritten VRM in Newham,need to fight


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 4054 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

Hi everyone,I'm a new member and I really need a help with that case,been looking around for any information but cant really sort it my self as it is a bit not that common case

Will be very thankful if I can get any opinion as in this case I'm sure I'm absolutely correct and have the right to fight it

Lets tell the short story:

I did use that day a visitor parking permit to park the car in front of our house,we just had change on the road restrictions and just became a permit zone but we were planning to move out of the area soon because of my son school and I decide not to apply for resident parking permit and to buy for £5 10 visitor permits and use in case I need for me or any visitors,cause mostly my car was on a way in the restricted hours and I didn't need one.But that day I came back home for 2 hours and I did write by hand the details correct(you can see on the files).When I decide to go back to work I found the ticket on the windscreen so basically I thought may be the warden didn't see the permit and wrote me ticket,so I did write to them next day to explain that and I did send them photos.They reply to me (i can attache the letter in the next post)and said that they are aware of the permit but they are not happy of the way I wrote my VRM so that why I need to pay to them £130.This happen in front of my door,I had permit,I was really mad.I reply to them but the letter may be was more emotional then documentary but in the end I was insisting to go to adjudicator to decide if I'm right or not.I didn't get any answer more then 4-5 months and cause I was really mad to Newham finally we moved to other borough and I really forgot about this matter but one day we went back to look for any letters and I found out that the case escalate and was at adjudicator and been decide to pay the amount in 28 days so this end period was luckily 3 days after I found it.I did call the PTAS to ask what are my options and they advise me to pay the PCN and then write to them and explain everything and that's what I did.I did pay and now is the time to explain,but because I didn't reply on time and the case become more complicated for me then should be I would like to make a really strong representation so I can appeal the ticket.The case its really strange I agree but I see the comments about Newham and their way of work in here:http://www.newhamrecorder.co.uk/news/newham_council_slammed_over_5_700_parking_fine_1_1958415 and I wont let this go easy,so pls help

Forgot to say the car been exported and sold 2 months after the ticket is issued that's why I did show it its important in this case to show the real VRM,but will be more careful to hide any personnel and not relevant information in future I do post.I can upload the first letter From Newham council the first answer I got to explain what I've done wrong for them to get a ticket but there is not enough space here to load it,may be there is an option, don't know.Anyway probably is good to do will look for a way,but what is funny in this,I used all 10 permits exactly the same way,written the same way cause I got the answer from my first letter just a week or two before I move out from this address and that's how and when I knew I did overwrite it but I didn't get any other tickets,what is to criteria to decide that this is penalty,you don't write it on desk or machine,you do it in your car,on your knees while sitting in the car,this is really unfair.and if all the rest is correct and I can not find any other grounds to appeal and to the adjudicator the only one question will be to decide that this is overwritten or not,what criteria he will use to decide right. Dont know, that's why I think it is complicated for me.Thanks for any further help to everyone

By the way I did pay on time the PCN,and I have been advised from PATAS to do so and that's why I did,and because the appealing period expired not by my fault,I couldn't reply and act on time cause I move out from the address 3-4 months after my last letter to Newham counsil been send and they do not reply to me.I was ensured that I can appeal from PATAS just need to pay on time and explain the delay.I wouldn't pay otherwise.There is few other letters I found after been send to the old address but I cant upload to show.Think I'm still having the option to appeal with adjudicator and I want to use it,I didnt appeal yet and I want to,did try few months to find information on different sites but cant find with this matter exactly that's why came to this point to ask for any opinion.Thank you

The question is what I can do and write to appeal this PCN-if this doesn't help me for some other reason like time delay or my fault of writing it that's not a problem cause I already paid and I'm not doing it for money but believe me the try is important,other people like me will see what can be done and will look for advice and this site will help them in their case even when they google it will be easy to find it and find a way to appeal and sick advice from you guys and you will help them to stop the wrong politic of the government regarding this matter cause its getting worst and worst and if you helping to 10 today to appeal the unfair tickets are may be 1000 more then usual so the only one way is to spread this info and give people chance and challenge to fight against it.

Edited by go6imir
Link to post
Share on other sites

Sheesh! You need to put your post into paragraphs. It's too much hard work to read it as it is! Also the images are too small.

 

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi everyone,I'm a new member and I really need a help with that case,been looking around for any information but cant really sort it my self as it is a bit not that common case

Will be very thankful if I can get any opinion as in this case I'm sure I'm absolutely correct and have the right to fight it

Lets tell the short story:

 

I did use that day a visitor parking permit to park the car in front of our house,we just had change on the road restrictions and just became a permit zone but we were planning to move out of the area soon because of my son school and I decide not to apply for resident parking permit and to buy for £5 10 visitor permits and use in case I need for me or any visitors,cause mostly my car was on a way in the restricted hours and I didn't need one.But that day I came back home for 2 hours and I did write by hand the details correct(you can see on the files).When I decide to go back to work I found the ticket on the windscreen so basically I thought may be the warden didn't see the permit and wrote me ticket,so I did write to them next day to explain that and I did send them photos.They reply to me (i can attache the letter in the next post)and said that they are aware of the permit but they are not happy of the way I wrote my VRM so that why I need to pay to them £130.This happen in front of my door,I had permit,I was really mad.I reply to them but the letter may be was more emotional then documentary but in the end I was insisting to go to adjudicator to decide if I'm right or not.I didn't get any answer more then 4-5 months and cause I was really mad to Newham finally we moved to other borough and I really forgot about this matter but one day we went back to look for any letters and I found out that the case escalate and was at adjudicator and been decide to pay the amount in 28 days so this end period was luckily 3 days after I found it.I did call the PTAS to ask what are my options and they advise me to pay the pcn and then write to them and explain everything and that's what I did.I did pay and now is the time to explain,but because I didn't reply on time and the case become more complicated for me then should be I would like to make a really strong representation so I can appeal the ticket.The case its really strange I agree but I see the comments about Newham and their way of work in here:http://www.newhamrecorder.co.uk/news...fine_1_1958415 and I wont let this go easy,so pls help

 

Forgot to say the car been exported and sold 2 months after the ticket is issued that's why I did show it its important in this case to show the real VRM,but will be more careful to hide any personnel and not relevant information in future I do post.I can upload the first letter From Newham council the first answer I got to explain what I've done wrong for them to get a ticket but there is not enough space here to load it,may be there is an option, don't know.Anyway probably is good to do will look for a way,but what is funny in this,I used all 10 permits exactly the same way,written the same way cause I got the answer from my first letter just a week or two before I move out from this address and that's how and when I knew I did overwrite it but I didn't get any other tickets,what is to criteria to decide that this is penalty,you don't write it on desk or machine,you do it in your car,on your knees while sitting in the car,this is really unfair.and if all the rest is correct and I can not find any other grounds to appeal and to the adjudicator the only one question will be to decide that this is overwritten or not,what criteria he will use to decide right. Dont know, that's why I think it is complicated for me.Thanks for any further help to everyone

 

 

By the way I did pay on time the PCN,and I have been advised from PATAS to do so and that's why I did,and because the appealing period expired not by my fault,I couldn't reply and act on time cause I move out from the address 3-4 months after my last letter to Newham counsil been send and they do not reply to me.I was ensured that I can appeal from PATAS just need to pay on time and explain the delay.I wouldn't pay otherwise.There is few other letters I found after been send to the old address but I cant upload to show.Think I'm still having the option to appeal with adjudicator and I want to use it,I didnt appeal yet and I want to,did try few months to find information on different sites but cant find with this matter exactly that's why came to this point to ask for any opinion.Thank you

 

The question is what I can do and write to appeal this PCN-if this doesn't help me for some other reason like time delay or my fault of writing it that's not a problem cause I already paid and I'm not doing it for money but believe me the try is important,other people like me will see what can be done and will look for advice and this site will help them in their case even when they google it will be easy to find it and find a way to appeal and sick advice from you guys and you will help them to stop the wrong politic of the government regarding this matter cause its getting worst and worst and if you helping to 10 today to appeal the unfair tickets are may be 1000 more then usual so the only one way is to spread this info and give people chance and challenge to fight against it.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry,I know its a bit hard,its hard for me too, that's why I'm posting and trying to give as much as possible info so the members who wants to give right opinion to make it easier.This is other photo, don't know why this ones are too small!

Link to post
Share on other sites

To post images on CAG, you need to convert them to PDF and edit out all personal info, reference numbers and barcodes.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

From what I can see of the permit, it appears the first digit has been 'altered' but I cannot really tell for sure.

 

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

From what I can see of the permit, it appears the first digit has been 'altered' but I cannot really tell for sure.

 

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

 

yes its B,been in a rush and did write ugly but can not be mixed with other letter,anyway they do not say why and what,just it is overwritten

Link to post
Share on other sites

you have not indercated what zone you are in too i think

 

sorry i read it properly now no need to circle a zone i dont think

 

but the b to me looks like an s which is changes to a b

Edited by sgtbush
Link to post
Share on other sites

To have an adjudication case, you need to apply within 28 days of a Notice of Rejection being issued.

 

To get a Notice of Rejection you will need to have

 

1. Received a Notice to Owner, and

2. appealed against it at that stage, and within 28 days.

 

Did either of those things happen? And did you get a Notice of Rejection?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,thanks for the question,yes I see and I can say,I have never received Notice to Owner and Notice of rejection from Newham,I can see that I have only one letter from them after I send my first informal representation and in this letter they explain me that is for overwritten VRM this is on the 8.02,and the next letter from them is Order for recovery on the 19.06.I moved out the address on the 1.03 and had 3 months royal mail redirection.I did sell the car but I did let know in my 2 letters to them that I'm moving home any moment witch was normal after all,the council have my new address for the council tax reason to pay me back the balance.I tought all finished and they didnt want to go ahead If I had rejection letter on time this might not happen,I was ready to go to the end,they might wanted exactly this,because I didn't reply on time the case was send to adjudicator and I didn't appeal and then I was given direction to pay £130 in 28 days and I paid on the 25th day when I found this letter,I can imagine what would happen if I didn't but I did contact PATAS explain this and they said to pay and then write appeal with explanation why I didn't do on time and then they will consider it. Dont think is a problem to appeal if you never did,so Ill try.I know I made the case more difficult to win with all that time delay and I paid for it,but want to try to see what is the chance even if I'm going the difficult way.at least that will give me and others experience and knowledge what to do in similar case in future cause this one its not a regular case and cant find anywhere

Link to post
Share on other sites

the next letter from them is Order for recovery on the 19.06.

 

Do you mean June 19th?

 

You have 21 days from the Order for Recovery to contest it. If this was issued last June, I don't see you can contest it now. It would have to be a late application on a paid PCN - I think they will just throw it out.

Link to post
Share on other sites

So PATAS basically lie to me,thought I have better chance that way if I pay to them on time and do as direction say,I shouldn't pay,the order was directed on my wife name(even the surname was wrong the address was old) cause she was the owner at that time,the car is sold and exported,we move to other address and area,the new car is on my name,I just made a big favor to this guys,that will be a big lesson,that was long time ago,but thank you guys,this will change the way I sort this problems in future and will definitely not do any favors anymore and I wont be so easy target to this bastards next time for sure. Thats just other sample of what we shouldn't do and what we shouldn't except and if we believe we are right never pay never.Thanks for the advises.I might still write to Patas and Newham,just because to let them keep me in a record that I made them a gift once

Link to post
Share on other sites

So PATAS basically lie to me,thought I have better chance that way if I pay to them on time and do as direction say,I shouldn't pay,the order was directed on my wife name(even the surname was wrong the address was old) cause she was the owner at that time,the car is sold and exported,we move to other address and area,the new car is on my name,I just made a big favor to this guys,that will be a big lesson,that was long time ago,but thank you guys,this will change the way I sort this problems in future and will definitely not do any favors anymore and I wont be so easy target to this bastards next time for sure. Thats just other sample of what we shouldn't do and what we shouldn't except and if we believe we are right never pay never.Thanks for the advises.I might still write to Patas and Newham,just because to let them keep me in a record that I made them a gift once

 

Whilst I appreciate English is not your first language your story is hard to understand you say it went to the adjudicator and you lost and when you rang PATAS they told you to pay, which is correct. Yet you also state you never appealled to the NTO which makes the entire saga confusing,unless you decide to post ALL the documents not just a few cropped images their is little else we can say.

Link to post
Share on other sites

ok.thats all of them I have,let me know if you need anything else,sorry thought I have no chance after the last few comments.It was 1 year ago,the main question is even If i can appeal,what ground I can put in?Thats why I post all This not to try to explain my hard to understand story and to practice my second language.What is the criteria for overwritten,who decide that the Vrm is overwritten or just ugly written.Regarding the documentary part,I wasn't replying on time neither or correct so I cant appeal on that ground I think,what else can be seen and done?Let me know if you need anything else

Link to post
Share on other sites

If you had posted the PATAS letter to start with you would have not wasted everyones time!!!

 

Enforcement Authority has referred a Witness Statement made by Mrs Boyanou saying she made representations to the Enforcement Authority but did not receive a Notice of Rejection. The Enforcement Authority states no representation was received to the Notice to Owner. The statutory process is as follows: 1. The Enforcement Authority serves a Penalty Charge Notice. 2. The Enforcement Authority then serves a Notice to Owner on the person it believes to be the owner or the hirer of the vehicle. 3. The recipient then has 28 days to make representations to the Enforcement Authority. The Enforcement Authority may disregard any representations not made within this time. 4. The Enforcement Authority must then serve a notice in response rejecting or accepting the representations. 5. If the Enforcement Authority serves a Notice of Rejection, the recipient of the notice then has 28 days to appeal to the Adjudicator. This procedure must be followed correctly to contest liability and ultimately appeal to the Parking and Traffic Appeals Service. Failure to either make representations or to appeal within the required time means there will be no right to contest liability further, however strong the merits of the case. The Enforcement Authority sent a Notice to Owner on 13 April 2012. Because no representation was received the Authority did not issue a Notice of Rejection. I accept Rosen Boyanou made informal representations before receiving the Notice to Owner but this communication cannot form formal representations in response to the Notice to Owner. Mrs Boyanou was asked to clarify when she sent the representation and to provide a copy and has not done so within the time allowed. I am satisfied she has no right of appeal and is liable for the Penalty Charge. I have made this direction because Mrs Boyanou failed to follow the required procedure and has no right of appeal. I have not and cannot consider the merits of the case. Direction: 1. Anne Marie Boyanou to pay the Penalty Charge of £130 by 3 December 2012. 2. If the penalty charge is not paid by then the Enforcement Authority may serve a Charge Certificate increasing the penalty by 50% Payment to be made to London Borough of Newham Parking and Traffic Enforcement PO Box 1125 Warrington Cheshire WA55 1EJ Telephone 020 8430 2000

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...