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    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
    • Thanks for all the suggestions so far I will amend original WS and send again for review.  While looking at my post at very beginning when I submitted photos of signs around the car park I noticed that it says 5 hours maximum stay while the signage sent by solicitor shows 4 hours maximum stay but mine is related to electric bay abuse not sure if this can be of any use in WS.
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      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Is it worth appealing a failed atos work capability assessment?


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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi, just a quick update, I have received confirmation that my appeal has been received, and until a decision is reached, I am to survive on £67.50 a week, so much for NOT being WORSE off!!

 

Merry christmas Atos and the D.W.P, and our wonderful 'caring' government, don't give us a second thought when you're in your nice warm houses, eating, drinking and enjoying your christmas will you....

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A lot of people on sickness benifits were doing so because they were unable to return to the same job. But remember that isn't what the benifit is there for.

 

That was Invalidity Benefit; to get that you had to send sicknotes in from your Doctor. This was phased out years ago with the introduction of IB. "The sicknote culture" of IB was a myth introduced by the government as to get (and keep) it you had to take regular DWP medicals. The requirements for IB where actually more strict than those needed for ESA. The "problem" was that they were carried out by real doctors, and although they would try to catch you out would not lie when faced with genuine illness.

 

IB was introduced for the very reason you mentioned; too many people where on long term sickness becasue they could not do their usual job, IB was only for those who were to ill to do any job and failed the All Work Test. To get IB or ESA you had to pass (fail?) the AWT or WCA by getting 15 or more points. The descritpors for the AWT were more strict than the WCA, but the application is different. Also being blind, having a heart condition, being in a wheelchair, etc. is no longer enough to get the benefit.

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Yes you should appeal.

 

I recommend you go ASAP to the Citizen's Advice Bureau, they are truly amazing people. They will make sure you follow the right procedure for appeal and will help with paperwork.

 

The same happened to me.

I went to my ATOS medical with my support worker, medical evidence and a strongly worded letter from my GP, but because I was "on a good day" , the assessor decided I was not eligible for ESA.

They base a lot of the assessment on what you say, rather than look at the evidence, so if communication isn't your forte...

We went to the Citizen's Advice Bureau, and the decision was reversed within 3 weeks, if I remember correctly, with payments backdated to the original date.

 

edit: Apologies for this post, I didn't read all the replies before posting, so didn't see you had already sorted the problem.

Edited by plok
Original problem was sorted before my post
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Another update...I received a letter on the 14th December stating that my medical certificate was due to run out on the 15th, the actual date on the letter was the 8th December, so why it took 6 days to get to me is anyone's guess....I got another medical certificate today, photocopied it, before sending it back in a normal envelope, first class, as opposed to using their 2nd class pre-paid one. So now I wait to see if I get any money on wednesday....

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chelle123, it's up to you to ensure your med cert is up to date and sent off in time - the DWP don't always send out reminders. Put the date it runs out in your diary or on a calender. See your Doc a week before that date and send off your new cert in good time ...

Rae.

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  • 4 weeks later...
Yes you should appeal.

 

I recommend you go ASAP to the Citizen's Advice Bureau, they are truly amazing people. They will make sure you follow the right procedure for appeal and will help with paperwork.

 

" The same happened to me.

I went to my ATOS medical with my support worker, medical evidence and a strongly worded letter from my GP, but because I was "on a good day" , the assessor decided I was not eligible for ESA.

They base a lot of the assessment on what you say, rather than look at the evidence, so if communication isn't your forte...

We went to the Citizen's Advice Bureau, and the decision was reversed within 3 weeks, if I remember correctly, with payments backdated to the original date."

 

At one time , the system was relatively ! benign and went on a worst day basis ....people were given the benefit of the doubt

 

...the gloss put on things now is not what you can't do it's what you can do . It's only a capability test and it's very debatable whether it is relevant to the real world of work and there have been some very controversial decisions......the whole WCA concept seems to fall on it's inherent contradictions

 

. There was one in the paper of a registered blind since 16 man with a guide dog being passed " fit for work " ....what's he going to do ? ....Airline Pilot , Train Driver ? , Aircraft Control ? .....in any case who'd take him on with the insurance issues ? ....there was some more contentious ones recently on Eastern Eye a East of England BBC current affairs programme .

 

There's JCP + staff that know the people that have " failed " the WCA are too ill to work , some people after failing the WCA have been disallowed JSA as they are too ill ........it's all bit Orwellian ?

 

http://dwpexamination.wordpress.com/an-account-of-my-dwp-medical/ I hope this isn't too militant , it just appears there's too many underhand machinations with the " trick " closed questions and too many disgruntled people who've had negative experiences and very few with positive ones ...and even then they suspect them of being ATOS or DWP trolls be it rightly or wrongly .

Edited by Bustard
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if the DWP wants to trip people up or accuse people of fraud or " get to the truth " by " reading between the lines " do it properly . It appears that the regulations are so badly drafted , worded etc and they're " open to interpretation " as they say . The original UNUM paper back in the early noughties was entitled " Malingering , Illness & Deception " AFAIK ...there was a lot of lobbying after that ....a odd coincidence ??

 

http://tia-junior.blogspot.com/2011/11/surreptitious-assumptions-made-by.html Hope this is of use , I've included it as it explains things better than I can

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Forget the WCA what's the point? Had one last week (my second) it lasted 21 minutes including the greet in reception and me being able to turn of my recorder after leaving. One before that was 25 mins so at least I'm getting more efficient :lol:

 

Classics from this one were;

 

Not believing that somebody can last for 3 weeks without going to buy food from the shops.

 

You don't even chat to the neighbours in your block of flats?

 

And her little squeal of delight when after the TV (don't watch it) on thw what do you do all day question I mention I surf the web etc.

 

A Computer - jackpot!

 

Just waiting for the DWP phone calls that I'll ignore then the trip to the nice man at the advice centre when the letter arrives whw will probably just photo copy my appeal from last time and send it in :-D

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Hi, just a quick update, I have received confirmation that my appeal has been received, and until a decision is reached, I am to survive on £67.50 a week, so much for NOT being WORSE off!!

 

Merry christmas Atos and the D.W.P, and our wonderful 'caring' government, don't give us a second thought when you're in your nice warm houses, eating, drinking and enjoying your christmas will you....

 

Welcome to the £67.50 per week club, all of us that are on appeal or on assessment are members, you could join the £67.50 per week JSA club if you want, membership is free, no more worries about sending med certs in! All you need to do is get yourself down to the job centre fortnightly, armed with your jobsearch, you get to sit in pleasant air conditioned surroundings while you wait to be called up to sign on, you get to meet a really nice and friendly person who will ask you all sorts of silly questions about looking for work and stuff like that, but eventually they will let you sign a little bit of paper which will guarantee your next installment's of £67.50 per week! How bad is that! You may even be invited to join the mandatory work activity club, this is so much fun, you get to work all day for free! In really interesting places like Poundland, or Morrisons.

 

I dunno about you but I'm staying in my club.

 

Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges

 

Being poor is like being a Pelican. No matter where you look, all you see is a large bill.

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IMO they want a disincentive to appeals according to this http://touchstoneblog.org.uk/2011/10/disabled-people-guilty-till-proved-innocent/ According to this , there's no evidence of widespread abuse of the appeals system . The successful figures clearly show there's something clearly wrong with the system ?

 

They seem to be paranoid & neurotic about the odd chance of someone getting one over on them , you can either tolerate the odd necessary evil , if you go all holier than thou they should expect to be contradicted and challenged .

 

As one caller said to Victoria Derbyshire on Five Live ...the real hard core " Frank Gallagher - Shameless " type scroungers are too hard faced & savvy to be caught out , they'd know the system better than the DWP staff and can also bully people . DWP staff say on forums the real [problem]s are far more sophisticated than the odd person coming the old soldier , usually involving immigrants ...non pc or not . To catch them out is seemingly too much like hard work ?

 

The Govt allegedly put pressure on Prof Harrington re Cancer Patients , it appeared that they were trying to teach them a moral lesson about entitlement , that backfired in the media .

 

 

" Forget the WCA what's the point? Had one last week (my second) it lasted 21 minutes including the greet in reception and me being able to turn of my recorder after leaving. One before that was 25 mins so at least I'm getting more efficient "

 

IMO As soon as you step inside the ATOS Origin " Medical " Centre Car Park , your assessment starts , there is nothing remotely informal about it , one centre report-ably had 95 CCTV cameras .....there's been stories about security guards giving people pens to see if they drop them ..." remarkably similar " to the Pound Coin test ?

 

IMO Basically they're using Insurance Claim Industry Methods to trip people up, where the fraud rate is 20 % , with DWP benefits the fraud rate is 0.3 - 0.5 % & claimants will have written evidence to vouch for their conditions .

 

Also in the Insurance Industry you need proper evidence that can stand up in court . My late Uncle fell off a ladder whilst working as a glazier , he was summoned to the Office & paid up , however on the way out someone was watching him through binoculars , there was a story in The Daily Mail about a lady who'd tripped over and injured herself working for ASDA in their bakery . She alleged that she'd been covertly filmed for 4-5 years by a private investigator hired by ASDA .

 

There was a report in the media of a Bombardier Shorts worker who had a metal sheet the size of a billiards table fall on him . One of their senior managers had him filmed from a unmarked van lifting up his baby . The Senior Manager wanted him in the office accusing him of malingering . Royal Mail later headhunted that Senior Manager to be their Personnel Director in Northern Ireland .

 

However at least these firms are at least trying to get proper evidence unlike ATOS & the DWP with underhand seemingly innocent and innocuous closed and sideways questioning about the likes of Facebook . The conclusions made by ATOS or the DWP " Decision " Makers seem to have very little to do with the real world of work .

 

Google UNUM Provident " Bad Faith " about remarkably similar events in the States and UNUM Provident being outlawed in 22 states ...it's " interesting "

Edited by Bustard
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Whilst appealing, claimants can if they so wish stay on ESA, though at a reduced rate. Claimants found not to have limited capability for work who have appealed against that decision can get reduced-rate ESA whilst the appeal is pending, provided that they continue to submit medical certificates - note that is not restricted to income-related ESA. It is understood that the appeal letter can be treated as a new claim for ESA, and the reduced-rate is achieved by applying only the 'assessment phase' rate of ESA (i.e., without additional components) while the appeal is pending. An alternative (as in incapacity for work appeals) is for the claimant to claim jobseeker's allowance while appealing. The DWP has confirmed to CPAG the official intent that where that happens, and the claimant subsequently wins their appeal so re-establishing entitlement to ESA, they will be able to receive arrears of ESA less any JSA paid.

 

Cut and pasted from the Child Poverty Action Group web site the full article is here http://www.cpag.org.uk/cro/wrb/wrb207/esa_appeals.htm

 

Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges

 

Being poor is like being a Pelican. No matter where you look, all you see is a large bill.

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  • 4 months later...

Hi..just a quick update as to how my appeal is progressing.

 

Ok here goes, I received a letter from the tribunal service this morning (11/06/2012) informing me that the appeal is allowed.:-D It also says that The decision of the Secretary of state dated 14/11/2011 is set aside. The Tribunal added a further 9 points to the points previously awarded.

 

I did not attend a hearing (at my own request) and the decision was made via a First-Tier Tribunal. The accompanying letter however, states that the D.W.P. or Jobcentre can still appeal this decision.:???: So I can do nothing more than await a response from them.

 

In answer to my own question at the start of this thread, it IS worth appealing a failed ATOS Work Capability assessment. It has been a long, sometimes infuriating :-x process, but one which I have learned a great deal from, and hope that my experience will help others in their appeals, or in deciding whether or not to appeal.

 

I will further update when I hear back from the D.W.P and would like to take this opportunity to thank everyone :-D for all of your support, information and contributions to this thread..thank you all very much:high5:

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  • 1 month later...

Hi, just wondering if anyone knows how long it takes, from when you are awarded e.s.a. by appeal, to getting normal e.s.a. payments? I received notification from the tribunal service on the 8th June, and have had no communication whatsoever from either the d.w.p. or the jobcentre..

 

I was originally told to expect to have to wait between 4 and 6 weeks..but would have expected to have had some sort of communication, even if it was just to tell me that my claim is being processed, or is this not standard procedure? :???:

 

(I struggle with phone calls, which is why I have not phoned them)..:sad:

 

The sickening thing is, by the time all of this is eventually sorted, no doubt it will be time to have to go through it all over again:-x

 

So sick of being penalized for being too ill to work, and having to go over the same thing again and again, it's a similar feeling to flogging a :deadhorse:

 

:focus:

apologies, got caught in a :violin: moment..:lol: I will update as soon as I have any news..

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Just a quick update.. I rang today to find out what was happening, and it turns out, everything was on the system, but no-one acted on it.. I received a call back to inform me that a payment request has now been made, and it will take 7 - 10 days to sort out, that includes all the back payments too..I will post again when I receive it..

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  • 3 weeks later...

Another quick update..After waiting and waiting AGAIN, I hear nothing regarding payment. I rang back yesterday to see what was going on, to be told that because of staff shortage, and a backlog of paperwork, it could be up to another 2 weeks before anything gets sorted.

 

This has already been 3 months since the tribunal, and it is coming up to a year since I failed the W.C.A..

 

I am not impressed at all, in fact you can safely assume that I am :-x with all the excuses, mis-information and downright incompetence of the whole stupid system:frusty:

 

Apologies for the rant..just had to get it off my chest..it's wound me up so much..

 

I will post again if, and when, it eventually does get sorted..

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  • 3 weeks later...

I will definitely be following your advice abc123, those two weeks came and went AGAIN without hearing ANYTHING from them. I contacted the D.W.P. on Friday 24th August, to be told the delay is because of a huge backlog..hmm sounds familiar.. I was also told yet again that my details would be passed straight through to the relevant department, and she wasn't quite sure what to say, when I informed her, that I was told that very same thing the last time I rang.

 

To top it all off, she said I would get a call-back this morning (Tuesday 28th August) to update me, and unsurprisingly that hasn't happened either.

 

So enough is enough, i'll update again, when i've been in touch with the C.A.B.

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