Hfo turnbulls court proceeding pls help!!

[wunder]

Cayman Islands I think. I will check and repost. I think what has happened is that one HFO company has passed it on to another. Will recheck though.

[broken arrow]

Cayman Islands I think. I will check and repost. I think what has happened is that one HFO company has passed it on to another. Will recheck though.

 

Yes you should.

[DonkeyB]

Cayman? Doubt it. It does not now have a CC licence. Probably Ireland, hence the watertight defence.

[coledog]

Hi Wunder

 

Are you able to scan and post up any of the documents any of the documents with personal details removed? Particularly need to see the POC and possibly the defence you sent. Also the Statement that you received.

 

How did you receive the statement? Did Turnbulls send it and was it in response to your CPR request? Did you ask for the Credit agreement in your CPR request?

 

When did you submit the defence?

 

Is the Court Northampton? Give them another ring and find out exactly what is happening and what you need to do next, they are normally very helpful.

 

Also, what previous contact have you had with HFO and roughly how much is this claim for?

 

Sorry for all the questions but important.

 

I think the main thing to do is to get information from Barclaycard. You can use the SAR template below with a £10 postal order. Once you have sent the SAR, you can ring them again and try and get more information. You can certainly send a CCA request to Turnbull also.

Standard SAR.doc

[coledog]

TR have 28 days to respond to your defence. Apparently, they always apply for 'Summary judgement' on all claims, the court told me this. if you have submitted a defence, the court should knock this back and tell them to respond to the defence

[DonkeyB]

TR have 28 days to respond to your defence. Apparently, they always apply for 'Summary judgement' on all claims, the court told me this. if you have submitted a defence, the court should knock this back and tell them to respond to the defence

 

But they never submit an N244 nor pay the fee, so it usually gets knocked back!

[wunder]

Thank you for all the replies. Here goes;

 

POC states that HFO Capital transferred the debt via an intra company agreement to HFO in Dublin. This is stated in the POC. They have also relied on a 'credit agreement dated 31st July 1999'. This I have asked them to provide today.

 

They also state that they gave a notice of assignment, I have asked for a copy of the deed of assignment.

 

They have responded to the defence and sent me these plain paper 'copy statements'. I have requested the court not to allocate the claim until the documents are provided. I have made a request under CPR 31.14.

 

I shall scan the documents and post them asap.

 

All your advice will be appreciated

[wunder]

Hi Wunder

 

Are you able to scan and post up any of the documents any of the documents with personal details removed? Particularly need to see the POC and possibly the defence you sent. Also the Statement that you received.

 

How did you receive the statement? Did Turnbulls send it and was it in response to your CPR request? Did you ask for the Credit agreement in your CPR request?

 

When did you submit the defence?

 

Is the Court Northampton? Give them another ring and find out exactly what is happening and what you need to do next, they are normally very helpful.

 

Also, what previous contact have you had with HFO and roughly how much is this claim for?

 

Sorry for all the questions but important.

 

I think the main thing to do is to get information from Barclaycard. You can use the SAR template below with a £10 postal order. Once you have sent the SAR, you can ring them again and try and get more information. You can certainly send a CCA request to Turnbull also.

 

Many thanks. They sent the statements in response to the defence. I have had no other contact with HFO and they have stated on their POC that they have called at my house and phoned me also, all untrue.

 

I have sent the requests to Turnbull and also SAR request first thing this morning.

 

I will post the documents via scan asap.

[coledog]

In your defence - did you ask permission to amend the defence if further documents were supplied?

[Happyhippy1959]

subbing

[wunder]

Sorry I could not figure out how to attach so I have copied and pasted;

 

PARTICULARS OF DEFENCE

 

 

The defendant sets grounds against the above claim made by HFO Capital Limited, under the following grounds:

 

1. Turnbull Solicitors have contacted myself and lodged a claim in this court in respect of a debt, which they claim, has been assigned to HFO Capital Limited.

2. I submit that this debt is statute barred and there has been no acknowledgment/payment or contact by the creditor or myself themselves since 2004.

3. It is my understanding that under the Limitation Act 1980 Section 5

"an action founded on simple contract shall not be brought after the expiration of six years from the date on which the cause of action accrued".

The last correspondence/payment/acknowledgement or payment of this debt was made over six years ago and no further acknowledgement or payment has been made since that time till recently in May 2011 in the form of a civil claim. Unless the claimant can provide evidence of payment or written contact from me in the relevant period under Section 5 of the Limitation Act, it is my understanding that the claimant is no longer able to take any court action against me to recover the alleged amount claimed.

4. I also submit that the OFT say under their Debt Collection Guidance on statute barred debt that

"it is unfair to pursue the debt if the debtor has heard nothing from the creditor during the relevant limitation period".

 

The OFT Debt Collection Guidance states further that

"continuing to press for payment after a debtor has stated that they will not be paying a debt because it is statute barred could amount to harassment contrary to section 40 (1) of the Administration of Justice Act 1970".

I also submit that I attach evidence that proves that HFO Capital Limited allegedly purchases delinquent and statute barred debts from credit companies and allegedly harasses consumers into believing that they are not statute barred. They then instruct solicitors, Turnbull Rutherford, who are in actual fact allegedly associated with the claimant companies themselves.

 

5. The statement in the Claimant’s particulars of claim in untrue and fabricated as no written or verbal requests have been made from the original claimant since 2004 and the claimed assigners HFO have not contacted myself during this period also. If the claimant claims as stated in paragraph 6 of their particulars of claim statement, then we submit that evidence in the form of signed delivery confirmations as acknowledgements, and recorded telephone conversations be submitted as evidence to substantiate their claim.

 

6. The client’s representatives have been sent a letter stating that the claim is statute barred. This is an effort to reduce not only my legal costs but also theirs as the claim is unfounded and unenforceable and if the matter proceeds to a hearing then further costs shall be applicable and claimable.

 

7. Hence we request the court that the claim is dismissed under section 5 of the Limitation Act 1980 as the particulars in the statement submitted by the claimant’s representatives is unfair and unfounded.

 

I confirm that the facts and contents of this statement are true to the best of my knowledge and belief and I understand and agree with its contents. I understand that it shall be rendered as evidence in this matter.

 

 

Date: 23rd May 2011

 

 

18th June 2011

 

Turnbull Rutherford Solicitors

165 The Broadway

Wimbledon

W19 1NE

 

(Service via fax as no stipulation that recipients do not deem service via fax)

 

Dear Sirs;

 

Claim no:

 

I write to acknowledge receipt of your letter dated 17th June 2011 and enclosed ‘statements’.

 

In response to your letter I do not acknowledge payments and request that the documents are authenticated and genuine, as they are not official statements. Such statements can be drawn by computer software. Hence I submit that the debt is statute barred and hence not enforceable. I also request that these documents are verified and proven by yourselves as authentic.

 

Also as you state in your particulars of claim; I entered into an agreement with the original creditor, please forward me a true copy of agreement, signed by myself.

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of each of the following document mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

 

1. The agreement.

 

You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

Also as the case is based on an agreement, which was entered into prior to when s15 CCA came into force, hence without a signed credit agreement the debt is unenforceable.

 

2. The default notice

 

As the case has not been allocated to a track hence in consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect at this moment in time and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise.

 

You should ensure compliance with its CPR 31 duties and ensure that the documents I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter.

 

3. Evidence of debtor

 

Please provide evidence of the debtor named on the statements with association with my name, which has a different surname. Please also note I am not Mrs. As you state on your correspondence hence please amend your records accordingly.

 

Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, they will have a right to possession of that document if it has been mentioned in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

 

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s), which are now in the possession of a third party.

 

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

 

I anticipate the above requested documents to be forwarded to me at your earliest convenience.

 

20th June 2011

 

Turnbull Rutherford Solicitors

165 The Broadway

Wimbledon

W19 1NE

 

(Service via fax as no stipulation that recipients do not deem service via fax)

 

Dear Sirs;

 

Claim no:

 

Further to my fax dated 18th June 2011, in which I have requested documents as per CPR 31.14; I also request that the following documents are sent to me as they have been relied upon in your claim;

 

1.The ‘intra group sale agreement’ that you refer to in paragraph 2 of your particulars of claim.

 

2. The credit agreement dated 31st July 1999, which you refer to in paragraph 3 of your particulars of claim.

 

3. The notice of assignment, which you refer to in paragraph 5 of your claim.

 

4. Recorded conversations and written correspondence referred to in paragraph 6 of your claim.

 

5. A copy of the deed of assignment of the debt in dispute.

 

6. Any documents, which you rely on in respect of your claim.

 

I write to acknowledge receipt of your letter dated 17th June 2011 and enclosed ‘statements’.

 

 

You should ensure compliance with its CPR 31 duties and ensure that the documents I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter.

the purpose of this case.

 

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s), which are now in the possession of a third party.

 

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

 

I anticipate the above requested documents to be forwarded to me at your earliest convenience.

 

Yours faithfully

[wunder]

I did not state that the grounds may be amended but if there was such a case would not the court let me submit my defence before a hearing?

[DonkeyB]

We need to see the full PoC. Pointless without it. Because the PoC is what you respond to as a defence, not what you perceive to be their shortcomings generally. The rest goes in a WS.

[broken arrow]

Yes can you type out the POC.also phone Barclaycard and ask to who and when the account was sold, Tel 0844 556 0066 whatever they inform you ask for in writing aswell.

[wunder]

The POC is as follows;

 

1. The claimant is engaged in the business of purchasing debt and purchases debt from various lenders. The claimant's group company, HFO Capital Limited, incorporated under the laws of the Cayman Islands with the company registration number MC-138277 ("HFO Cayman") purchased the Defendant's account and all rights and benefits attaching thereto from Barclaycard ("the Original Lender") on 18th July 2007.

 

2. The Defendant's account was subsequently transferred to the Claimant pursuant to an intra-group sale agreement dated 31st January 2008.

 

3. The Claimant's claim for the monies owed under an interest bearing agreement dated 31st July 1999 ("the Credit Agreement"), which is regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, between the defendant and the Original Lender, the debt due there under having being assigned to the Claimant.

 

4. Under the Credit Agreement the said sum was to be repaid by the Defendant by way of monthly installments. The Defendant has defaulted on payment and is in breach of the payment clause of the Credit Agreement.

 

5. In compliance with section 136 of the Law of Property Act 1925, the Defendant was given written notice of assignment of the Defendant's account to the Claimant.

 

6. despite numerous written and verbal requests made by the Claimant's collection agents the Defendant has failed to pay the said sum and remains indebted to the Claimant.

 

7. The Claimant is entitled to claim contractual interest pursuant to the terms of the Credit Agreement at a rate of 17.00% per annum from the date of assignment to the date of judgment or sooner payment being at a daily rate of £1.53.

 

8. The Claimant is entitled to claim post judgment contractual interest pursuant to the terms of the Credit Agreement at a rate of 17.00% per annum.

 

9. Alternatively, pursuant to Section 69 of the County Courts Act at a rate of 8.00% per annum from the date of assignment to the date of judgment or sooner payment.

 

AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS

 

1. Principal sum of £3,276.01

 

2. Contractual interest on (1) above date of assignment to date of issue in the sum of £2,129.76.

 

3. Contractual interest on (1) above from date of judgment or earlier payment at a daily rate of £1.53.

 

4. Or, in the alternative, statutory interest pursuant to Section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 to be assessed.

 

Dated: 12 May 2011.

[DonkeyB]

Your CPR should have simply gone through that list and asked for proof of:

 

1. Proof of the purchase from Barclaycard, by way of sight of the Sale Agreement or Deed of Assignment.

 

2. A copy of this agreement between HFO Cayman and HFO Ireland.

 

3. A copy of an enforceable credit agreement, including T&Cs.

 

4. Proof of default and copy of default notice as given.

 

5. Copy of NoA and proof of sending, plus date sent.

 

6. Proof of communication – details of all letters sent and calls made, with dates.

 

7. Show me where it says this in the agreement.

 

8. Ditto.

 

9. They’re hedging their bets.

[coledog]

The POC is the standard one they are sending out.

 

is this claim for more than £5K?

[DonkeyB]

Under £5k, CD – in the PoC, I think.

[coledog]

Under £5k, CD – in the PoC, I think.

 

Got it - thanks!

[broken arrow]

Have you contacted Barclaycard yet?

[broken arrow]

Have you contacted Barclaycard yet?

 

Could be important................

[wunder]

Yes contacted Barclays card, apparently a payment was made in April 2006, card has not been used since June 2004. Debt was sold to HFO Capital on 27.06.07, the postal address I was given was sane as Turnbulls!

 

I have further to my CPR request request documents as DonkeyB has advised. I realised when I read the POC and sent further correspondence. Any advice please?

 

Sorry for the delay in replying, I didn't realise the thread had gone to another new page and I was refreshing the last one

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Have they given any information on who made the payment and by what method?

[wunder]

Have they given any information on who made the payment and by what method?

 

No none at all. I appreciate the support on this from everyone.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

I am always very suspicious of one off payments that seem to

pop up at point that is so close to the likely hood of stat barred stat barred status

is looming.

I would want strict proof of who made the payment and by what means.