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    • Is all of this actually on the signage? Don't remember seeing that much detail on other threads.
    • If I have learnt one thing from this forum, it's not to call and communicate via email. I passed this info on to her and they are pushing for her to call them.    "Unfortunately, you will need to call us. The conversation won’t be so black and white as to therefore type over email. In a nutshell we can confirm that the request to not pay for 3 months we cannot put in place"  I emailed them back on her behalf and said that what ever is discussed over the phone will need to be put in an email so that she can review it properly. No decisions will be made on that phone call.    "Once we speak to you on the phone we will follow up with an email to confirm the options discussed. [Phone number]"   Why are they pushing for a phone call? If its not so black and white, why can they then follow up with an email?  
    • Appreciate input Andy, updated: IN THE ******** County Court Claim No. [***] BETWEEN: LC Asset 2 S.A.R.L CLAIMANT AND [***] DEFENDANT ************ _________________________ ________ WITNESS STATEMENT OF [***] _________________________ ________ I, [***], being the Defendant in this case will state as follows;     I make this Witness Statement in support of my defence in this claim.   1. I understand that the claimant is an Assignee, a buyer of defunct or bad debts, which are bought on mass portfolios at a much-reduced cost to the amount claimed and which the original creditors have already written off as a capital loss and claimed against taxable income as confirmed in the claimant’s witness statement exhibit by way of the Deed of Assignment. As an assignee or creditor as defined in section 189 of the CCA this applies to this new requirement on assignment of rights. This means that when an assignee purchases debts (or otherwise acquires rights under a credit agreement) it also acquires certain obligations to the borrower including the duty to comply with CCA requirements (such as the rules on statements and notices and other post-contractual information). The assignee becomes the creditor under the agreement. This ensures that essential consumer protections under the CCA cannot be circumvented by assigning the debt to a third party. 2. The Claim relates to an alleged Credit Card agreement between the Defendant and Bank of Scotland plc. Save insofar of any admittance it is accepted that the Defendant has had contractual agreements with Bank of Scotland plc in the past, the Defendant is unaware as to what alleged debt the Claimant refers. The Defendant has not entered any contract with the Claimant. 3. The Defendant requested a copy of the CCA on the 24/12/2022 along with the standard fee of £1.00 postal order, to which the defendant received a reply from the Claimant dated 06/02/2023. To this date, the Claimant has failed to disclose a valid agreement and proof as per their claim that this is enforceable, that Default Notice and Notice of Assignment were sent to and received by the Defendant, on which their claim relies. The Claimant is put to strict proof to verify and confirm that the exhibit *** is a true copy of the agreement and are the true Terms and Conditions as issued at the time of inception of the online application and execution of the agreement. 4. Point 3 is noted. The Claimant pleads that a default notice has been served upon the defendant as evidenced by Exhibit [***]. The claimant is put to strict proof to verify the service of the above in accordance with s136 and s196 Law of Property Act 1925. 5. Point 6 is noted and disputed. The Defendant cannot recall ever having received the notice of assignment as evidenced in the exhibit marked ***. The claimant is put to strict proof to verify the service of the above in accordance with s136 and s196 Law of Property Act 1925. 6. Point 11 is noted and disputed. See 3. 7. Point 12 is noted, the Defendant doesn’t recall receiving contact where documentation is provided as per the Claimants obligations under CCA. In addition, the Claimant pleads letters were sent on dates given, yet those are not the letters evidenced in their exhibits *** 8. Point 13 is noted and denied. Claimant is put to strict proof to prove allegations. 9. The Claimant did not provide a true copy of the CCA in response to the Defendants request of 21/12/2022. The Claimant further claims that the documents are sufficient to pursue a Judgement and are therefore copies of original documents in their possession. Conclusion 10. Without the Claimant providing a valid true copy of the executed Credit agreement that complies with the CCA, the Claimant has no grounds on which to enforce this alleged debt. 11. The Claimant has been unjustly enriched at the expense of the Defendant by purchasing bulk debt at a greatly reduced cost and subrogating for the original creditor in trying to recuperate the full amount of the original debt 12. The Defendant was not given ample evidence to prove the debt and therefore was not required to enter settlement negotiations. Should the debt be proved in the future, the Defendant is willing to enter such negotiations with the Claimant. On receipt of this claim I could not recall the precise details of the agreement or any debt and sought clarity from the claimant by way of a Section 78 request. The Claimant failed to comply. I can only assume as this was due to the Claimant not having any enforceable documentation and issuing a claim in hope of an undefended default judgment.   Statement of Truth I, ********, the Defendant, believe the facts stated within this Witness Statement to be true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in it’s truth. Signed: _________________________ _______ Dated: _____________________
    • Morning,  I am hoping someone can help, I am posting on behalf of my friend so I will try and provide as much info as possible.  Due health reasons, she is currently not working and unable to pay her contractual car finance payments. She emailed 247 Money and asked for a 3 month payment holiday, they refused this straight away with no reasons as to why. They have told her that instead she can make a payment of £200. She is currently getting £400+ a month ssp so this is not acceptable. She went back to them and explained she cannot make this payment and they have not offered an alternative plan. Its £200 or she falls into default.  She is now panicking as she does not want her car to be taken away. What options does she have?  Thank you, 
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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letter recevied from halifax


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Hi Adrian,

Just looking over this from every angle before we write. Need to know...

what year the account was opened..

did Robinson Way or anyone else threaten you with Court action?

Did you take out card protection?

Are there any significant unfair charges (late payment/over limit fees) on the account

Elsa x

 

PS..

Have they issued you with a formal default notice?..if so we need to see it.

If so, have they terminated or demanded the full balance?

Edited by Undercover-Elsa
More questions :-)
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Good morning Elsa

Can’t remember the year ,should I SAR ,re Robinson Way never really talked to them much ,just in there letters.

Adrian

 

re default notice ,I think they did ,will see if I can find ,No default notice,I am just wondering if it has been posted to my old address ,as it was about 2 weeks before I nofity them of my new address .

unfair charge , don't thing so

Edited by adrianenler
re question re fault notice
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Morning Adrian :)

I wouldn't bother doing a SAR yet.

I'm trying to find any possible alternative reason to keep it "in dispute", but if not no worries we'll go with their lack of original agreement.

Did you take out card insurance with them?

Default Notice may be significant, if you can find it..they often get them wrong. ;)

Elsa x

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OK, I'm trying to maintain the dispute status, but backed up with the lack of agreement argument, so something on the lines of :

 

Ref Account Number xxxxx

 

 

Dear Sir,

Thankyou for your letter of xxxx in which you state that you have discharged your obligations by supplying a reconstructed version of the agreement. For your reference I am fully aware of OFT guidelines in respect of satisfying Section 77-79 requests post the Carey Judgement. I would remind you that irrespective of legal aspects of the judgement your suitability to hold a Credit Licence is still dependant upon complying with OFT guidelines.

 

I note that you also state that you are unable to locate the original agreement.

In response, I query how you can possibly provide an accurate reconstruction, without having the original on which to base this reconstruction.

 

Your statement in your earlier letter that our procedure has always been to obtain our customers signatures to an agreement containing the prescribed terms before entering into a credit card agreement” seems very official and competent, but is undermined somewhat by the fact that your procedure at the time did not apparently extend to securely storing that agreement.

 

You imply in an earlier letter that you would provide other evidence in order to enforce via the courts.

According to the OFT, it is an unfair practice to mislead debtors into believing that a debt is enforceable or to imply that an agreement exists where it does not.

 

Acting upon advice, I requested a copy of the agreement in response to threats from debt collectors, in order to ascertain whether you or your representatives have a right to demand payment. You have not provided me with any proof that an agreement was signed by myself or that the agreement would have contained the prescribed terms, as you are unable to locate an original copy for reference.

 

I therefore feel that you have NOT legally complied with my request and clearly this account remains in dispute.

 

Even regardless of s. 77-79 compliance, obviously I cannot acknowledge a debt for which you have provided no legally enforceable documentation, and you or your representatives cannot threaten legal action in the knowledge that it cannot be taken.

If you did attempt to pursue this through the Courts it would be vigorously defended.

.

I note that you have refused to write off this debt, however for the reasons stated above I will continue to withhold payment, as is my legal right.

 

This is my final communication unless or until you provide the necessary legally compliant documentation, at which time I would of course negotiate a suitable repayment schedule.

 

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

 

 

Anyone else, feel free to suggest amendments :-)

 

Elsa x

 

Keep looking for the Default Notice, we'll deal with that seperately.

Edited by Undercover-Elsa
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Hi Elsa

Thanks for letter ,re the Default Notice ,I can't remember gettng one ,I think they may have posted it to my old address ,as it was about two weeks before I nofity them of my new address ,should I writing request a copy before I sent the above letter

 

Adrian

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  • 1 month later...

Hi all

Just to update ,received this letter in answer to my letter ,which Elsa advised me to send ,just wondering if anyone could advise me what to do next ,I’ve received letters from Robinson way ,saying that the debt has been passed to them ,your advise is much appreciate

http://s904.photobucket.com/albums/ac244/adrianenler/?action=view&current=14july2001-1.jpg&t=1282581569240#!oZZ2QQcurrentZZhttp%3A%2F%2Fs904.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fac244%2Fadrianenler%2F%3Faction%3Dview%26current%3Dhalifax20082010001.jpg%26

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ELSA....................sorry missed your question................I should have been a little more specific...........send the site" account in dispute" letter but make the 1st line "As by your own admission you do not have an agreement which underpins the account in dispute,and on this basis I do not acknowledge any debt..............take your point on the stupid judgement,I have found this approach slows them down and as you have said,no agreement if it goes to court good chance of winning against creditor..............regards FS

Edited by firstship
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Morning Folks,

Their letter of response is basically templated as they have got wise to CCA requests and their limitations since the Carey judgement, and obviously found someone who can do joined up writing to formulate a response.

You're in the twilight zone now, as are many of us. They've stated no signed agreement can be found, but they won't accept that it's therefore unenforceable. I'm suprised they didn't quote Carey at you. However, if they did the response would be that the judge in Carey also ruled that if an agreement has been varied since inception, then a copy of the EXECUTED agreement would be required if court action was taken. ;-)

Sit it out now. If Robbers Way get too persistant,and actually threaten legal action, just write and tell them that Halifax have confirmed that they are unable to locate the signed agreement and it is against OFT debt collection guidelines to threaten legal action in the knowledge that none can be taken...so take a hike :-)

Firstship...no probs! :-)

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  • 1 month later...

Hi All

Just to keep all up to date ,received letter today 20th from Moorcroft informing of intended litigation ,it gives me till the 22nd, to reach agreement ,the letter is dated 15th. was just going to send them copy of above letter.

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