HELP!!! - County Court Claim Received for Debt Sold 10 years after Default**CASE NOW STAYED **

[SF2010]

I have a debt which dates back to 1997 for £7,000 with Abbey National. I had a payment arrangement with Credit Security Ltd for which I had an agreed payment of £1 due to severe financial difficulties. I was paying this regularly and re-addressed my debts with the assistance of the Consumer Credit Counselling Service in 2004 after seperation from my partner, left with 2 children. At this point the debt was no longer legally entitled to be recorded on my credit file, but I was determined to do what I could to pay all of my debts off. I again established a £1.00 token payment agreement with CSL. Out of the blue I received a photocopied letter from Link Financial Outsourcing dated 21 August 07, stating they have previously written to me about this account, along with a photocopy of 2 letters dated 09 May 07. 1 was saying that they had bought the debt and the other copy was of a letter from Abbey saying that they had sold the debt to Link on 31 Jan 07. Neither of which were received. The Abbey letter was dated the same 09 May 07 as was the copied Link letter and was not sent to me directly by Abbey, though it showed my name and address.

 

I wrote promptly to advise them that I had not received any previous letters as enclosed. I had an agreement with CSL and was not aware that it had been sold. I provided them a copy of my financial statement, offered the £1 payment which I could not increase, gave them the CCCS reference no. etc. I also asked for the details of where to pay, but didnt send a £1 payment (my stupid error). No reponse at all!

 

I then received another letter on 29 May 2010, but dated 20 May 2010 entitled letter before action stating court proceedings would commence without further notice if payment wasnt made in full within 14 days. I again wrote to them to advise that they had not responded to my previous letter and again provided my financial statement and a £1 token payment. This was sent on 1 June, recorded delivery. I received a court claim form dated 07 June on Wednesday with £2,500 interest added. I also received a letter from link dated 7 June saying I had incurred a litigation charge applied to my account on 06/06/10. I have had no other default sum notices from Link as the debt was defaulted, maybe 10 years or more ago. I contacted Link to ask if they had received my letter and was told that they do not respond to letters as they are a telephony service and they only do litigation, not payment arrangements. They would let the courts sort it out. There is something rather dubious about this companies actions and the time span within which they have taken to act and not responded to any of my letters.

 

Can anyone help with advice about what to do please? Any links would be really helpful too.

 

Desperate SF2010.

[SOD'EM]

Hello SF2010,

 

This needs to be in the debt forums. A moderator will be along and will transfer it for you.

 

What you can do though (straight away) is send them a CCA letter along with a postal order for £1 for admin costs. That is a letter asking them for a copy of the original credit agreement as without that, the debt is unenforceable. The chances of them producing this from 1997 is about as likely as England winning the world cup this year:p.

 

You should be able to respond to the court letter online with a simple statement explaining that they have ignored previous correspondence (I would presume you have copies of letters you have sent them to back that up). The court then will give them time to respond.

 

Here is a link to a template letter for you to send (you only have to edit it with your details). The chances are, they will see that and run a mile.

 

 

http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/86-debt-collectors/581-cca-request-letter

 

 

I wouldn't worry too much about this though;)

[maroondevo52]

Hello and Welcome,

 

What was the debt, Bank account, loan ect ?

 

Was there ever a period of 6 years when no acknowledgement or payment was made towards it.

 

I've merged both your threads and unapproved the duplicate.

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[harrassed senior]

As suggested it is very important that you send off the CCA Request ASAP

 

Send them a CCA request to see if they are entitled to collect this debt & if it's enforcable. If they fail to provide it within 12+2 days or the CCA is unenforcable you can legally withold any payment until they do. Send it recorded delivery enclosing a £1 postal order. When you get a reply, scan it & remove any identifying details and post it back here where we can have a look at it. We'll advise you from there;

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re:- Account No: XXXXXXXX/Your Reference Number: XXXXXXX

 

This letter is a formal request pursuant to s.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide.

 

I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit. You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request, the provisions of s.77 will apply.

 

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

 

Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection From Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

If you intend to send a reconstituted copy of the CCA you must declare the reason why it has been reconstituted and if the original exists and in what form (microfiche) etc

 

 

I enclose a postal order in the sum of £1.00, which is the statutory fee. Note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose.

 

If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee.

(Optional)

You should also note that I will only discuss this matter in writing and should it be your intention to arrange a “doorstep call”, please be advised that under OFT rules, you can only visit me at my home if you make an appointment and I have no wish to make an appointment with you or any of your associates.

 

There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.). Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your representatives to visit me at my property and if you do so, then you will be liable to damages for a tort of trespass and action will be taken, including but not limited to, police attendance. (Optional)

 

I look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully **Edit to suit**

Print name do not sign

 

 

You state that you have received a claims pack so you will have the relevant defence/counterclaim forms to complete as suggested above.

 

You could also send the following to whoever issued the Claim:

 

REQUEST FOR INFORMATION UNDER THE Civil Procedure RULES.

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

I have received the Court claim filed by your Company. To enable me to file a defence and counter-claim, I require specific information regarding the account to be provided forthwith. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below. The information must be furnished by the **DATE**, which gives you ten days to provide what has been requested. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this letter will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.

 

1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened.

2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:

a. A transcript of all transactions, including charges, fees, interest, repayments and payments and both the original amount of the loan and any repayments made to it the account.

b. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations

c. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account formerly held with **CREDITOR**.

d. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

e. Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).

f. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

g. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

h. A genuine copy of any deed of assignment, or proof that you have a legal right to this money.

i. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

j. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

 

3. Any other documents you seek to rely on in court.

4. A copy of your complaints procedure, as required by the Consumer Credit Act 2006.

5. Clarification of the date you acquired the debt, what organisation you acquired it from, their registered office, their company number (if any) and what legal title they had to this debt, and what credit license number they had at the time that the debt was purchased or entered into.

 

I will require this information within the next ten days. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, it will be reported to the Court that you are trying to frustrate proceedings and denying me the opportunity to file a defence and counter claim.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I await your response.

 

Others will be along to suggest alternative, or different approaches, so help will be on the way.

[harrassed senior]

Forgot to add, to not speak to any of the companies over the telephone now, insist that everything is in writing.

[maroondevo52]

It would help if we knew what the debt was

[SF2010]

Thank you so much! It is a bank loan and I'm thankful for you transferring this to the correct area. To say Im relieved by your response is a massive understatement. I will be sending the letter to them first thing on Monday when the post office is open again.

 

I assume I have to wait the 14 days for a reply before sending my defence to the courts!

 

Many, many thanks and although may seem inappropriate, a thousand kisses!

 

SF2010

[cerberusalert]

Have you received any court papers or was it just a letter before action?

[SF2010]

Harrassed Senior, I dont know how to tip your scale, but would glady do so if you let me know!

 

Thank your for such a quick response. Ive been on here for hours, as I didnt know how to post a message.

 

SF2010

[SF2010]

I have received county court claim form, disputed the whole claim and acknowledged receipt so that I can prepare my defence in 28 days.

[SF2010]

maroondevo52 there was never a time when 6 years have passed without payment. The last payment sent was in January 2007 to CSL.

[SOD'EM]

Harrassed Senior, I dont know how to tip your scale, but would glady do so if you let me know!

 

Thank your for such a quick response. Ive been on here for hours, as I didnt know how to post a message.

 

SF2010

 

 

SF2010, the scales are on the left next to the red triangle.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[harrassed senior]

Hi, thank you, have been in some awful situations myself so know what it is like to finally find this site, I think I can honestly say it was a lifesaver, and I like to give back with all the information I have learnt both in life and from my friends on this site.

 

I think you click on the scales on the left under my name and that will take you to where you can leave your comment:)

[pumpytums]

Sink have started buying debts that are quite old they then send letters stating that the debt was assigned years ago. They us the company name Link Financial Outsourcing Limited this company neither existed or had a consumer credit license prior to late 2009. This appears to be their latest method at ramping up the debts as they claim 8% interest between assignment and judgment.

You need to get the comms log from the original creditor, and try any which way to see the deed of assignment.

 

The notice of assignment they send is immaterial and does not prove anything, the deed is a legal document.

 

Pumpytums

[SF2010]

Thanks Sod Em and Harrassed Senior, I have tipped your scales.

 

Popytums your too! I am very touched by the help I have received as I really thought my life was over after trying so hard to be decent, making many sacrifices and bringing up my 2 children alone.

 

I will be back to check my post tomorrow as Ive been on here since 9am, such was my despair.

 

All of you................ THANKS SO MUCH !

 

I'll be back, so keep the advice coming!

 

SF2010

[SF2010]

One last thing, do I use my orginal account details? On the SAR template request, it doesnt doesnt seem to provide a space for any of my particulars, such as DOB or the account details. Should I add this to the letter to Abbey and should I explicitly asked for the deed of assignment.

[SOD'EM]

The CCA request needs to go to Link, as they are chasing you. It's up to them to go to Abbey for anything. (This just makes it more probable they will come up with nothing).

[pumpytums]

Thanks Sod Em and Harrassed Senior, I have tipped your scales.

 

Popytums your too! I am very touched by the help I have received as I really thought my life was over after trying so hard to be decent, making many sacrifices and bringing up my 2 children alone.

 

I will be back to check my post tomorrow as Ive been on here since 9am, such was my despair.

 

All of you................ THANKS SO MUCH !

 

I'll be back, so keep the advice coming!

 

SF2010

 

 

More than glad to help,

the SAR won't show the deed that will be at the court stage. Have you sent a CPR 31.14 and a CPR 18 to sink yet?

 

In the Northampton County Court

Link Financial LIMITED -v- (YOUR NAME)

Claim Number: CLAIM NUMBER

 

 

Dear Sir,

 

REQUEST FOR INFORMATION CPR 18

 

I have received a recent court claim from your organisation. In order to file a defence and counter claim I require some information. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below.

 

The information must be furnished within fourteen days of the receipt of this letter. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this letter will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.

 

1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened.

2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:

 

a. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company, or by any previous creditor

b. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account formerly held with (ORIGINAL CREDITOR NAME)

c. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

d.Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).

e. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

f. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

g. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

h. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

i. Copies of statements for the entire duration of the credit agreement.

 

3. Any other documents you seek to rely on in court.

 

 

I will require this information within the next fourteen days. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, it will be reported to the Court that you are trying to frustrate proceedings and denying me the opportunity to file a defence and counter claim.

 

Yours faithfully

 

In the Northampton County Court

Link Financial LIMITED -v- (YOUR NAME)

Claim Number: (CLAIM NUMBER)

 

Dear Sir,

 

CPR 31.14 Request

 

On (DATE)9 I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the Northampton County Court.

 

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

 

Prior to the issue of proceedings I had delivered a request for the production of the full agreement mentioned in the Claim Form and on which you rely. That request was ignored

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of each of the following documents mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

 

1 the agreement. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

2 the assignment

 

3 the default notice

 

4 the termination notice

 

5 statements for the full duration of the agreement

 

 

(Although your claim is for a sum which is not more than £5,000.00 and will in all likelihood be allocated to the small claims track for determination upon my delivering a defence, at this moment in time I have not delivered my defence and the case has not been allocated to a track. In consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise) DELETE THIS IF OVER £5000

 

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the documents. I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

 

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

 

 

 

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

 

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

Print them on separate sheets print you name send them Special delivery or recorded, special is best definitive delivery recorded sometime doesn't get signed for.

 

 

hope this helps

 

 

Pumpytums

[SF2010]

Pumpytums Im back! As my email showed you have very kindly posted me more help. I have the CPR 18 ready, but not the CPR 31.14.

 

There is only one concern with the latter as it states: Prior to the issue of proceedings I had delivered a request for the production of the full agreement mentioned in the Claim Form and on which you rely. That request was ignored.

 

I did send letters, but these were advising them of not knowing that my debt had been sold to them and providing details of the agreement I had with the other DCA and my financial statement with token payment offer and request for details to pay the token, but had no response. I didnt know until today that I could ask for copies of the original agreement. I genuinely dont remember those details and had acted out of fear, rather than challenge what they were saying (until now that is).

 

Is that sufficient to leave that part in, or should I take it out before sending?

 

Kind regards

 

SF2010

[SF2010]

Thanks Sod Em !!!! Will follow that advice.

[pumpytums]

Hi SF2010,

you can leave that part out then.

 

So to recap:-

 

1. SAR to abbey £10 payment (recorded)(they have 40 days to reply)

 

2. CPR 31.14 & CPR 18 to Sink (Special delivery if you can afford it otherwise recorded)

 

3. CCA request to sink with a £1 send it recorded.(they have 12 days to reply)

 

4. Acknowledgement to court done

 

 

Sink probably wont reply to your CPR's so you have to file an embarrassed defense. This is basically when the Claimant has not supplied you with enough information to defend. Sink just go for the jugular they rely on 99% of people not defending. After you file your defense they will send a letter asking you to withdraw it and giving you the offer to accept liability of everything which is nice of them. Just keep it.

 

Keep us informed of letters from Sink lets stop Mr B getting himself a new hot-tub.

 

Out of interest is the claim for more than £5k minus the interest they have added?

 

Have a read up on embarrassed defenses if you want it's pretty straightforward. There is one on my thread Pumpytums goes to Northampton.

 

Just click my name and click the show all threads started link.

 

You want to be filing your defense online 28 days from when you received the claim. If you have any doubts about the date ring the court up they will help you with dates.

 

Have you any paperwork from abbey like a default notice for example?

 

I hope this helps

 

Pumpytums

Edited June 13, 2010 by pumpytums

[pumpytums]

one more think click the red triangle and ask this thread to be moved to the legal section also as for the name to be changed if you want to include Link.

 

This will bring some of the big guns on this site to notice your thread.

 

HELP!!! - County Court Claim Received for Debt Sold to Link 10 years after Default

 

 

Pumpytums

[SF2010]

Hi Pumpytums

 

Thanks again. All actions taken today, though couldnt stretch to Special Delivery, I did do recorded. The debt was for more than £5,000 before interest, it was £7,000 with a whopping £2,500 added as interest for the court claim.

 

I dont have the default notice from Abbey as it was so long ago.

 

I will look on your thread at your embarrassed defence.

 

I cannot thank you and everyone on here enough for the help you have given. I too have decided to give back in the employment forum as I do have specialist knowledge to be able to give advice there. It will take some time for me to get used to naviagting around here, but I have realised that there can be great power in numbers!

 

SF2010

[SF2010]

All, I sent my documents off today by recorded delivery!!!! . I have been advised to send an embarrassing defence to the courts if they dont reply within the next 14 working days (Thanks Pumpytums!). I'll be straight back if they do though as I am now much more aware of how despicable they are.

 

Im amazed at how they are getting away with these things, especially when they do bulk court claims and bulk default notices. I thought the courts would become aware of their dodgy dealings and do something about it. I suspect that I am very naive. I always thought the FSA jumps on things like this. Who should I complain to when this is over?

 

SF2010

Edited June 14, 2010 by SF2010

[SF2010]

Advice Please !!!!!

 

I sent the following to Link on 14 June recorded delivery:

 

CPR 31.14 (7 day response time)

CPR 18 (10 day response time)

CCA request to sink with a £1 postal order (12 working days response time).

 

I also sent the acknowledgement to court on 12 June, disputing the entire claim which gives me 28 days to respond.

 

 

I received a letter from Link today dated 17 June 10. It states the following:

 

Dear Ms XXXX

 

You have recently made a request under Section 77/78 for copies of various documents.

 

As you are aware LINK FINANCIAL purchased your debt ABBEY NATIONAL PLC on 31 January 2007 and as such we do not always hold this documentation. We have requested a copy of the agreement and the most recent terms and conditions your account was operated under from ABBEY NATIONAL PLC and look forward to sending this to you in the near future, however please be advised that this can take up to 30 days to provide.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

Link Financial Outsourcing Limited

 

They have not acknowledged CPR 31.14 or CPR 18 in this letter. They have not stated that they are allowing me an extra 14 days to prepare my defence as requested in the CPR 31.14.

 

I have prepared my embarrassed defence and just want to check if this response is something that I can ignore as the statutory response time is 12 working days under section 77/78 and to which the response letter specifically refers.

 

Also, just to be on the safe side, can I just ask for confirmation that my date calculations for presenting the embarrassed defence to the court is correct? I sent an acknowledgement of service online on 12 June, so my defence to the court needs to be provided by 10 July?

 

I sent the section 77/78 request on 14 June, so I can send the embarrassed defence on 01 July (or is it the 2nd July, as I should allow for a day after (the 13th working day)?

 

Not sure if the response times within CPR 31.14 and CPR 18 are working days or calendar days.

 

Can you give me any advice please? Still a little scared!

 

SF2010