Letter from apex after two months

[tacklebob]

I sent a CCA request two months ago to Apex.

 

Finally I got a response and attach the document they say is the agreement.

 

Please can someone advise me on the following:

 

The document is in parts ineligible, although you can see it says on the top “application” .

 

Also worryingly some of my personal information is not correct.

 

What next?

 

Thanks.

[twofoot]

If that's your CCA and all they have they are flogging a dead horse.

 

Next time they pester you I'd be sending a letter telling them that following advice you've been given,

 

you believe this CCA to be unenforceable in court

 

and until they supply one that is enforceable you will offfer no further correspondance or payment.

[debt4get]

Your

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

Thank you for your recent letter sent to me, the contents of which are noted. I appreciate your quick response to my original letter. However, the reply received by me does not fulfill your requirements under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

The Act demands that I be supplied with a true copy of any properly executed credit agreement that exists in relation to the above account. I may ask for this on demand providing that a fee of £1.00 is paid. This fee was sent with my original letter.

My request remains outstanding. the document, like the one you sent in your reply, does not constitute a true copy of any credit agreement that may or may not have been signed by me on the opening of this alleged account. the document neither confirms that I am liable for any alleged debt to you, nor gives me any chance to evaluate whether any original agreement was ‘properly executed’

I still require you to send me a true copy of the original credit agreement that you allege exists. As you will know, under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, a judge is not permitted to make any enforcement order unless the creditor can provide a true signed copy of the original credit agreement. This means that unless you can produce such an agreement, this alleged debt is not enforceable in law.

You had until xx/xx/xxxx (12+2 working days after the request was made) to provide me with the true copy I requested. You will then be in default of my request. Any account I hold with you is now in legal dispute. Whilst the account remains in dispute, you are not permitted to ask for any payment, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you. Furthermore, whilst the dispute remains, you are not entitled to charge any interest on the account, nor make any further charges to the account. Additionally, you are not entitled to register any information on this account with any credit reference agency.

To register information with a credit reference agency, you must have written consent from the customer to collate and share such information. This consent is given in the form of a signed credit agreement, so until you produce such an agreement, you may not do this.

The requirement for consent to share data is a clear requirement of the Data Protection Act 1998. Any such attempts to share my data without my consent will be met with a complaint to the Information Commissioners Office the time limits, which are laid down in the Consumer Credit (Prescribed Periods for Giving Information) Regulations 1983 are clear. You must supply an executed credit agreement within 12 + 2 working days of a proper CCA request. If you fail to comply with a legitimate request the account enters a default situation.

To sum up, I will not be making any payments to you until you provide me with the document I have requested. Whilst you remain in default of my request, you are not permitted to take any action against this account. This includes adding further charges and passing any information to the credit information industry.

I expect you to write to me confirming that the account has been closed and no further action will be taken.

I look forward to your reply.

[tacklebob]

Hi,

 

I wrote a while ago to Apex with a CCA request.

 

Some time later they replied with what can best be described as a bit of paper,

saying it was my credit agreement and demanding payment.

 

It was some time ago but I did put the alleged agreement on here and was advised it was not enforceable.

 

I wrote to Apex and they said they would go back to the original owner of the debt for a copy of the agreement.

 

Today Apex have wrote again to me, again with only this "scrap of paper". a

gain demanding payment. Do I send another letter or ignore it?

[cerberusalert]

Ignore them until they contact you again saying something different.

[tacklebob]

I have now received another letter. They have admitted that they do not have a copy of the original credit agreement but they are saying because I have previously made payments to this account I am legally liable. Please can you advise further?

[cerberusalert]

The formula is simple really, even for a DCA;

 

No CCA = No Enforceable Debt.

 

It may still exist morally but legally they can do nothing.

[tacklebob]

Thank you. Do I keep ignoring or reply?

[cerberusalert]

Ignore for now.... see what other rubbish they can dream up.

[tacklebob]

I have now started receiving letters daily from Apex.

 

The one received today says I have ignored all communication.

 

This is a lie and can be proven by recorded delivery slips.

 

The worrying thing is that it says the case is been passed for pre-litigation assessment.

 

What should I do now?

 

Thanks for your help again.

[count orlok]

sounds like some pre-pubescent oik is going to do something pre-mature with your "account".

 

If i had a pound for every account i had that has gone to pre-litigation i would be able to pay all my creditors what they want.

[Sunlight]

I worry just like you but they are just trying to scare you. If they have admitted they have no CCA and you have that letter they would not go to court as they could not win. They have to have the paperwork to PROVE you owe them.

 

They know that the stress of their letters is the way they make the money.

[Pinky69]

Moorcroft have a whole pre-litigation section - and it's the downstairs lav. There is nothing Apex can do without an agreement.

[tacklebob]

Hello, please could you look at the attached letter from Apex. As I read it they are not saying they do not need a copy of the CCA but can "reconstituted one! Thay are quoting a recent court case. Can anyone advise? Thank you

[debt4get]

yep absolute rubbish

send em this

ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE

 

Date:

 

Ref:

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Thank you for your letter of xx/xx/xx, the contents of which have been noted.

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

 

On **DATE** I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8. This was signed for as delivered on the **DATE**

You have failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on **DATE** (12+2 days after you made the initial request).

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document. In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

 

Furthermore, you are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before you/your client enters into a default situation.

 

This limit has expired.

 

As you are no doubt aware section 78(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

 

(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

 

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As you have failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested. You will also be aware of the CPUTR 2008 and the OFT's guidelines on debt collection which state under the title Deceptive and/or unfair methods - Examples of unfair practices are as follows - 2.8

 

(i) - 'Failing to investigate and/or provide details as appropriate, when a debt is queried or disputed, possibly resulting in debtors being wrongly pursued'

 

(k) - 'Not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonable queried or disputed debt'

 

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

Furthermore I shall counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect.

 

This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data.

 

It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends.

 

Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY

Action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

 

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* You may not pass the account to a third party.

* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit.

You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint.

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

Yours faithfully

[tacklebob]

Hi, I have already sent that account in dispute letter. This letter is their reply.

[cerberusalert]

I'd be tempted to send them Scots letter below & see what their response is;

 

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

Thank you for your recent letter sent to me, the contents of which are noted. I appreciate your quick response to my original letter. However, the reply received by me does not fulfil your requirements under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

The Act demands that I be supplied with a true copy of any properly executed credit agreement that exists in relation to the above account. I may ask for this on demand providing that a fee of £1.00 is paid. This fee was sent with my original letter.

 

My request remains outstanding. The items you sent in your reply, does not constitute a true copy of any credit agreement that may or may not have been signed by me on the opening of this account. It neither confirms that I am liable for any alleged debt to you, nor gives me any chance to evaluate whether any original agreement was ‘properly executed’.

 

I still require you to send me a true copy of the original credit agreement that you allege exists. As you will know, under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, a judge is not permitted to make any enforcement order unless the creditor can provide a true signed copy of the original credit agreement. This means that unless you can produce such an agreement, this alleged debt is not enforceable in law.

 

You had until XX/XX/2008 to provide me with the true copy I requested. You are now in default of my request. Any account I hold with you is now in legal dispute. Whilst the account remains in dispute, you are not permitted to ask for any payment, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you. Furthermore, whilst the dispute remains, you are not entitled to charge any interest on the account, nor make any further charges to the account. Additionally, you are not entitled to register any information on this account with any credit reference agency.

 

To register information with a credit reference agency, you must have written consent from the customer to collate and share such information. This consent is given in the form of a signed credit agreement, so until you produce such an agreement, you may not do this.

 

The requirement for consent to share data is a clear requirement of the Data Protection Act 1998. any such attempts to share my data without my consent will be met with a complaint to the Information Commissioners Office

 

To sum up, I will not be making any further payments to you until you provide me with the document I have requested. Whilst you remain in default of my request, you are not permitted to take any action against this account. This includes adding further charges and passing any information to the credit reference agencies.

 

Should you not have any signed credit agreement in relation to this alleged debt, please confirm this in writing to me.

 

 

I look forward to your reply.

 

Yours faithfully

Print name do not sign

 

**amend to suit your circumstances.**

[harrassed senior]

You could also add:

 

If you intend to send a reconstituted copy of the CCA you must declare the reason why it has been reconstituted and if the original exists and in what form (microfiche) etc.