Agreement legality

[lively1996]

I have a tenant who is on an assured shorthold tenancy. I have been informed that there are other people living at the property paying the tenant rent. I am not opposed to this but the tenant should have asked permission as it was written into his AST agreement. The LA has just informed me that the washing machine that I provided has now broken and needs replacing. According to the AST I am responsible for W machine repairs or replacement. As the tenant has breached his contract by not informing me that other people are living at the property am I still liable for these repairs as the machine could have been broken by the illegal tenant.

[southoxon]

Yes you are still liable and you should deal with it to keep the balance in your favour - however I would serve a section 21 for breach on their part.

[lively1996]

Yes you are still liable and you should deal with it to keep the balance in your favour - however I would serve a section 21 for breach on their part.

 

Can you explain how replacing a washing machine and then serving a section 21 would be cost effective for the Landlord?

[southoxon]

If you're going to relet the property once you've exited the current tenant then it's going to need repair or replacement. And avoids any counter breach claims

[lively1996]

I have just read the clause that relates to the repair of the w machine and it states that I have to keep in repair and proper working order the washing machine that is included in the inventory. As there is no life left in the w machine I am liable to replace it?

[Chiro]

I have just read the clause that relates to the repair of the w machine and it states that I have to keep in repair and proper working order the washing machine that is included in the inventory. As there is no life left in the w machine I am liable to replace it?

 

Yes it would appear you have to meet your contractual obligations. However it appears your tenant has gone against the terms of the contract so liable to lose their deposit.

 

This is an assumption on the information here, but check your AST they signed before doing things wrong. If they have broken the agreement then you have rights of compensation. Make sure you issue the section 21, giving only the legal required notice, and verify the condition upon leaving date.

 

Most probably if you have provided a new washing machine and are in a position to retain the deposit from breach of agreement/contract this most probably cover expenses of re-advertising etc. Keep receipts. Be fair, as this will be considered if any court action is needed or taken by either party.

[bedlington83]

However it appears your tenant has gone against the terms of the contract so liable to lose their deposit.

Eh? Says who? There's nothing like this in the housing act as far as I'm aware. The deposit is there for dilapidations not for the landlord to impose fines on a whim

 

If they have broken the agreement then you have rights of compensation.

Only for any losses and, as the rent has been paid, I can't see that there have been any

[lively1996]

I am not interested in serving a section 21 on the tenant as I think this is unnecessary. My AST states that I have to keep in repair and good working order the Indesit washing machine that is listed on the Inventory. Now that the W machine that is listed on the Inventory is broken and needs replacing. Am I legally obliged to replace it I'm not really interested in whether the washine was misused as the previous tenant gave it to me as a gift so therefore I didn't pay for it, and don't usually supply a washing machine. So therefore what I received as a gift is going to cost me time and money in the long run.

[Steve__M]

Contractually speaking, if you are unable to meet your obligations by repairing the current machine, then I think you would be expected to replace it. Though other than getting irritated with you it would be hard for a tenant to get redress.

 

You might want to suggest to the tenant that you don't mind them subletting if they don't mind replacing the washing machine themselves, though. You might also want to nudge up the rent the next time you can, because like it or not, more tenants mean more costs for you in wear and tear. You can reasonably use the argument that you may not be properly insured for subletting.

 

Also, the next time the tenancy is up for renewal, you can issue a new contract without the requirement to replace the machine (Better to explicitly say that although the appliance is provided, the LL is not responsible for replacement or repair). From experience (having been phoned at 6.30 on a Sunday morning because the light bulb in the fridge had failed) it is better to reduce to a minimum your responsibility for appliances.

[Planner]

I am not interested in serving a section 21 on the tenant as I think this is unnecessary. My AST states that I have to keep in repair and good working order the Indesit washing machine that is listed on the Inventory. Now that the W machine that is listed on the Inventory is broken and needs replacing. Am I legally obliged to replace it I'm not really interested in whether the washine was misused as the previous tenant gave it to me as a gift so therefore I didn't pay for it, and don't usually supply a washing machine. So therefore what I received as a gift is going to cost me time and money in the long run.

 

No, you are not legally obliged to replace the washing machine. You are legally obliged to repair it. Very few things are 'ever beyond repair' if enough money is thrown at it, I think what you mean is that it is by your standards, 'economically beyond repair'.

 

Your choices are therefore to change your view on what is beyond repair, and repair it, or save yourself money and replace it.

 

If you dont do either, then the tenant would be likley to get the appliance repaired/replaced themselves and deduct from the rent.

[Chiro]

However it appears your tenant has gone against the terms of the contract so liable to lose their deposit.

Eh? Says who? There's nothing like this in the housing act as far as I'm aware. The deposit is there for dilapidations not for the landlord to impose fines on a whim

If they have broken the agreement then you have rights of compensation.

Only for any losses and, as the rent has been paid, I can't see that there have been any

 

Please don't quote me out of context. I clearly stated "this is an assumption" from what is shown here as I am not able to read the exact contents of the contract, nor how the deposit is affected by the contract terms, if at all.

 

If notice is given to remeove the tenant if no longer wanted due to breach of contract I fail to see the advertising costs are non-existent. As said before do not quote me out of context, as this is what I am gathering from the previous posts. What I have put is intended to help, but I have not had the opportunity to have reviewed the contractual terms.

 

Causing a conflict between members does not serve to help those here in need of help and advice. If you know something more please supply that help to those who need it without mis-quoting anyone. I'm assuming that is your intentions anyway, so don't take this reply the wrong way.

[NewSAHD]

Òn a slightly different tangent how about the following:

 

- Arrange to collect the washing machine and take it home. Advise the tenants you will arrange for a repair asap and will let them know when sorted. Obviously say that this is on a no guarantee basis, as you are still a little unhappy about the subletting, which you are considering separately, at present.

 

- Then, Google the washing machine name and work out how best to carry out some fairly basic DIY maintenance ie pipes, pumps, impellers and so on.

 

- If you can find what you need online - and with a couple of friends around if needs be (ie potential witnesses! but photographs should be sufficient) - then proceed to carry out basic maintenance tasks.

 

- Whilst you may find nothing untoward, as the machine could well be at the end of it's little white life (and so you are back to your original question), you might well find that the pipes are blocked with tissues, playpeople, plastic UFO's, broken up credit cards (sliced up as they go through the machine), colour catchers, and other assorted odds and sods.

 

If so, you can quite reasonably go back to the tenants and advise THEM that THEY broke the machine by not emptying pockets and so on.

 

Further, whilst ordinarily you would expect THEM to replace it, or deduct the cost from their deposit, the machine was a gift to you from a previous tenant, so the current tenants are off the hook - and so are you.

 

This is not meant to be some far fetched fantasy.

 

I speak from recent experience here, save that the guilty party was a three year old boy . As he's not old enough for pocket money yet, there was no chance of my deducting any monies from him!

 

Plus, try as I might, he's stuffing toys in to all his pockets, which makes remembering to check all his pockets a chore to say the least. Especially as he has TShirts with zips in too. Washing is turning in to a mix of "lucky dip" and "russian roulette" at present .

 

Moving quickly on, in the past month have now repaired the fan oven (knackered element), washing machine (seemed completely dead, turned out to be blocked pipe, see above!), am about to swop the motor in a dead Dyson, as well as swop an inverter in a laptop so that the screen can work again.

 

My DIY skills are relatively basic too, but all this was quite easy - and has saved call outs and the cost of new appliances. Except the Dyson, which I was fed up with anyway; it's been replaced by a Miele, which has been brilliant, so far.

 

Sorry, just realised have gone from Consumer Action Group to Consumer Appliances Group

 

Just a thought though and, more seriously, might be worth a punt too.

Edited January 19, 2010 by NewSAHD
typos

[bedlington83]

Please don't quote me out of context. I clearly stated "this is an assumption" from what is shown here as I am not able to read the exact contents of the contract, nor how the deposit is affected by the contract terms, if at all.

I'm not quoting you out of context. You clearly said "your tenant has gone against the terms of the contract so liable to lose their deposit". This is nonsense regardless of what the contract says. Prefixing your advice with "this is an assumption" doesn't absolve you of responsibility for getting it wrong. If you don't know what you're talking about its better that you don't post rather posting guesses in the guise of wisdom.

 

If notice is given to remeove the tenant if no longer wanted due to breach of contract I fail to see the advertising costs are non-existent. As said before do not quote me out of context, as this is what I am gathering from the previous posts. What I have put is intended to help, but I have not had the opportunity to have reviewed the contractual terms.

There you go again. Regardless of any additional costs due to having to let the premises early (assuming that the landlord can evict, which is far from certain), the deposit is for dilapidations only. Not for landlords to mitigate their losses. In what way am I quoting you out of context?

[Snorkerz]

Òn a slightly different tangent how about the following:

 

- Arrange to collect the washing machine and take it home. Advise the tenants you will arrange for a repair asap and will let them know when sorted. Obviously say that this is on a no guarantee basis, as you are still a little unhappy about the subletting, which you are considering separately, at present.

 

 

Sorry, just realised have gone from Consumer Action Group to Consumer Appliances Group

 

Just a thought though and, more seriously, might be worth a punt too.

 

If you take NewSAHDs' advice (and many of us will, I'm sure follow the principles at home) be aware of your electrical safety responsibilities with regard to tenants. If you're sure you are competent - then fine - otherwise, get a tradesman in

[NewSAHD]

If you take NewSAHDs' advice (and many of us will, I'm sure follow the principles at home) be aware of your electrical safety responsibilities with regard to tenants. If you're sure you are competent - then fine - otherwise, get a tradesman in

 

Snorkerz, good advice, cheers.

 

I should, perhaps, have made that a littler clearer . Snorkerz, I've seen your posts elsewhere, so cheers for stepping in too.

 

From my own personal experience I had no bother

 

- up ending the washing machine (whilst careful of H&S advice re heavy lifting),

- checking through google (beware RSI),

- washing out the pipes (a read of ROSPA's advice some years ago on drowning in shallow water was useful),

- and reminding the youngest not to stuff his pockets with plastic dinosaurs (without violating his Human Rights) .

 

Much more seriously though Snorkerz is quite right. I made an assumption in my earlier post and am happy to take this on board in future postings.