Help with Welcome Finance

[beyondhope]

Ya not wrong!!!! I wonder where everyone went!!!

[BEBOBEBO]

Is there anybody out there????? Lights are on but no one is home

[beyondhope]

Thats a perfect description of me atm

[mark1arby]

It`s normally quiet at weekends, especially Bank Holidays. All those dedicated Caggers catch up on their Forgotten Families and catch up on Much Needed Sleep!!!

[DanDesperate]

Not been on for a while.... can someone clarify is MKDP LLP or MKRR anything to do with Cattles or Welcome.

 

Asked them but they "dont think so" ..... only set up this year....

 

I have not heard from Welcome for approx 10 months.... must have been emptying filing cabinets and came across little old me LOL Pesky office clearances.....

 

Just wondered if it was one of these 1p in the pound buyer of useless debt, collection agencies..... any ideas anyone ???

[mark1arby]

Not sure myself Dan, but I did see another thread where someone confirmed that Cattles/ Welscum had created a New DCA!!! To help in their debt collection???

 

Cheers, MARK

[beyondhope]

It`s normally quiet at weekends, especially Bank Holidays. All those dedicated Caggers catch up on their Forgotten Families and catch up on Much Needed Sleep!!!

 

 

Its been quiet for agesssss lol

[beyondhope]

Not been on for a while.... can someone clarify is MKDP LLP or MKRR anything to do with Cattles or Welcome.

 

Asked them but they "dont think so" ..... only set up this year....

 

I have not heard from Welcome for approx 10 months.... must have been emptying filing cabinets and came across little old me LOL Pesky office clearances.....

 

Just wondered if it was one of these 1p in the pound buyer of useless debt, collection agencies..... any ideas anyone ???

 

 

It isnt official I dont think but I think the general consensus is yep they are welcome/cattles MKDP LLP at least

[DanDesperate]

Asked for a copy of my agreement, they said they will ask Welcome for it

Good luck it does not exist. Keep meaning to sort this out for good.... more fun going round in circles.....

 

Asked who I should mark for the attention of answer was:

 

I don't know anybodies names........

 

Asked which department, legal?, compliance?...... answer was:

 

Just send to MKRR and admin will know where to send it.....

 

From those answers it must still be Welcome / Cattles LOL

[beyondhope]

Asked for a copy of my agreement, they said they will ask Welcome for it

Good luck it does not exist. Keep meaning to sort this out for good.... more fun going round in circles.....

 

Asked who I should mark for the attention of answer was:

 

I don't know anybodies names........

 

Asked which department, legal?, compliance?...... answer was:

 

Just send to MKRR and admin will know where to send it.....

 

From those answers it must still be Welcome / Cattles LOL

 

 

HAHAHA :lol: thats fab service is that not knowing anyones names

[DanDesperate]

What is an LLP?

It is an alternative corporate business vehicle that gives the benefits of limited liability but allows its members the flexibility of organising their internal structure as a traditional partnership. The LLP is a separate legal entity and, while the LLP itself will be liable for the full extent of its assets, the liability of the members will be limited.

 

Can I convert from being a limited company to an LLP?

The LLP legislation does not allow for a 'conversion process' - in the way that a limited company can convert to PLC status under the Companies Act, for example. Anyone with a current limited company wishing to transfer their existing company name to a new LLP should contact the LLP Team Leader. The process will involve a closely controlled company change of name and an LLP incorporation. Establishing contact prior to submitting the necessary forms will help ensure that this process is completed as smoothly as possible.

 

The above seems to suggest if they are connected to Welcome / Cattles they will not admit it. They have a whole year of ducking and diving before they have to submit annual returns etc....

 

Limited liability ?? does this mean Welcome are going and handing over to a company that you cannot pursue for refund of unlawful charges etc...

 

As if a company on the scale of Welcome would deal with a totally new company (formed Oct 09 ) without an ulterior motive.

 

 

[beyondhope]

All LLP means is the top dogs cant personally be liable for any debt just like a normal limited company is/was and it can be run as a partnership like a solicitors etc would be so thats abit irrelvant really as they can still be treated like anyone else and dragged through the courts like anyone else

 

There is no doubt in my mind certain possibly now 'ex' welcome top dogs have decided to create a debt enforcement agency to pick up the slack from the demise of welcome to make themselves some money as lets face it who in their right mind would touch anything that has welcome's name attached to it!

[DanDesperate]

Does it also mean they are separate from Welcome therefor they are not responsible for the monies owed to its customers from fraudulent agreements etc...

 

They would just say your claim is with the soon to be ex Welcome but by the way you still owe £XXX

[beyondhope]

Im not sure how dodgy agreements will work i would imagine it would be a case of fight and fight until they are statute barred as its not as if welcome will be around to pass it back to. They will be totally separate from welcome anyway though.

[beyondhope]

opinions please......

 

1 more letter before action

(2 letters sent since the last one)

 

or

 

put in N1 straight away.....

 

im only thinking they havent had chance to answer the whole unlawful rescission thing as i didnt include it in my last letter would this then go against me from a judges point of view as they havent had a chance to answer for themselves....

[BEBOBEBO]

Wish I could help Beyond but I cant, I will keep you Bumped

[beyondhope]

Thank you Bebo same goes xx

[Dibbothe3rd]

Don't forget, Limited Liability does not 100% protect the Directors of a Ltd Co, or the partners of a LLP. They can be liable under certain circumstances.

 

These guys are the custodians of the business and have to act within certain rules. If they don't and they get caught they can be held personally liable to certain debts and legal action can be taken if appropriate.

 

I suppose its easier to set up an LLP than to become a director of a Ltd as I dont believe any past black marks against being a director apply to being a partner.

 

Also, Companies can be partners too.

[Dibbothe3rd]

FYI from Companies House Website

 

MKDP LLP

TRADE PRO HOUSE SEEBECK PLACE

KNOWLHILL

MILTON KEYNES

BUCKINGHAMSHIRE

MK5 8FR

 

Seems quite a few debt collectors reside here Under Tradepro name. search for Tradepro Finance Ltd and Tradepro Holdings Ltd etc.. etc..

 

also cdc Debt collections Ltd as well. Any of these ring a bell?

Edited April 5, 2010 by Dibbothe3rd
found more info

[beyondhope]

oo thanks for that dibbo defo something to be looked into!

[beyondhope]

FINAL LETTER BEFORE ACTION

Dear Sir/Madam

Re: Terminated Agreement Number:

Following your unlawful rescission of contract on 1st February 2010, which was subsequently accepted by me on 12th February 2010 and your further enforcement of repossessing a vehicle related to this no longer active agreement on 11th March 2010, I wish to draw your attention to the following.

Before a creditor or owner in the position of Welcome Financial Services can become entitled to use Section 88 and the Consumer Credit (Enforcement Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 (S/I No 1561) and (amendment) Regulations 2006 Welcome Financial Services must first serve a valid default notice. The Regulations are clearly set out in some detail, the form in which the notice must take, and what information a Default Notice must contain. In particular, Section 87 (1): The relevant parts of Section 87 (1), read as follows.

 

Section 87 (1):

"Service of a notice on the debtor or hirer in accordance with section 88 (a ´Default Notice') is necessary before the creditor or owner can become entitled, by reason of any breach by the debtor or hirer of a regulated agreement, -

 

(a) To terminate the agreement, or

 

(b) To demand earlier payment of any sum, or

 

© To recover possession of any goods.

 

(d) To treat any right conferred on the debtor or hirer by the agreement as terminated, restricted or deferred, or

 

(e) To enforce any security.

 

I now return to the facts of the Default Notice.

On 15th January 2010 Welcome Financial Services sent a Default Notice to which Welcome Financial Services contend complies with the provisions of the Consumer Credit (Enforcement Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 (S/I No 1561) and (Amendment) Regulations 2006 made there under. I do accept that in some respects the Default Notice complies with some of the statutory requirements, but I contend that the Default Notice has one critical flaw.

 

The Default Notice describes the action required to remedy the alleged breach of Agreement as "Pay the arrears of £236.49 to us within 14 days. For the purpose of doubt I shall explain why the above Default Notice falls short of the provisions of the Consumer Credit (Enforcement Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 (S/I No 1561). On the 19th December 2006 the (Amendment) Regulations 2006 came into force and amended the time scale for a Default Notice to, “Not less than fourteen days”.

 

The Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983[2] shall be amended as follows. In Schedule 2 in paragraphs 3©, 3(d) and 6 for the words "not less than seven days" substitute "not less than fourteen days".

 

With this evidence in hand I have come to the conclusion in relation to that one critical flaw, the Default Notice is non compliant.

 

The statute was plainly enacted to protect consumers. When a debtor is said to have broken the terms of an Agreement, the debtor needs to know precisely what is wrong and what is needed to put things right. The creditor has the ability and the resources to give that information with precision. If the creditor does not do so accurately then they cannot take "the next step".

 

What Welcome Financial Services has done is that they have totally missed out on TWO vital points.

 

Point 1

 

The Interpretation Act 1978 Section 7 Practice Direction, Service of Documents - First and Second Class Mail.

(a) in the case of first class mail, on the second working day after posting;

(b) in the case of second class mail, on the fourth working day after posting. "Working days" are Monday to Friday, excluding any bank holiday.

 

8th March 1985*

J R BICKFORD SMITH Senior Master

Queen's Bench Division

 

Point 2

 

Under CPR 6.26 First class post (or other service which provides for delivery on the next business day) is deemed to be “served” The second day after it was posted, left with, delivered to or collected by the relevant service provider provided that day is a business day.

 

In a nutshell Welcome Financial Services must allow for at least 2 days postage, 2 working days Monday to Friday, also allowing for any bank holidays. The Default Notice is dated 15th January 2010 and must be remedied within 14 days, what Welcome Financial Services have not taken into account is that a Default Notice has to be Date Specified and to state “within 14 days” falls very short of the statutory requirement.

 

At this point Welcome Financial Services had the opportunity to re-issue another Default Notice in compliance with the Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) (Amendment) Regulations 2006, but Welcome Financial Services did not. On the 1st February 2010 Welcome Financial Services issued a Termination Notice, the Termination Notice did not simply imply Welcome Financial Services could or would, not even we may, the Termination Notice clearly stated “YOUR HIRE PURCHASE ACCOUNT HAS NOW BEEN TERMINATED”. Upon receipt of this Termination Notice it is perfectly obvious that Welcome Financial Services had in fact relieved BOTH parties from the performance of the Agreement and all the terms and conditions with in it.

 

I am in no doubt that Welcome Financial Services are totally aware that a Default Notice must adhere to the prescribed regulations for the manner in which a Default Notice is set out and the information that a Default Notice must contain. In particular and of utmost importance a Default Notice must give a debtor an opportunity to remedy any alleged breach and give a debtor “Not less than fourteen days” from the date of service and not 14 days from the date of author in which a Debtor must do so.

 

The Consumer Credit Act gives a creditor no room for error and demands that with the financial and legal knowledge at their disposal, they should be very able to get all their documentation right or suffer the consequences.

 

The consequences of Welcome Financial Services actions are as quoted in case law an Unlawful Rescission of Contract see (Woodchester Lease Management Services Ltd v Swain and Co - [2001] GCCR 2255). Thus having unlawfully rescinded the agreement by failing to comply with the requirements of the consumer credit act Welcome Financial Services have also lost all benefits of section 87 (1): (a) To terminate the agreement, or (b) To demand earlier payment of any sum, or © To recover possession of any goods (d) To treat any right conferred on the debtor or hirer by the agreement as terminated, restricted or deferred, or (e) To enforce any security.

 

Welcome Financial Services should also be made aware that having unlawfully rescinded the agreement by failing to comply with the requirements of the consumer credit act, would not only prevent the court from enforcing any debt outstanding, A Debtor would also have a right to counter claim for any damages see( Kpohraror v Woolwich Building Society [1996] 4 All ER 119).

I am sure this plainly outlines why the agreement has been unlawfully rescinded and how you weren’t in a lawful position to repossess the vehicle related to the agreement which you endeavoured to do more than a month following termination.

This account has been plainly disputed due to incorrect prescribed terms on the agreement from November 2009, you failed to respond to all queries until 10th March 2010, this gave no time for us to come to an adequate resolution regarding your response before repossession took place as the documents were received two days following the vehicle had been taken. This situation alone has caused an unfair relationship between Welcome Financial Services and Myself and on doing so contravenes s140a of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and amendments.

I would respectfully request you look at your records to confirm what I have outlined and how you propose to remedy the situation. I would expect an adequate response outlining your intended actions and any timescale of utilising these actions within 14 days, by 9am on 20th April 2010 or you will leave me with no option but to issue court proceedings relating to the above without further notice.

Yours faithfully

[beyondhope]

opinions/adjustments/comments please

 

will be posted tomorrow!

[BEBOBEBO]

I'm no expert but to me that is very clear and concise, I think it's best to give them a chance to remedy the situation. It will also look better infront of a judge if you have shown to be fair. Good stuff beyond!

[dawnytrish]

Totally agree with Bebo.....a great letter that SHOULD8) get their attention.

 

Even I can understand that so Welcome should have no problem;-)

 

Good Luck.

Dawnx

[beyondhope]

Thanks Bebo and Dawn cant say they havent been warned I guess