GE Woodchester Car Finance loan to Link Outsourcing

[alanalana]

Hello BC,

 

Update - Received reply:-

 

 

Quote:

Thank you for your letter (date)

 

I appreciate that due to recent press coverage regarding insurance regulations and GE Money being fned by the FSA you feel that you have been mis-sold the Credit Protection Insurance on your agreement. The FSA fine, and the associated media coverage, however relates to policies purchased after 14th January 2005 when the FSA's Insurance Conduct Of Business Rules (CIOB) regulations came into force.

 

I can confirm that your policy was set up **/11/2004. As this was prior to January 2005, the FSA's decision is not relevant, but all complaints alleging that insurance may have been mis-sold are taken seriously and I have therefore full investigated all aspects of your complaint.

 

Following the acceptance of Credit Protection Insurance, a welcome pack was also issued by post, which included full policy details. This stated that the product may be cancelled within 30 days at no charge, and the policy may also be cancelled at any point throughout the agreement.

 

From our investigations we have been unable to find any evidence of mis-selling. As all information provided was correct we are therefore unable to refund the premiums paid on the account.

 

Whilst I appreciate that this may not be the outcome you were expecting, I trust that I have addressed all of the concerns that you raised. However, if you remain dissatisfied you may refer the complaint to the Finance and Leasing Association, details of which are listed below. Should you require any further information, please contact me on my number below.

Not bad a response time including weekend & allowing post time - 7day turn round. So anyone advise what if any is the next step

 

Firstly I see the bit of your CA where the Credit Protection Insurance is.

 

Secondly I also see no Signatures on the CA.

 

Have you sent a request under sections 77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 with the Statutory fee of £1.00 asking them to provide you with a valid copy of the agreement?

 

If you have, have they sent one?

 

If you have not sent one you should do so.

 

You can use this paragraph.

 

I understand that under the directions of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (Sections 77 to 78), I am entitled to receive a copy of my credit agreement on request. I enclose payment in line with Section 77 (1) in the sum of £1.00 which is the statutory figure as required under the direction of the Act.

I understand that a copy of the Consumer Credit Agreement together with any other documents referred to in it, including terms and Conditions and any other document associated with it should be supplied to me in a legible form within 12 working days.

 

Lets us then see if they can produce one.

 

aa

[beachcomber60]

Thanks aa, yes I have sent cca request, half way thro' timescale & will post as soon as received.

 

bc

[beachcomber60]

Bit of a development, dont know where I stand now regarding my claim.

 

Received a letter from them stating that as I am on a DMP they have terminated the ppi policy as they are entitled to.

[alanalana]

Hello BC,

 

Bit of a development, dont know where I stand now regarding my claim.

 

Received a letter from them stating that as I am on a DMP they have terminated the ppi policy as they are entitled to.

 

This has most likely happened because you sent a cca request and they cannot find it.

 

Ok so they terminated the PPI policy which you can replace more cheaply elsewhere. You should still pursue the claim for mis-sold PPI IMO as it is probably the addition of this expensive (useless insurance in most cases) that has meant you could not meet your payments and ended up on a DMP. I would suggest THEY CANCEL and YOU STILL CLAIM as before as mis-sold on whatever grounds you consider applicable to your own case.

 

Do not be put off claiming. Banks are fighting a rear guard action on PPI and losing big time. FSA handing out big fines, Competition Commissioners Office have ruled it is unfair to sell PPI at the point of granting a Loan. FOS upholding 80% of claims for mis-sold PPI. Office of Fair trading interested and ask for authority to pass complaints on to other regulatory bodies.

 

Please keep at them.

 

I would write back and tell them that although you are on a DMP and they have terminated your PPI you intend to continue your claim for them mis-selling PPI to you and that you will complain to all regulatory bodies as to the actions they have taken.

 

If you need templates or examples of complaint letters just look at my thread there are lots of them there.

 

If you cannot find the link it is in this forum just shout.

 

aa

Edited November 21, 2008 by alanalana
text adjustment

[beachcomber60]

I think I've upset them bigtime, I've sent off 1st letter regarding mis-sold ppi followed by cca request - they retaliated with a take a hike letter, terminated the ppi policy - this morning they sent a default demand ending my reduced payment arrangement and giving 7 days from the 22nd (?) to pay the full balance or it's court, DCA and possible charging order. They still have not supplied a cca yet.

 

I don't think they have complied in the correct manner with the default.

[beachcomber60]

Been in a payment plan with GE then found out I was paying high ppi, wrote to them to start a reclaim - told to take a hike so I requested cca. Now they have cancelled the ppi no refund, stopped my payment plan and today I received default notice giving me 7 days (letter took 6 days to reach me) to pay up or they'll take me to court and get a charging order on our house.

 

Two days left before they default to my cca request.

[fedup74]

Can you post you default notice up. I doubt it is a proper default notice. They have to give at least 14 days from receiving the notice to remedy things. Keep the envelope to prove you received it after 6 days. I would send them an SAR request to see all the details on the account and then write a letter demanding your PPI premiums back. Don't worry about the charging order threat either. They have to get a CCJ first (which you could defend) I think they have definitely threw their toys out of the pram!!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[popeye1]

DN must give you 14 days,have you kept all including what the letter came in

[beachcomber60]

Thanks, there is no date on the envelope - no stamp or post mark just has UK Mail printed on it. Will post up letter later - have to leave 'puter now have vistors.

 

Beachy

[Guest symbio-dek]

You upset GE . . . Hahahahaha......... High Five !!!

[alanalana]

Hello BC,

 

I think I've upset them bigtime, I've sent off 1st letter regarding mis-sold ppi followed by cca request - they retaliated with a take a hike letter, terminated the ppi policy - this morning they sent a default demand ending my reduced payment arrangement and giving 7 days from the 22nd (?) to pay the full balance or it's court, DCA and possible charging order. They still have not supplied a cca yet. I do believe retaliation is seriously frowned upon by OFT and FSA. They are also in breach of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 if they have not complied with your CCA request within 14 days.

I don't think they have complied in the correct manner with the default. Banker Rhymes With is familiar with defaults and may be worth asking him for some input here.

 

I would suggest you will now need assistance from the more legally minded

CAG members. There is a thread which may help you to get some advice. There are also PPI forum members with more legal knowledge than me.

 

Legal Issues

 

aa

[palomino]

Thanks, there is no date on the envelope - no stamp or post mark just has UK Mail printed on it. Will post up letter later - have to leave 'puter now have vistors.

 

UK Mail is a private mail company. I believe their service is officially the equivalent of second class post.

Hence the DN has not been properly served. This in addition to the invalid period given as noted above.

 

You can fight this!

[beachcomber60]

Thanks for all the advice aa, they maybe ahead on points in round one but I fully intend fighting this one all the way. Complaint letter going in post today along with full sar.

 

Their 12+2 days are now up with no cca so now officially in dispute (not that it'll make much difference in their actions).

 

BC

[beachcomber60]

Thanks for the advice & support, GE may be ahead on points in round one but I intend fighting this to the end.

[beachcomber60]

I have got to the bottom of this default, although I have an agreement for NDL lower payments and have been paying it for the past three months and completely up to date with payments, they defaulted the account because I have missed three contracted monthly payment of the full amounts.

 

I have been able to scan up the notice yet, but as I understand it the default notice is supposed to be laid out in a particular way as to the arrears, full balance outstanding etc. the one issued only shows the arrears.

 

I still think that all this is because I have started ppi reclaim, they were fine before this action.

[beachcomber60]

Update.

 

No response to my cca request - now formally in dispute.

 

No response regarding my rejection of their response letter re:PPI (posted on thread).

 

Standing Order received in order to continue paying reduced rate payments (NDL) automatically from bank?

Edited December 5, 2008 by beachcomber60
Spelling

[hellhasnofury]

Update.

 

No response to my cca request - no formally in dispute.

 

No response regarding my rejection of their response letter (posted on thread).

 

Standing Order received in order to continue paying reduced rate payments (NDL) automatically from bank?

 

Hello Beachcomber,

 

So what are you going to do now with the standing order;)

[beachcomber60]

TBH I dont honestly know whether to carry on making payments or to stop, if I stop then all hell will break loose if the threats I received last week is anything to go by.

 

Aint giving in regarding PPI, I think I'm in a strong position regarding this even if they produce a cca.

[hellhasnofury]

TBH I dont honestly know whether to carry on making payments or to stop, if I stop then all hell will break loose if the threats I received last week is anything to go by.

 

Aint giving in regarding PPI, I think I'm in a strong position regarding this even if they produce a cca.

 

Hello BC,

 

I know where you are coming from with this. You have choices and its your choice at the end of the day. I do think they are being rather bullyish with you, but hey is ge, we are talking about here. They are not renouned for their good customer relationship skills:rolleyes:

 

Did they send you a default notice and have you checked your credit reference file, with experian, equifax and creditcall. to see what they have put.

[beachcomber60]

Thanks HHNF, Yes they have defaulted me with this, I've been meaning to scan up the the default notices as I don't think it complies, have not checked credit file mainly because up to June this year my rating was 999/1000 but with the circumstances we have been placed in (re:employment or lack of) credit rating is shot to pieces anyway mainly because crap1 won't entertain any low payments whatsoever - but that's a different story completely.

 

Last week they were threatening dca's and charging orders now all of a sudden they sent this Standing Order form to continue paying our original pro rata payments.

[alanalana]

Hello BC,

 

TBH I dont honestly know whether to carry on making payments or to stop, if I stop then all hell will break loose if the threats I received last week is anything to go by.

If you get threats read this it will make you relax...

Robinson Way ; YET AGAIN

and when you have had a laugh then quote this to them..

Please have a look at this link harrassment is against the Law...

 

Protection from Harassment Act 1997 (c. 40)

 

These are a couple of extracts

 

you will see the law is on your side in this:-)

 

If you get more calls just quote this regulation ask for their full name as you will start legal action against them personally under this Act.

 

England and Wales

 

1 Prohibition of harassment

 

(1) A person must not pursue a course of conduct—

(a) which amounts to harassment of another, and

(b) which he knows or ought to know amounts to harassment of the other.

(2) For the purposes of this section, the person whose course of conduct is in question ought to know that it amounts to harassment of another if a reasonable person in possession of the same information would think the course of conduct amounted to harassment of the other.

(3) Subsection (1) does not apply to a course of conduct if the person who pursued it shows—

(a) that it was pursued for the purpose of preventing or detecting crime,

(b) that it was pursued under any enactment or rule of law or to comply with any condition or requirement imposed by any person under any enactment, or

© that in the particular circumstances the pursuit of the course of conduct was reasonable. IMO none of this would apply to DCA's phone calls.

2 Offence of harassment

 

(1) A person who pursues a course of conduct in breach of section 1 is guilty of an offence.

(2) A person guilty of an offence under this section is liable on summary conviction to imprisonment for a term not exceeding six months, or a fine not exceeding level 5 on the standard scale, or both.

(3) In section 24(2) of the [1984 c. 60.] Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984 (arrestable offences), after paragraph (m) there is inserted—

“(n) an offence under section 2 of the Protection from Harassment Act 1997 (harassment).”.

3 Civil remedy

 

(1) An actual or apprehended breach of section 1 may be the subject of a claim in civil proceedings by the person who is or may be the victim of the course of conduct in question.

(2) On such a claim, damages may be awarded for (among other things) any anxiety caused by the harassment and any financial loss resulting from the harassment.

 

Do not fear these People they are in the wrong to harrass

 

I will catch up more with your thread later.

hhnf thanks for helping out here;)

aa

 

 

 

Aint giving in regarding PPI, I think I'm in a strong position regarding this even if they produce a cca

[beachcomber60]

Well I have received my copy of the agreement, duly signed - Bu##er!

 

 

On the Agreement the financial details are stated as thus-

Amount of Loan £10,345.04

Administration Fee £ 0.00

Total Charge for Credit £ 3,624.16

Total Amount Payable £13,969.20

 

 

HOWEVER, they also included a customer statement of all payments made and the financial details are stated as :-

Amount of Loan £10,345.04

Administration Fee £ 0.00

Total Charge for Credit £ 3,624.16

Insurance Premium £ 1,969.77

Total Repayable £15,938.97

 

Surely I am only liable for the total amount payable under the signed agreement, nowhere does it state ppi is included or excluded on the agreement adding to my theory that it was added after being signed.

 

Sorry having afew problems with the scanner software at the moment, will scan up when I can fix the problem.

[alanalana]

Hello BC,

 

Well I have received my copy of the agreement, duly signed - Bu##er! Is this Butter, Bummer, or something else:D

 

On the Agreement the financial details are stated as thus-

Amount of Loan £10,345.04

Administration Fee £ 0.00

Total Charge for Credit £ 3,624.16

Total Amount Payable £13,969.20

 

 

HOWEVER, they also included a customer statement of all payments made and the financial details are stated as :-

Amount of Loan £10,345.04

Administration Fee £ 0.00

Total Charge for Credit £ 3,624.16

Insurance Premium £ 1,969.77 This is the amount you require to be refunded plus an element of the Total charge for credit which will include the interest on the Insurance premium.

Total Repayable £15,938.97 This figure will include the Loan £10,345.04 plus the Insurance Premium £1,969.77 plus the interest on both at whatever APR they apply to the loan.

 

 

You should be asking for a refund of the Insurance Premium Plus the interest on that premium Plus 8% Statutory Interest on both. They should work out what they owe you and make an offer or suggest the FOS as the next course of action..

 

If you claim this back and get no response submit a claim to the FOS in the first instant and then proceed to Court action if the FOS do not uphold your complaint.

 

 

Surely I am only liable for the total amount payable under the signed agreement, nowhere does it state ppi is included or excluded on the agreement adding to my theory that it was added after being signed.

If this is the case then yes, no PPI on the agreement then claim for mis-selling or failure to comply with the terms of the Consumeer Credit Agreement 1998

 

Sorry having afew problems with the scanner software at the moment, will scan up when I can fix the problem.

 

Hope this helps out

 

aa

Edited December 10, 2008 by alanalana
text and spelling

[hellhasnofury]

Hello Beachcomer,

 

I thought you mean't bugg*r:D but maybe a bit prematurely.

 

If on your credit agreement you have not signed to agree for ppi, and there is no mention of ppi, well they should not have taken it:D They can't give you an agreement to sign stating what you have both agreed and then take payment on top for ppi.

 

They have given you all the evidence you need there with these documents:D

 

Get on to them pronto

 

Just had a quick look throught your thread again. In the earlier post there is a scanned copy of a credit agreement that they sent you and as you have stated the ppi box is pre-ticked and there is no signatures.

 

Is this what they sent you under your SAR or a section 77/78 request????????? and now they have sent you the original??? with a statement of account

 

Can you fill us in please

Edited December 11, 2008 by hellhasnofury

[beachcomber60]

Well finally got the scanner working, so am able to update with cca, I am of the opinion that they have altered the cca after I initially returned the cca after signing.

 

Scan 1 is the cca that I received after taking out the loan, this agreement was signed (seperate page that I have not scanned up as there is no relevent details on it apart from theirs and my signature and no mention of ppi at all).

 

Scan 2 is what they have supplied following my CCA request, you will notice that in the Financial Details someone has written N/A, this was done AFTER document was returned to them.

 

Scan 3 is Statement of account, you will see that the financial details has grown by nearly two grand from the original document.

 

Any thoughts on these documents would be welcomed, 1) does this improve my chances of reclaiming PPI, 2) because they have altered the CCA after being returned at the start of the loan (and has only just come to my attention following my cca request) does this invalidate the agreement due to altering the document without informing me.

 

They have terminated the PPI because Iam on a DMP, have charged £108 to the account for administration.

 

 

Scan 1

 

 

 

 

Scan 2

 

 

 

 

Scan 3

 

 

 

 

Thanks for looking

 

Beachy

Edited December 11, 2008 by beachcomber60
spelling error