MBNA CCA issue .... I don't trust them !

[blueotter]

Agree,

i should imagine interpretation of the law is the downfall of many,trick is not to leave it open to interpretation and stick to material facts

 

We don't make the laws,neither did the judge in the courtroom,they just have to enforce it,easier said that done judgling by a few cases on here.

 

Hothead,i agree with you,bankers greed has created this mess,mine all spiralled out of control when the apr went from 8% to 34.9%. Just became unmanageable but that's mbna's wilfull disregard,negligence and irresponsibility for their duty of care to a customer.

[theHotHead]

Merry christmas all and a splendid New Year for tomorrow !!!

 

I've had a couple of phonecalls from MBNA asking for my decision regarding a partial settlement they offered of just under half the outstanding balance.

 

I don't have the dosh right now, for peace of mind I would accept the offer to make the whole thing go away, so I did some research. A partial settlement seems to be a complete waste of time as there will still be notes on my credit file that affect me in an adverse way. In essence I am a month away from getting a default and it's been suggested by them that I pay a small amount monthly which prevents the account from being defaulted .. until such time as I can pay the partial settlement figure.

 

I liked the sound of it until I realised that although they won't sell the remainder on to a DCA, I'd still have adverse info on my credit file, late payments registered I can deal with, I don't intend to get credit for a long time, but if the adverse stays on there for 6 years then I might as well not pay a penny rather than waste a substantial amount paying them and still being in a similar boat.

 

With this in mind I did some more looking and I found this, posted by Banker Rhymes With:

 

No, it shouldn't. As Car2403 has said, MBNA will need to show that all of the extra Terms related to the Prescribed Terms were part of the same Agreement, i.e. contained within the four corners of it (get used to that phrase, as it's important)!

 

There is binding Case History that makes it clear the Prescribed Terms cannot be misstated or found in another Document. Unless every aspect of those key Prescribed Terms are contained within your Agreement (i.e. the four corners of it meaning the physical document that can be two sided or even multi-page) then the Agreement cannot be Enforced.

 

It's potentially possible to have a multi-page Agreement, but for that to be regarded as one Agreement, it would have to be either bound together or clearly linked by Page Numbers...preferably with your Signature right at the end of it to show you've read everything above it.

 

If there's a second Document of Terms, then anything found within that could not be contained within the four corners of the Agreement itself. If the Prescribed Terms or elements of the Prescribed Terms are found only in that 2nd Document, then the Agreement itself cannot be Enforced.

 

It was taken from post number 26 on the thread linked below:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/181538-advice-2-ccas-please-2.html

 

He (or she) pretty much says that if ANY conditions in the Prescribed Terms are missing or refered to another document then the agreement is not enforceable at all and there is case history to back it up.

 

Does anyone know what this case history is please ??? I've just decided while writing this to not pay a penny and continue with the course of action I started, if I can find this case history I will do a jig half naked in the streets, lol.

[haggis1984]

Happy New Year!

 

Dont know any relevant case history of the top of my head. You might find this site helpful though:

 

www.bailii.org

[theHotHead]

Thanks Haggis, I tried to read through a few cases but .... I didn't find out anything .. mostly because it seems the judge's comments and those of the legal teams seems to be in an entirely different English !!! How on earth do people learn to talk like that ?!!!

 

Anyway .. I'm about to default, I've got the offer of a partial settlement on the table which I can't accept because I don't have the cash and they are also offering to put me on a payment scheme .. which prevents me getting a default which in all honesty I don't want because next year I'd be looking to buy a house.

 

I'm stuck, the payment scheme sounds like the only option .... it keeps the wolves at bay and they said I could make a F+F offer once my work/money situation - which would have to be most of what I owe anyway - changes. I have to say I am not sure how solid a situation I am in with regard to winning a case based on missing conditions in the Prescribed Terms, I've not been able to get opinion from anyone on this site, it would've been nice to know.

 

There must be others out there who have received the same CCA agreement back from their creditors - and there must be others who are further down the line with their case ... I just can't find them.

[diddydicky]

Merry christmas all and a splendid New Year for tomorrow !!!

 

I've had a couple of phonecalls from MBNA asking for my decision regarding a partial settlement they offered of just under half the outstanding balance.

 

I don't have the dosh right now, for peace of mind I would accept the offer to make the whole thing go away, so I did some research. A partial settlement seems to be a complete waste of time as there will still be notes on my credit file that affect me in an adverse way. In essence I am a month away from getting a default and it's been suggested by them that I pay a small amount monthly which prevents the account from being defaulted .. until such time as I can pay the partial settlement figure.

 

I liked the sound of it until I realised that although they won't sell the remainder on to a DCA, I'd still have adverse info on my credit file, late payments registered I can deal with, I don't intend to get credit for a long time, but if the adverse stays on there for 6 years then I might as well not pay a penny rather than waste a substantial amount paying them and still being in a similar boat.

 

With this in mind I did some more looking and I found this, posted by Banker Rhymes With:

 

 

 

It was taken from post number 26 on the thread linked below:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/181538-advice-2-ccas-please-2.html

 

He (or she) pretty much says that if ANY conditions in the Prescribed Terms are missing or refered to another document then the agreement is not enforceable at all and there is case history to back it up.

 

Does anyone know what this case history is please ??? I've just decided while writing this to not pay a penny and continue with the course of action I started, if I can find this case history I will do a jig half naked in the streets, lol.

 

i note that you keep talking to them on the phone- big mistake! secondly your credit file is going to be f***ed for 6 years whether you settle or not so that should not come into the settlement equation

[theHotHead]

Dicky, its not that easy though, I get calls from so many random numbers, some withheld numbers, land lines, mobiles and because I am self employed I MUST answer every call, I can't turn work away, I am struggling at the moment, so inevitably I answer a call from MBNA on a number that I don't recognise and usually ALWAYS when I answer the phone I greet the caller with my name as a sign of professionalism. So I can't just end the call as soon as I hear its MBNA, maybe I should but I don't have that character/personality in me to do that.

 

I'd love to know why they are now bending over backwards to try to help me, could it be they think their chances are not good ?

 

Playing Devil's Advocate here, lets assume this goes to court, I know you said they could use the things I say against me and not being an expert in this I agree with you totally, however, because this is a potential argument about the legality of an agreement, this case is about whether a piece of paper is legally enforceable or not, so "he said she said" shouldn't come into it.

 

If I know someone committed a crime and I told the police and the evidence was present, but my motive was very suspicious, lets say I was doing it purely as revenge, the CPS wouldn't or couldn't decide not to prosecute because my motive was bad or wrong, my motive is neither here or there. A crime was committed and the police have the proof.

 

Surely thats all that matters ???

[diddydicky]

they are not trying to help you at all

 

theres the iron fist and theres the iron fist in a velvet glove

 

all their calls are recorded- one slip of the tongue from you is all it takes

 

Their threats do not work in the cold print of a letter (and many could not be committed to writing) which is why THEY NEED to be able to talk to you

 

 

 

 

have you got 80 quid?

 

get yourself a truecall and you will NEVER have another unwanted call again

 

the truecall device lets you set up blacklists of people you dont want to call you Z(and you can add new numbers as they pop up)

 

a white list for all the people who will get through as normal

 

for everyone else, they will get through ok but will be asked their name- you then choose to accept the call or not- so your business will not be affected.

 

auto diallers, which are often used by dca's CANNOT speak so when they are asked for a name they are stumped and the machine hangs them up

 

also includes an automatic answerphone which you don't need to keep turning off and a recording device to record calls

 

you can be 3 parts through a call before you decide you want to record it and if you press the red button the machine will record the call right back to the start of the call.

 

finally you can log onto your account online and see detailed records of every call in and out, the time date number etc

 

and no, i dont have shares or any connection with truecall i just think its priceless when dealing with what we are dealing with

Edited January 16, 2010 by diddydicky

[diddydicky]

Dicky, its not that easy though, I get calls from so many random numbers, some withheld numbers, land lines, mobiles and because I am self employed I MUST answer every call, I can't turn work away, I am struggling at the moment, so inevitably I answer a call from MBNA on a number that I don't recognise and usually ALWAYS when I answer the phone I greet the caller with my name as a sign of professionalism. So I can't just end the call as soon as I hear its MBNA, maybe I should but I don't have that character/personality in me to do that.

 

I'd love to know why they are now bending over backwards to try to help me, could it be they think their chances are not good ?

 

Playing Devil's Advocate here, lets assume this goes to court, I know you said they could use the things I say against me and not being an expert in this I agree with you totally, however, because this is a potential argument about the legality of an agreement, this case is about whether a piece of paper is legally enforceable or not, so "he said she said" shouldn't come into it.

 

If I know someone committed a crime and I told the police and the evidence was present, but my motive was very suspicious, lets say I was doing it purely as revenge, the CPS wouldn't or couldn't decide not to prosecute because my motive was bad or wrong, my motive is neither here or there. A crime was committed and the police have the proof.

 

Surely thats all that matters ???

 

 

 

the mere acceptance. albiet innocently of a point of their case is sufficient.

 

trust me (and lots of other caggers who have been there and done that) dont try to re invent the wheel

 

follow sound advice

 

the truecall i mentioned talks to them for you- you will never speak directly to them again so no problems about awkward moments on the phone

 

in fact you will not even know your phone has answered their call until you check in on your computer logs!!