OH v BLS/LTSB

[cymruambyth]

OK silly question time, is the Formal Demand the same as the termination notice re CPR 31.14?

THank you

[citizenB]

Hi, the regulations say this....

 

UK Parliament SIs 1980-1989/1983/1551-1600/Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices)

Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1561)/SCHEDULE 2 Form of Default Notice before a Creditor or Owner Can Become Entitled,

by Reason of Any Breach by the Debtor or Hirer of a Regulated Agreeement, to Terminate the Agreement, Demand Earlier

Payment of any Sum, Recover Possession of any Goods or Land, Treat any Right Conferred on the Debtor or Hirer by the

Agreement as Terminated, Restricted or Deferred or Enforce any Security

 

SCHEDULE 2

FORM OF DEFAULT NOTICE BEFORE A CREDITOR OR OWNER CAN BECOME ENTITLED, BY REASON OF ANY BREACH BY THE DEBTOR OR HIRER OF A REGULATED AGREEEMENT, TO TERMINATE THE AGREEMENT, DEMAND EARLIER PAYMENT OF ANY

SUM, RECOVER POSSESSION OF ANY GOODS OR LAND, TREAT ANY RIGHT CONFERRED ON THE DEBTOR OR HIRER BY THE AGREEMENT AS TERMINATED, RESTRICTED OR DEFERRED OR ENFORCE ANY SECURITY

So if you havent been sent a termination letter, but have been sent a formal demand for the full balance.. then I guess you can substitute one for the other.

[cymruambyth]

Thank you, just trying to cover all bases and not look as though I have just copied something!!!

[citizenB]

Thank you, just trying to cover all bases and not look as though I have just copied something!!!

 

Always bet to check, you can only ask for those documents they mention in their POC. And.. if the account wasnt assigned, then dont ask for that .

[diddydicky]

Hi cb, thanks for your input. Dates are correct, 14 days.....in 2003 when they only required 7 However, the format is wrong because the underlined words are not in a heavier type.

The scan is a true picture, t & cs illegible, page 1 all you can read are the headings and oh's details.

The amount being claimed is less than that show on the DN, even if you remove the arrears amount. What does that mean?

Thank you

 

can you just confirm the date of the DN and what the specific remedy date is- is it a set date or 7 days from date of letter?

[diddydicky]

14 sorry

[cerberusalert]

can you just confirm the date of the DN and what the specific remedy date is- is it a set date or 7 days from date of letter?

They have to give a specific date which gives you a clear 14 days from receipt of the DN to remedy the default.

[cymruambyth]

Sorry if I wasn't clear but they gave a specific date that was 14 days after notice was dated in 2003.

[diddydicky]

Sorry if I wasn't clear but they gave a specific date that was 14 days after notice was dated in 2003.

 

thanks i guessed that what i was trying to get at is what the date was on the letter

 

for example if sent by second class mail and say on a friday and/or over a bank holiday it is possible that they did not give enough time

 

long shot but worth checking the actual calendar

[cymruambyth]

As a result of another me v LTSB I'm on first name terms with most calendar months from 2003!!! This one is a no go but I'm waiting for the result of a SAR as my other case shows the DN being sent on a later date than the one on the notice..... All I can hope for on this notice is the failure to put certain words in heavier type as well as underlined.

[diddydicky]

As a result of another me v LTSB I'm on first name terms with most calendar months from 2003!!! This one is a no go but I'm waiting for the result of a SAR as my other case shows the DN being sent on a later date than the one on the notice..... All I can hope for on this notice is the failure to put certain words in heavier type as well as underlined.

 

understood , pity but worth a shot!

[2Grumpy]

Are they really taking action now for a DN issued in 2003?

 

When was the last payment made - is it SB?

 

There is a prescribed format for DNs that has to be followed. I believe that there are other threads where the defendant has won because of this type of failure. (Take a look in the legal forum.)

 

Without a valid original Credit Agreement rather than an illegible copy of an application form they are stuffed anyway.

 

Good luck!

 

Grumpy

[cymruambyth]

Thank you for your comments and support, I'm keeping my fingers crossed. SAR and CPR 31.14 both posted. It's not SB, but strange that they are taking action just as default due to fall off records

[cymruambyth]

cpr 31.14 delivered on 17 June. 7 days are up on the 24th. Defence by 15 July. Nails being bitten.

 

SAR to Chatham delivered from Edinburgh Delivery Office

[citizenB]

cpr 31.14 delivered on 17 June. 7 days are up on the 24th. Defence by 15 July. Nails being bitten.

 

SAR to Chatham delivered from Edinburgh Delivery Office

 

Ooh, wouldnt recommend the nail biting.. hell on the front teeth:D

 

Perhaps Chatham is on strike

[cymruambyth]

Hi still nothing from [problem] . Still well within 40 days for SAR.

Having read other threads I assume I won't get a reply from [problem]...........what is the best way forward please?

Should I cobble a defence from other defences and post it for guidance?

Thank you. C

[citizenB]

Here is a basic holding defence that shadow posted on another thread. As you dont have sufficient evidence from this crowd to defend yourself properly then this is the way to go I think. In point 3, amend the details of what requests you have sent to suit your situation.

 

 

 

1. I, ********** of ************** make this statement as my defence to the claim brought by **************

 

2. The claimants particulars of claim are vague and fail to disclose any cause of action, they appear to be an abuse of the process in that they fail to deal with the basic rules of pleading in accordance with the CPR even allowing for the constraints of the bulk issue system

 

3. No documents supporting the claims in the particulars have been offered and despite a request to the claimant for further information via CPR 31.14 dated xx/xx/xxxx sent by recorded delivery none has been forthcoming and as a result I cannot plead in defence to the claim

 

4. Without clarification of the claimants claim, the defendant is extremely disadvantaged and the claimants claim appears without merit, the defendant asks to be allowed to submit a fully particularised defence should the claimant provide copies of the original documents he will rely upon.

 

5. Further to that above 4 paragraphs, the defendant is unable to plead effectively or at all. The defendant is embarrassed.

 

 

Statement of truth bit here

 

 

[cymruambyth]

cB thank you very much. I assume I wait until nearer the deadline in case they do send something. If more information appears from my SAR I will be able to amend or add anything via point 4.

Thank you in advance for all assistance.

C

[citizenB]

Hi cb, thanks for your input. Dates are correct, 14 days.....in 2003 when they only required 7 However, the format is wrong because the underlined words are not in a heavier type.

The scan is a true picture, t & cs illegible, page 1 all you can read are the headings and oh's details.

The amount being claimed is less than that show on the DN, even if you remove the arrears amount. What does that mean?

Thank you

 

I know I sometimes take a long time to catch up with the programme, but can you confirm your DN was issued in 2003... and they have only just decided to take action ?

 

In respect of the question you asked in the previous post. The holding/embarrassed defence posted earlier supposes that you dont receive anything in respect of your CPR and Subject Access requests. If you do receive information sufficient to submit a fully particularised defence in time then go for it.

 

The holding defence can be submitted online as it has less than the 8,000 characters allowed. If you are going to submit something with a bit more meat on it then you may well have to post it so you are going to have to allow yourself a deadline of say the 12th July (I think you said your final due date was the 17th)to make up your mind. HTH

[cymruambyth]

Hi cB, yes DN issued in 2003; I have a copy, even if they don't

[diddydicky]

surely if the T & C's are illegible they are yet to comply with the cca s78 request so are still in default so should not be taking enforcement action

 

i have not seen any rules in the CCA that say that there is a time limit on when the stop being in default

 

mmmm 5 years of unlawful charges on the account then too!

[citizenB]

surely if the T & C's are illegible they are yet to comply with the cca s78 request so are still in default so should not be taking enforcement action

 

i have not seen any rules in the CCA that say that there is a time limit on when the stop being in default

 

mmmm 5 years of unlawful charges on the account then too!

 

Good spot, DD. So that makes the amount claimed on the POC incorrect ?

[diddydicky]

Good spot, DD. So that makes the amount claimed on the POC incorrect ?

 

by about 1000 miles i reckon

[2Grumpy]

Can you add proof of the amount to the CPR request? Especially if you dispute the amount.

 

The DN would have had an amount to rectify the default. This should just be the amount that you were in arrears by, not the full amount. Do you know whether you subsequently paid them anything by the date they gave?

 

If there are charges the DN amount might be incorrect

[diddydicky]

Good spot, DD. So that makes the amount claimed on the POC incorrect ?

 

anycharges and interest added since 2003 will be added whilst in default of their obligations under cca and should not have been charged

 

going to take some working out that lot