Muffintop v mbna

[angel_1]

hiya muffintop

 

just thinking long term here for you

 

do you think with whatever equity you have or will eventually get, will you be able to buy a small house outright? just thinking that then your credit file wont even come into it,,,,also you will be able to get child support wont you, ?

 

also what about renting for a while anyway after you sell the home,,,is that a viable option

 

i have no experience of what you are facing only can offer what ive gleaned from friends situations,,,,

 

did you notice when the word divorce came up its one of those with info linked to the divorce pack you can buy from cag maybe your first point to self knowledge of what is possible and what is not,,,,legally of course

 

just my humble thoughts to help you in some small way talk later angel x

[underdog13]

I'm so sorry to hear about your current difficulties, Muffintop - the last thing you needed at the moment.

 

I wonder if it would be worth trying to agree a payment plan for the time being? I'm afraid I don't have sufficient legal knowledge to know how this would affect your claim, i.e. whether it would be admitting the debt. I would have thought though, that given your circumstances, you could claim that you made the payments as a gesture of goodwill to maintain your credit rating, as it vital to you to do so.

 

Surely an unenforceable agreement remains unenforceable regardless of whether you've made payments or not?

 

Might be a good idea to have another word with your solicitor.

 

Thinking ahead if you do rent for a while, it would place you in a better position with your creds - no house to place COs on!

 

Wishing you the best of luck with both your battles. As Angel says, we will give you moral support, even if we can't help with the legalities:)

[Muffintop]

tnx guys yes this was my rationale behind making the payment today to mercers and think im going to go for the same with mbna.. this will mean i have to keep the 34.9 percent rate and just keep paying every month in order to keep a credit rating without defaults. apparently though as I rang experian it still sorta goes against you as if your on a payment plan this reflects on your file and puts people off however you can place a notice of correction to back up your story and its better than showing a default or worse ccj... i feel sick that everything i have hung out for with mbna and bcard may now have been for nothing as i have had to bail out to save some sort of credit rating, i only went for it in the first place because believed my relationship was solid.. only got married in june...sorry to go off track a bit but I think if I get a result with my barclaycard through a 3rd party i may pass mbna also as i cant deal with the stress and can then clear up my credit file and disasociate from anyone else on it if necessary... i have not acknowledged any debt to mercer or mbna. interestingly solicitors say you should continue with payments and i now sorta wish i hadnt placed the account in dispute as the dispute does not seem to stand for anything and is not backed up by anyone. guess a letter to fos is now going to have to be priority

[underdog13]

Can totally understand why you would want to have a third party to help; make sure you check them out thoroughly, though.

 

The divorce on it's own will be enough to deal with - maybe mediation could help with that? Best to make it as amicable as possible (far easier said than done, I know), drawn out battles benefit no-one but the solicitors.

[Muffintop]

tnx yes your right unfortunately i have co on my bc cca and they seem to be pushing forward this gives me confidence, if they are successful they can have the mbna as well but in meantime iv decided to pay arrears in full 500 on another card with some limit and pay minimum each month until this mess is sorted out i feel annoyed im doing this as know i can do it myself but with this going on too i just dont have the same courage and brain space.

Edited March 26, 2009 by Muffintop

[WelshMam2009]

Sorry to hear your latest news MT. However, I would be inclined to write to MBNA telling them that you are down to one income and ask them to freeze the interest and other charges. You should supply an income and expenditure form and excluding your husbands income.

 

I haven't paid any interest to my creditors for circa 3 years now.

[Muffintop]

I was going to pay them tomorow they did say i would have to go through my total monthly income and out and they said if i had more going out than coming in they wouldnt be able to offer me any plan as they have to show their being responsible.... errr yeah right. How can I work this to my advantage? if they freeze interest what will this reflect again on my credit file

Edited March 26, 2009 by Muffintop

[underdog13]

I'm sure it won't be that bad, MT. I know things seem bleak now, but you will find a way through all this.

[WelshMam2009]

I was going to pay them tomorow they did say i would have to go through my total monthly income and out and they said if i had more going out than coming in they wouldnt be able to offer me any plan as they have to show their being responsible.... errr yeah right. How can I work this to my advantage? if they freeze interest what will this reflect again on my credit file which I need to sort out incase I have to rent somewhere, decided i would have to rent anyway and perhaps wait the 3 years is it for file to clear up again? by then my kids would have left me, i will be husbandless and down to a one bar electric fire. isnt life great....

 

Don't fret MT...easier said than done though I know....I'm also husbandless and have been for quite a while....think of the positives....no-one snoring and fluffing (being polite here...) and the bed all to yourself!!

 

MBNA have marked my payments as AR on my credit file. The minimum they normally accept is 1% of the outstanding balance as a monthly payment. Got it written down somewhere and it's something to do with you being able to repay the debt back over 20 years or such likes. (Will let you know if I find the exact wording).

 

Would you be able to manage a payment of 1% without it causing severe hardship?

 

EDIT

PS: My expenditure exceeds my income on paper but MBNA are still prepared to accept a 1% monthly payment from me!

Edited March 23, 2009 by WelshMam2009
PS

[Muffintop]

thanks welshman, what does AR on your credit file mean? do you know? has this still reflected negatively on your future credit requests? I need to weigh up if its worth doing this or paying arrears completely in order to save file.. if im going to get a negative entry anyway ie whatever AR is which would stop people allowing me to obtain a good reference from my file then I may as well continue in not payin them and let them take me to court or give it to a solicitor and force them to court.. then clear up credit file. Cant afford to just pay them and make a mistake.

 

Interestingly i cant understand why they havent updated my credit file already there is nothing on it..... why would this be?? surely they are not so behind they just bang it all on at once, do you think they have made a mistake. presume mbna come up on your file as mbna? i check it every week.

[the_shadow]

thanks welshman, what does AR on your credit file mean? do you know? has this still reflected negatively on your future credit requests? I need to weigh up if its worth doing this or paying arrears completely in order to save file.. if im going to get a negative entry anyway ie whatever AR is which would stop people allowing me to obtain a good reference from my file then I may as well continue in not payin them and let them take me to court or give it to a solicitor and force them to court.. then clear up credit file. Cant afford to just pay them and make a mistake.

 

Interestingly i cant understand why they havent updated my credit file already there is nothing on it..... why would this be?? surely they are not so behind they just bang it all on at once, do you think they have made a mistake. presume mbna come up on your file as mbna? i check it every week.

 

I think the site has an email address, you could ask for details of status codes and their meanings? I suppose it could mean arrangement to pay? if you've asked for reduced payments in the past.

 

Its a bit like cracking the enigma code though trying to decipher all the different info on the reports:D

[davey77]

AR = Arrangement to pay

 

Not sure how that kind of entry effects future chances at credit tho.

[davey77]

Call Credit list of codes and their meanings:

 

http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t42/davey77_2007/Calcreditabrev.jpg

http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t42/davey77_2007/Calcreditabrev_0001.jpg

[Muffintop]

thankyou for that info guys, i need to find out from welshman if this entry has made a difference to her credit availability, as if it has there is no point paying them any money and i may as well just continue to wait for them to take me to court. I cant get my head around how we are all placing our accounts in official dispute but this is not recognise by anyone as being a lawful dispute, where does this come from, and what can you do if they have placed negative entries on your file, they say they have satisfied their s 77/78 request and therefore the dispute is not acknowledged.who says it is and where is it quoted.any takers?

[WelshMam2009]

thankyou for that info guys, i need to find out from welshman if this entry has made a difference to her credit availability, as if it has there is no point paying them any money and i may as well just continue to wait for them to take me to court. I cant get my head around how we are all placing our accounts in official dispute but this is not recognise by anyone as being a lawful dispute, where does this come from, and what can you do if they have placed negative entries on your file, they say they have satisfied their s 77/78 request and therefore the dispute is not acknowledged.who says it is and where is it quoted.any takers?

 

I honestly don't know MT as I've not applied for credit since. I imagine that it must have some effect though. I also have a default from Egg which will affect my credit rating.

 

I'm pretty sure that when you enter into a DMP you are prohibited from seeking further credit otherwise, it will affect your DMP.

 

The one thing that I've noted, at least to date, is that a lot of the other members are still having charges and interest applied to their accounts whereas I'm not (don't want to tempt fate here) even though I have just been making token payments, without agreement, for approx 1 year now.

 

I have now disputed several accounts and have ceased payment all together until my CCA's arrive and I can establish whether or not these are enforceable.

 

I don't know when you took your agreements out MT and whether or not you know if they are enforceable. I'm pretty sure (because I have 2 of the original copies) that several of mine are not.

 

You can't dispute your account until they have defaulted with the CCA request.

 

The reason I suggested a DMP is because you appear to be making payments but interest is still being applied to your account and we need to get this stopped.

 

Hope this isn't too confusing...

[Muffintop]

Thankyou, yes looked in past at dmp and iva which sorta prohibited by my job. I only went down cca route to see if agreements were enforceable which would have helped overall situation possibly. i disputed following non compliance with ccas but this is a problem as we are all officially disputing but what basis are we doing this on and what comeback do we have once our credit files are ruined.. i know you can go to court to get markers removed and defaults but you have to prove that the agreement was unenforceable before you do that and if you wait for them to take you to court you could be waiting the 6 years if they dont actually have the agreement, if you try to take them your in a dodgy position as you then have to proove them dont have the agreement.

This was all the factors i took into consideration and thought ok I will get a bad credit file, but i will put up with it and remove the entries once its done and dusted. But the creditors say that they have satisfied the sec 77 78 request as they have sent what they believe to be a true copy,, we all know this doesnt even have to look like the agreement but this is their out and I dont know who is going to tell them otherwise. Now the situation has changed for me and I need to keep some sort of credit rating and this is where my decision lies. Do I pay off mbna arrears and continue to make minimum payments until i can get the case to a solicitor who will push it to court, do I continue the way I am and ruin my chance of any independance should I need it or do I transfer the whole amount owed to another card if I can find one (not taking that route)

Really not sure what to do at the moment, but as I said for some reason MBNA havent updated my credit file and this is odd.

[WelshMam2009]

they say they have satisfied their s 77/78 request and therefore the dispute is not acknowledged.who says it is and where is it quoted.any takers?

 

Complying with a s77/78 request does not make the agreement enforceable MT. It has to contain all of the prescribed terms as follows (extracted these for credit cards-running credit):

 

SCHEDULE 6

PRESCRIBED TERMS FOR THE PURPOSES OF SECTIONS 61(1)(A)AND127(3)OF THE CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974

 

 

PRESCRIBED TERMS

 

 

Credit limit

3. Agreements for running-account credit.

 

A term stating the credit limit or the manner in

which it will be determined or that there is no

credit limit.

 

 

 

Rate of interest

4. Agreements for—(a) running-account credit

 

A term stating the rate of any interest on the credit

to be provided under the agreement.

 

 

Repayments

5. Consumer credit agreements.

 

A term stating how the debtor is to discharge his

obligations under the agreement to make the

repayments, which may be expressed by reference

to a combination of any of the following--

(a) number of repayments;

(b) amount of repayments;

© frequency and timing of repayments;

(d) dates of repayments;

(e) the manner in which any of the above may be

determined;

or in any other way, and any power of the creditor

to vary what is payable.

 

 

Edited March 26, 2009 by WelshMam2009
My Edit disappeared!! See below...

[WelshMam2009]

This was my edit that disappered...

 

The above is from Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 and I should stress that there are other criteria regarding enforceability such as:

 

Heading / Name & Address Creditor/Debtor / Financial Info (Schedule 1)

Statement of Rights (Schedule 2)

Signature Box (Schedule 5)

Legibility is covered by regulation 2 of the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983

 

CCA 74 states....

 

65.--(1) An improperly-executed regulated agreement is enforceable against the debtor or hirer on an order of the court only.

 

The Court's powers to enforce an agreement that is not properly executed and that was entered into before April 2007 is limited by Section 127(3) of CCA 74.

 

 

127.--(1) In the case of an application for an enforcement order under--

(a) Section 65(1) (improperly executed agreements)....

 

(3) The court shall not make an enforcement order under Section 65(1) if Section 61(1)(a) (signing of agreements) was not complied with unless a document (whether or not in the prescribed form and complying with regulations under Section 60(1)) itself containing all the prescribed terms of the agreement was signed by the debtor or hirer (whether or not in the prescribed manner)

[Muffintop]

Chris and other guys,

I have finally had to cave in today and balance transfer the alledged arrears and default charges to mbna.. why? to be honest I wish I had continued to pay as I disputed the debt and stopped payments which meant diddly squat but got a better result by not continuing payments than making them.. I also thought i was covered by placing the account in this official dispute due to not receiving my cca.. however the dispute was never acknowledged by any of my creditors asthey say they only had to provide what they believe to be a true copy to comply with sec 77..my credit file was almost trashed one step away from a default notice and 3 late payment markers. I could take them to court as the burden of proof would be harder and on me.. sec 127 (3) phased me also and I got nothing from a cpr request. I decided after a personal blip meaning I may need to access credit to pay them the arrears and continue to pay the minimum payments even though wont get anywhere as 34.9 interest rate to save my file. I am still pursuing the enforceability of the debt but with someone who is going to push it for me. deflated that it was for me all a waste of time almost and Im back to square 1.

I did make it clear on the phone that I still acknowledged no debt to them and was only paying as a token gesture and to stop them harassing me, if the agreement was found to be unenforceable then I would be in a position to get my credit file cleared up.Rightly or wrongly once they put negative entries on your file, they are not going to be removed until you have won or 6 years.

I almost feel like I have bailed out but with job in trouble, personal life in trouble I needed to make sure I had choices ... with no credit rating I had none.

[cosalt]

Hi Muffintop, you have to take the course of action you feel is best for you, good luck with everything.

 

Cosalt:)

[WelshMam2009]

Chris and other guys,

I almost feel like I have bailed out but with job in trouble, personal life in trouble I needed to make sure I had choices ... with no credit rating I had none.

 

Hey MT...there's a time and a place for a fight and neither is right for you at the mo, so don't let it bother you

 

You have to prioritise and will undoubtedly have made the right decision for YOU which is the most important aspect.

 

My very best wishes...hope everything works out for you!!

[the_shadow]

With the situation you outlined I dont think I would have acted differently muffintop.

 

Just have to hope these banks get $$%$£ one day soon big time!

 

PmW

[angel_1]

hey muffintop

 

just seen your updates - i know this must have been a bit of a hard decision but above all you have to think of yourself and what your options would be for the best for the immediate future

 

it stinks that the credit file gets trashed and they take their time over a legal document that should be supplied at first request

 

im livid at this for all of us

 

but this is unfortunately what we are all facing, i just wish that you will at least reclaim all charges and interest if you continue to pay them and try and reduce the debt as fast as you can and hope the future is a little brighter for you

 

pls continue to learn as much as you can as knowledge always teaches you something new each day

 

good luck and stay in touch with us all

 

laters angel x:cool:

[underdog13]

Best of luck, MT, hope things take a turn for the better soon:)

 

The time may not be right for you now to challenge the agreement, but there is nothing to stop you doing so at a later date. Take care of yourself.

[ifoughtthelaw]

Hi Muffintop

 

I just wanted to wish you the best of luck, as your thread has kept us sane and without all the info we wouldn't have got this far ourselves. We started a dispute with MBNA the same time as you so understand completely where you're coming from - all that is certain is that ours is an application form which is not legible. Pretty straightforward you would think - but the ignorance of MBNA to acknowledge anything is enough to set your head spinning into doubt - that is what they want but sometimes you just need to get your head back in order which is impossible to do when there's just so much going on in life. I know I've been there - you'll come out stronger the other side. Just do what's right for you now - keep your chin up and let us know how you're getting on. We'll all be fighting for you so keep watching!

 

All the very best x