Some advice re: an interim charging order pls

[lookinforinfo]

Academic really Lisa. If they cannot produce the credit agreement at this hearing or the Final Charging Order it is game over for them.

What would be better is if they produced an invalid agreement so that they could never come back. The same would be true if they had an invalid default Notice-and that is very common. I will try and find an example on the forum of what they should say-virtually anything else renders the DN invalid-end of your problems.

I would go back to the ignoramuses at Cohens and ask them to provide now what they are going to produce in Court to give you time to prepare your defence ie the agreement the Default Notice and the Deed of Assignment. You are entitled to them under CPR and not to get them is a breach of CPR.

 

PS You and they will need to be quick if the hearing is for next week.

[lisaf]

Thanks LFI. I know normally any defence would have to be in at least 7 days before a hearing so obviously that can't happen so does it just mean that i take it with me on the day?

Also how do i request the stuff that cohens are going to use in court in time?

Are things usually done this quickly?

I have another set aside i applied for before this one and the hearing isn't until march! Same court also!

Please advise - many many thanks, don't want to mess up at this stage.

Lisa x

[lisaf]

Sorry - also do i tweak the defence that von greenbach suggested to take with me or something else?

Lisa

[lookinforinfo]

Lisa, I am sorry but I think I have mislead you on the previous post. All the Court are asking that the relevant documents are produced in Court so that you have them to hand when the Charging Order is heard.

So do not chase for them, indeed hope that they are not produced. By all means take along Von Greenbach's defence just in case, but I don't think you will be asked to do anything other than walk away with copies of the requested documents.

Once you have the copies post them on this thread to see if they are valid.

[lisaf]

Right so is this not a set aside hearing then? What if they don't produce the docs this week?

Lisa

[lookinforinfo]

If they can't, the Judge will either quash the Charging Order, or give them a bit more time. Depends what kind of Judge you get.

You should point out to the Judge the letter from Cohen's saying they were not obliged to supply the docs and let him/her know how long you have been asking for them.

[lisaf]

OK thanks LFI

[supasnooper]

Hi All,

 

rec'd in the post today (after panicking yesterday)! the 'General form of judgement or order'.

 

It says:

'Before district judge xxx sitting at willesden cc etc etc.

 

It is ordered that

 

1/ An application hearing has been listed for xx jan at xxam with a time estimate of 15 mins.

2/ Claimant do provide at the hearing:

 

a/ The regulated consumer credit agreement the subject of the claim

b/ Copy assignment to claimant

c/ Copy notice of default

 

Now i know they haven't tied this one up with the CO hearing in March but is this better for me as if they can't produce - is it game over for them?

Please advise

Many thanks

Lisa

 

 

Brilliant news,

 

And good advice from LFI to follow.

[lisaf]

Thanks Supa - let's hope they can't produce in time

[howmuchdebt]

Hi,

Eversheds never produced their CCA either and the judge said they dont have to its not important and the charge was granted,its a load of rubbish this CCA request as it does not stand up in court. sorry to burst your bubble

[Von Greenbach]

Hi,

Eversheds never produced their CCA either and the judge said they dont have to its not important and the charge was granted,its a load of rubbish this CCA request as it does not stand up in court. sorry to burst your bubble

Sorry to burst your bubble, but there are very experienced members on here who work within the legal profession, who would disgree with your statement.

[howmuchdebt]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but there are very experienced members on here who work within the legal profession, who would disgree with your statement.

dont speak to me like that i was only telling it as it was for me and dont want to mislead anyone,your very rude

[howmuchdebt]

And for your information a CCA is not worth the bother on a credit card,i know there are expreienced posters on this site,but they are not always right.

[lookinforinfo]

Howmuchdebt, first I don't think Von greenbach was rude to you-indeed he only said what you had already to Lisa which was "sorry to burst your bubble".

 

At the end of the day, on this forum we are trying to help people like Lisaf with her problem as this is her thread. So starting up arguments on someone else's thread is not much of a help to Lisaf.

 

That being said Howmuchdebt, I can understand that you would have been upset by the Judges decision in your case. Not all Judges are as au fait with the Consumer Credit Act as they need to be although in fairness even the Law Lords admit that the interpretation of parts of the Act are not easy for them either. However, if the executed agreement was not produced at the time the CCJ was applied then the Judges decision during the subsequent setaside appears to have been flawed. if you haven't started a thread on that result, I suggest you do so and see if it is not too late to have that decision reversed.

 

Lisa, I don't expect anything more to happen this week at your hearing other than the documents to be provided [or not as the case may be].

But in May, should it get that far, it would be wise to realise that you may need to dot the i's and cross the t's for the Judge to make it crystal clear that if there are defects in either the agreement or the Default Notice then the Charging Order and any associated CCJ are invalid and use examples which you can find on this Forum to substantiate your position.

[howmuchdebt]

I am burying my sister this Thursday i am not in the best of moods I wont bother with this forum again sorry to have even replied,but i do think the reply was rude.

 

I think if you read my post the way i said about bursting a bubble was not to be nasty it was just a saying,but Von greenbach said it back to me to be leery and offensive.

 

I would have thought letting others know that charges nearly always on go your house is better than making out otherwise.

Edited January 25, 2009 by howmuchdebt

[lookinforinfo]

I am sorry to hear of your bad news.

There is no need to leave the forum however. You appear to have a justifiable grievance against a decision made in Court and it would be a pity if there was a chance to get it rectified and not take it.

 

Obviously now is not the time to commence, but later when you have had a time to grieve, let us see if we can give you best advice to resolve that judgement.

[howmuchdebt]

I am sorry to hear of your bad news.

There is no need to leave the forum however. You appear to have a justifiable grievance against a decision made in Court and it would be a pity if there was a chance to get it rectified and not take it.

 

Obviously now is not the time to commence, but later when you have had a time to grieve, let us see if we can give you best advice to resolve that judgement.

 

 

Thankyou,

i appreciate that,however I dont think the charge would be reversed we tried every trick in the book and even now Eversheds have their charge they are threatening with forced sale blah blah blah,we are also back and forwrds to court fighting 1st credit who want to make us bankrupt,but we have won one stat demand and about to win the next on Tuesday as they have backed out .

[supasnooper]

Thanks Supa - let's hope they can't produce in time

 

 

Well let's hope so.............you've said that HSBC have admitted they haven't got the agreement and it's time for them to put up or shut up.

 

 

As an aside to this, howmuchdebt, I'm sorry to hear of your bad news and offer my condolences to you and your family.

 

I do hope you will reconsider your decision not to bother with the forum. Yourself and VG have offered valid points of view to the OP and sometimes it can be hard to agree with another perspective that is offered - but why not call it a rounded perspective made available to the OP ?

I do think you can make useful contributions to the forum as you've dealt with SD's and CO's - a lot more than some others have dealt with.

[lookinforinfo]

Well, it costs nothing, other than time, to start up a thread on the subject. And to get the CCJ off your credit report and Eversheds off your back into the bargain would seem woth the effort.

And congratulations on your recent successes. To add a third to your list would surely be the icing on the cake.

[howmuchdebt]

Thankyou,

I was obviously having a stress moment when i said i wont bother posting,i have had some really good advice on here and our problems are not always the same,

 

I am hoping on Tuesday that this is the last of the threats from 1st credit who have been nothing but bullies over the past few years,Eversheds well we are just going to save every penny we can and cut down on the food bill each month to try and get a couple of thousand pounds together to offer them full and final so the charge will come off the house and they off our backs.

 

Sorry guys about my outburst

[lisaf]

Well let's hope so.............you've said that HSBC have admitted they haven't got the agreement and it's time for them to put up or shut up.

 

Hi Supa - sorry think you may have got my other set aside mixed up on my other thread where hsbc admit they don't have it. That hearing is in march.

 

This one is for a store card (taken out about 10 years ago) So i'm really hoping that they can't find anything!

The CO hearing is march also for this. I don't see the point of the court ordering them to produce if they are going to be dismissed out of hand if they are not produced/not valid - what a total waste of my time and money!

 

I am trying not to be too positive about this as i know anything could happen:roll:

I appreciate all of your comments always - thankyou;)

Lisa

[supasnooper]

Must have mis-read your post in this thread re. HSBC

 

- still a 10 year old store card, got to be hopeful of no CCA.

[lisaf]

Hi All, so bearing in mind it's only a hearing for the OC to produce the docs, do I need to take anything with me?

Many thanks

Lisa x

[lisaf]

Anyone?

[lookinforinfo]

Lisa they have only allocated 5 minutes, I think, for your hearing. But it is as well to be on the safe side and take your arguments along just in case things escalate, or you can find a reason why the case should be quashed now-like them not having the correct documents.

For instance if they only have an application form, point out that it is unenforceable in a Court, having the backup from other cases to substantiate your point so that it will be all over this week.