PPI Successes [NO QUESTIONS or EXPLANATIONS PLEASE] - just Bank/How Much with a link to your thread.

[Guest MamaG1]

Wow,

 

Congratulations!!!.

 

You have had really good progress. Very many thanks to the forumn. Keep going.

 

Just curious. What was the other element that is not missold PPI refunded to you please?.

 

As I am in a No CCA no pay situation currently with RBS. They have paid me back into the loan account missold PPI totalling around £10k now, but I am more disputing the loan's legitimacy now as there is no CCA.

They are in the mean time not agreeing with me hence they have trashed my Credit fil.

Dont really know what to do right now, in a bit of a cogma and anxiety.

Do you have any advise please on how to progress the no CCA no pay process.?

8-)

[andrew1]

Keep this case in mind on the interest issues when claiming too:- http://www.wragge.com/legal_news_1341.asp

 

Very useful to keep in mind in your calculations and claim.

[noomill060]

dx- having a less than satisfying experience with FOS. Apparently the concept of refunding interest on PPI premiums is entirely new to them. Im having to walk them through it.

 

Could be setting a precedent. Decision will effect all future CC adjudications/ Ombubsman decisions- OFFICIAL.

 

Been ploughing a lonely furrow in this case, would you mind if I PM'd you about this?

[dx100uk]

same tact i'm using

 

dx

[lord_tiger_putin]

I got a very good result with the one which came the closest to not being mis-sold - Barclaycard. They refunded more money for the PPI as which I claimed and they also refunded the charges plus interest. I am waiting for the last claim from them - mis-sold ID Theft protection.

 

RBS and HBOS went off to the FOS. I didn't apply at all for PPI, therefore it is no-sold! They refunded, HBOS the premiums + some interest and RBS only the premiums, but refused the required redress.

 

I am claiming the following when claimimg back PPI:

1. The premiums

2. Interest on it

3. The theft charges as a direct result of the premiums+interest

4. The interest on the theft charges

5. The interest on the interest on the premiums and interest on the theft charges

6. 8% single interest when the account was in credit after the removal of all these amounts

7. A statement and a detail explanation how the redress has been made.

 

I based these claims on the recommendations of the FOS:

 

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/technical_notes/ppi/redress.html

 

I created and fine tuned a spreadsheet to calculate the redress and I tested it with some of the examples from their web site and are confident that it works fine. Can provide it to anyone interested in it.

 

The FOS make it clear that a redress should be done in such a way that it will put the account back in the position it would have been should the PPI premium not been made while the same monthly payments has been made. taking this into consideration then all the above mentioned amounts make sense. The FOS DO mention charges by name and they even mention late payment charges, not only the over limit fees.

 

The FOS also requires that the company send you a statement and a detail explanation how the redress has been made.

 

 

 

P.S. After a SAR to Barclaycard I received the transcript of my phone conversation when they sold the PPI , which contains standard questions. I built my claim around that converstaion. I can post the standard question as well as my claim should anyone ask for it. The claim worked like a charm, I send it in and 4 weeks later received a very positive response with them stating that they failed to provide me with the correct info when selling the PPI

Edited November 8, 2010 by lord_tiger_putin

[landy_alert]

Hi LTP

 

Very well done on your success!

 

I am very interested in your theory regarding having the charges that were applied as a result of the addition of mis-sold PPI refunded.........I agree that the FOS factsheet quite clearly refers to charges caused by the application of PPI.

 

In my own case though the PPI and loan were serviced by a current account which then incurred charges as a result.

 

Do you have a specific thread regarding this you could point me in the direction of please?

 

Keep up the good work!

 

Landy x

[means2anend]

Yes L_T_P

 

Well done...some amazing detailed work I must say....but sure we could benefit from this

 

rgds

m2ae

[lord_tiger_putin]

Hi LTP

 

Very well done on your success!

 

I am very interested in your theory regarding having the charges that were applied as a result of the addition of mis-sold PPI refunded.........I agree that the FOS factsheet quite clearly refers to charges caused by the application of PPI.

 

In my own case though the PPI and loan were serviced by a current account which then incurred charges as a result.

 

Do you have a specific thread regarding this you could point me in the direction of please?

 

Keep up the good work!

 

Landy x

 

This is the way I worked it out and I applied it on the FOS examples. These examples do not include charges on the values provided but the various interest work the same. I believe my arguments are correct but it is still only my interpretation.

 

You will need all your statements to get the relevant balances and interest you paid, as well as the PPI premiums and charges.

 

Take the balance of the first month and calculate the interest of the PPI premium (this is similar as the interest claims on the bank charges thread and the spreadsheet in that thread, I think the thread is by Bankfodder). You can do that by dividing the interest by the balance and multiply the PPI premium by that (or you can calculate a %).

 

Add the next months premium to the previous months' premium (the bank do owe you now 2 premiums) and calculate the interest on that by creating a cumulative PPI premiums column, always use the cumulative column for interest calculations because that what is owed to you.

 

Create a column of the cumulative interest paid (they add up every month) and a column where you add the cumulative premiums and cumulative interest (this is the amount that are owed to you by the bank).

 

Deduct this column from the statement balance to give the REAL balance. If you incur an over limit charge but the REAL balance is below your credit limit, then add this charge to a column for charges. Calculate the interest on these charges similar to that of the PPI premiums. Create also a column for cumulative charges and cumulative interest on the charges. Calculate the interest on the cumulative column because that is what the bank also owe you.

 

Create a column where you add the cumulative interest on the PPI premiums and cumulative interest on the charges. Now calculate the interest on that. Once again, create a column for the cumulative interest on interest and also subtract this from the statement balance to get the REAL balance.

 

Other words, create a column where you add the cumm PPI, cumm interest on that, cumm charges, cumm int on charges and cumm interest on interest. Subtract this from the statement balance every month to give every months' REAL balance.

 

Should this REAL balance go into credit, calculate 8% simple interest on the balance (for every month in credit it is 8/12% on the REAL balance of that month and here you do not use the cumulative values).

 

 

It could be that the earliest over limit charges will be applicable but very soon no one will be valid anymore and by deducting the invalid one makes the changes that the rest are invalid more likely because they do accumulate.

 

 

 

Remember that these premiums have the following ramifications:

The banks charge interest on them.

They can be the only reason for be over your limit and the banks add charges as a direct result of the PPI premiums.

The banks charge interest on these charges as well.

The banks continue to charge interest on the interest.

 

In the end it adds up to a significant amount!!

 

I found that by removing all these amounts usually wipes out about 2/3rds of the balance!! (Given that there are a number of charges).

 

To me this is one of the best ways of getting these theft charges back!! I also ask for all the charges to be refunded because it would be hard for them to argue not to give it if they refunded most and it seems that the FOS also believe some late payment charges should be refunded.

 

In my complaints to the FOS I included these calculations and I made extensive use of their recommendations in my complaint but I do send a follow up letter to the bank including these recommendations and calculations, therefore, should they still refuse to do a proper redress, then they have no excuse and I do ask the FOS for consideration of a payment for distress and inconvenience because the financial business rejected the redress that it knew (or should have known) that the ombudsman service would uphold.The FOS usually grant a £200 -£300 payment for it.

[lord_tiger_putin]

In my own case though the PPI and loan were serviced by a current account which then incurred charges as a result.

 

These calculation is for Credit Cards. In a fix amount loan the interest are in the premiums but the FOS recommendations is that you should get back 8% single interest. Therefore you could calculate the cumulative premiums for every month and add that to your current account balance. If that reduce your over draft amount for that month to below the limit, then you should get back the over limit fee. I believe that you can add the 8% as well because the recommendations state that it should be calculated from the date of the premium been paid until the date of refund, clearly indicating that the bank owes you that money from the date it left your account.

 

I believe this argument to be in line with the general line of argument and I thought your situation is rather interesting until I realised I have a similar situation!! HSBC refused to refund the theft charges on my current account. I claimed back the PPI but they refused the one policy on the loan and I have referred that to the FOS. I send other claims to them and will see what comes out of that but this is certain a very worthwhile line to follow!!!

 

This could be a very good way of getting bank charges back!!

 

These premiums will probably take care of most of the over limit fees and declined DD/SO charges. Probably also for bounced cheques, what about claiming for damages in these cases????

[lord_tiger_putin]

Yes L_T_P

 

Well done...some amazing detailed work I must say....but sure we could benefit from this

 

rgds

m2ae

 

Here is an example of the spreadsheet i used. Should anyone want to use it, do it at your own risk. I removed my personal data, hopefully that didn't messed up things.

 

You will have to fill in the cyan parts.

Redress.xls

[lord_tiger_putin]

I frimly believe that getting the PPI refunded is only half the story, a proper redress is just as, or even more, important. the crucial FOS statements are these:

 

"Our normal approach is to try to put the consumer back into the position they would have been in but for the failure on the part of the financial business. "

 

"The reconstruction of the credit-card account, to work out what the current balance would have been (where the account remains open) – or what the closing balance would have been (where the account has been cleared or closed) – if the consumer had made the same monthly payments but without PPI."

 

To put you back where you would have been should you have made the same monthly payments but without the premiums leaving your account.

 

This open all the issues mentioned above but also credit file entries! The balances that were reported were incorrect, default notices issued could be miles out in the amount of arrears. etc. It could well be that a default notice was isued and a Default registered on the credit file when the account was actually in credit! (CrapOne in my case).

[landy_alert]

These calculation is for Credit Cards. In a fix amount loan the interest are in the premiums but the FOS recommendations is that you should get back 8% single interest. Therefore you could calculate the cumulative premiums for every month and add that to your current account balance. If that reduce your over draft amount for that month to below the limit, then you should get back the over limit fee. I believe that you can add the 8% as well because the recommendations state that it should be calculated from the date of the premium been paid until the date of refund, clearly indicating that the bank owes you that money from the date it left your account.

 

I believe this argument to be in line with the general line of argument and I thought your situation is rather interesting until I realised I have a similar situation!! HSBC refused to refund the theft charges on my current account. I claimed back the PPI but they refused the one policy on the loan and I have referred that to the FOS. I send other claims to them and will see what comes out of that but this is certain a very worthwhile line to follow!!!

 

This could be a very good way of getting bank charges back!!

 

These premiums will probably take care of most of the over limit fees and declined DD/SO charges. Probably also for bounced cheques, what about claiming for damages in these cases????

 

Thanks very much for your help with this L_T_P - I appreciate your advice!

 

I have actually referred mine to the FOS now and am waiting to hear back from them. Will let you know how I get on.

 

Landy x

Edited November 10, 2010 by landy_alert
Added more info

[lord_tiger_putin]

Thanks very much for your help with this L_T_P - I appreciate your advice!

 

I have actually referred mine to the FOS now and am waiting to hear back from them. Will let you know how I get on.

 

Landy x

 

I spend some time thinking about it and created this thread to see what other people think:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?283400-Claiming-back-bank-charges-%E2%80%93-The-PPI-approach

 

I assume one cannot add the 8% interest to your current account balance but you should certainly add the debit interest over paid as a result of these premiums, the premiums, ineterst and the charges will quickly add up to a credit balance and one should also claim the credit current account interest after calculating the REAL balance.

[lord_tiger_putin]

RBS and HBOS went off to the FOS. I didn't apply at all for PPI, therefore it is no-sold! They refunded, HBOS the premiums + some interest and RBS only the premiums, but refused the required redress.

 

Received a letter from Halifax (Aqua card) today and they refunded all the over limit charges PLUS the correct interest PLUS the interest on the interest!

 

They stubbornly refused to refund the charges before, I tried all the angles I could but in the end PPI did the trick!

 

Just have to get the right PPI interest out of them now!!

[means2anend]

Excellent L_T_P

 

Much respect to you

 

rgds-m2ae

[lord_tiger_putin]

Here is an example of the spreadsheet i used. Should anyone want to use it, do it at your own risk. I removed my personal data, hopefully that didn't messed up things.

 

You will have to fill in the cyan parts.

 

Anyone interested in using this spreadsheet just 2 points of caution.

 

It doesn't check that the REAL balance is lower than the statement balance when an over limit charge was applied by the bank. You can manually check that and if not, simply delete that charge. This would only happen in the beginning because the amounts to be deducted increase rapidly and making the REAL balance always lower that the statement balance.

 

The 2nd point is that there is no built check to ensure that the amount of interest been claimed back is lower that that actually applied! This can happen when the REAL balance goes into credit but the statement balance is still in debit. This can also be checked manually.

 

I can produce an updated version with these checks at a leter stage so that it will be suitable for general use. I will be out of the country for 3 weeks and could do it then.

[lord_tiger_putin]

 

Just have to get the right PPI interest out of them now!!

 

Had a phone conversation with and gee, they are changers!! (don't we already know that??).

 

They stated that they refunded the interest that I have paid on the PPI premiums. Apparently the first part of your monthly payments goes towards the payment of the PPI premium and you incurred interest for the time frame between the premiums been added and the payment received.

 

THIS IS NOT WHAT THE FOS SAY SHOULD BE DONE.

 

They should not calculate the interest on the PPI premiums, they should do an account redress!!!

 

This means:

 

"The reconstruction of the credit-card account, to work out what the current balance would have been (where the account remains open) – or what the closing balance would have been (where the account has been cleared or closed) – if the consumer had made the same monthly payments but without PPI. This should be calculated by deducting the PPI premiums and the interest and charges that resulted from those premiums (including those arising because the ongoing monthly balance on the credit-card account was higher than it would have been, if the consumer had made the same payments to an account without PPI). "

 

If there was no PPI, then the payments would have reduced the balance and you would have paid less interest each month!! The amount you would have paid interest on would be the balance after subtracting the cumulative PPI premiums, a significant difference! This is what the fos says:

 

" if the consumer had made the same payments to an account without PPI"

 

Therefore the point I want to make is this:

 

Halifax DO NOT refund the correct amount of interest when refunding PPI payments!!

[lord_tiger_putin]

I got a very good result with the one which came the closest to not being mis-sold - Barclaycard. They refunded more money for the PPI as which I claimed and they also refunded the charges plus interest. I am waiting for the last claim from them - mis-sold ID Theft protection.

They refunded that (ID Theft Protection) as well, plus the requested interest!! My balance went from more than £600 in debit to around £200 in credit without me paying a penny!!

 

I have to say, Barclaycard seems to be the one with whom I had the best dealings with. The others seems to take their changes are really pushing their luck. Have to see what will happens with the FOS involvement.

[lord_tiger_putin]

Another one bites the dust (but not hard enough!!) - CrapOne.

 

They simply ignored my PPI claim and just inform me to forget the refund of the theft charges. After sending the claim to the FOS they turned up with an offer. The PPI premiums plus some interst and the charges with some interest but not the required redress. Will have to push this to see whether I will get the required interest (and interest on interest). Their offer is not to be ignored but I cannot see why they should not pay the extra £200 - £300. Will see wht happens with that!

[landy_alert]

Good work L_T_P - keep it up! Mine is now back with the FOS who have passed the calcs to the bank for perusal............just a waiting game now

[danielman2]

happy days

[dx100uk]

this thread is for successes/concluded claims ONLY

please start your own thread for any other matters

[drsuew]

I have had success with Cahoot credit card. I realised last week that PPI was being taken with my monthly payments - I queried it with Cahoot and recieved a letter within a couple of days offering me 1600 in full and final settlement of my claim: no arguments, just held their hands up and offered to repay it as they could find no evidence that I had been provided with enough information to make an informed choice!

[dx100uk]

i sincerelyhope they returned the payments with purchase interest included from the date of each payment to the date of your claim?

 

dx

[Edinburgh7]

Mr Edinburgh7 Vs Welcome Finance and WON just over £3k!!!! They made me work for it though, with over a dozen phonecalls chasing there compliance department, each one between 30 mins - 1hr long!!