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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Echoblack vs HSBC


Echoblack
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Okay so I started off the reclaim process a couple of months back.

 

I went through all of my statements and worked out that the HSBC had taken £2,192.50 off me in charges OW!

 

So I sent off my prelim letter recorded delivery. Waited 14 days from the date of deliverythen sent my LBA. A couple of days after that I recieved a letter asking me to send in list of all the dates and charges. Hmm that'll be the papery thing stapelled to the letter that your responding to Mr HSBC, but don't worry I attached another copy to the LBA. I recieved no response to the LBA, so I registered with MCOL then hit a snag.

 

I couldn't afford the court fee:(

 

That was 6 weeks ago. Now I have the cash to hit the big red button on MCOL. I still haven't recieved a response to the LBA. Because of the delay on my part should I send another letter, or just hit the big red sue button?

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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Button pushed at 07:00 this morning!

 

Why couldn't they be a good little doggy and just roll over like MBNA did? They'd have saved themselves £340 in interest:rolleyes:

 

I'll post as developments err develope.

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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So I recieved written acknowledgment yesterday that my claim has been served and that HSBC/DG 'intend to defend all of this claim'.

 

I'll whack 2 copies of schedule of charges into the post (recorded delivery) to DG tomorrow, remembering to add on court costs:grin:

 

On the letter I got from the court there's nothing noted about shifting it from Northampton to my local court. I take it that'll happen when DG actually file there defence?

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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On the letter I got from the court there's nothing noted about shifting it from Northampton to my local court. I take it that'll happen when DG actually file there defence?

 

Okay I've just read somebody else's thread and now know that will happen when they file defence. Looks like I'll be posting 3 copies of my schedule of charges to the court as well tomorrow.

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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Just a quick thourght. I don't want DG or HSBC to pay any money into my account, as I'm on a dmp and want to spread the love equally between my creditors. When is the best time to mention that I want any settlement as a cheque? Should I put that in a covering letter with the schedule of charges, or wait until they make me an offer?

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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  • 2 weeks later...

HSBC acknowledged my claim on the 12th, it's now the 27th. There's no note on MCOL other than claim acknowledged. Am I'm right in thinking I can press the judgement button?

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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HSBC acknowledged my claim on the 12th, it's now the 27th. MCOL says nothing other than claim acknowledged. Am I right in thinking I can hit the judgement button?

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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go back and look at the notice of issue - check date served - add 28 days to that date and that's when you can press the button - but have no fear - it won't let you press if it's too soon and it won't let you press if they've defended - so when it's due - press a way............

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  • 1 month later...

Wow Haven't updated this thread in a long time so it's probably overdue.

 

As if by magic HSBC did indeed file a last minute defence. I won't bore you all with the details, it reads very much like everybody elses.

 

I bothered them over the next few weeks with a number of phone calls to try and get an offer but to no avail.

 

My AQ went in on on Wednesday, funnily enough the day of the AQ deadline, with the proposed 28 days direction thing attached.

 

HSBC so far hasn't bothered to hand in their's (6 days late now).

 

I spoke to a sweet old dear at the court just half an hour ago. She told me it's 'all' been sent off to the district judge and I need to await directions. Hopefully those will tell me he's throwing out HSBC's defence and I've won. Hopefully.

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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nice to hear from you again - although it would have been nicer to hear you had had an offer: nevermind - it will come. i've just written this:

 

When you have filed your AQ................ (multipage.gif1 2) because so many are filing aq's lately. it may tell you something or maybe not.

 

as for contacting dg - the site helpers and mods are concerned that too much of this could be construed as harassment - so i'm going to start advising a more laid back approach.

once you know they have your breakdown - how about just a weekly approach - might give them more time to make offers, you never know!

sometimes i think they let the aq go by on purpose and then offer not long after - they are just postponing the inevitable as long as possible.

keep in touch.

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From my own experience and reading a number of other threads, it does appear that not fillingthe AG is becoming a standard DG tactic.

 

It generally takes at least a week for the judge to order the them to file or defult, and then he gives them a week to do that.

 

Net gain 2 weeks for no work. Fingers crossed eventually the judges will wise up and just start telling them they've defulted.

 

Maybe then we can get some hot Balife action:D

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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Phoned the court again today. Still no word from the district judge. It'll be 2 weeks on Wednesday since I submitted my AQ:(

 

And still not a single offer from DG, they could at least have the courtesy to send me an insultingly low first offer :mad:

 

Meh!

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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Ok Yesterday, exactly 2 weeks after the original AQ deadline, a I got a letter from the judge saying that HSBC had a further 2 weeks to file their AQ or he'd throw out their defence.

 

Bah:mad:

 

Me thinks a letter to HSBC will be going in the post tomorrow then. Something alongthe lines of.

 

You now have to pay for my AQ. If you settle before the 27th you won't have to pay for your own :D

 

Course I'll probaby need to pretty it up a bit:rolleyes:

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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Got home from work to day to find a full offer from HSBC :)

 

It ain't over yet, they want to off set the amount against my debt. I want a cheque so I can spread the amount fairly between my creditors, nearly all of whom I got in to trouble with cause HSBC kept taking my wages as bank charges so I couldn't pay them in the first place. Which obviously lead to them charging me which... well you get the idea. HSBC will get their fair share of the money I claim back from my other creditors, so they can't complain.

 

So now I need to write a new letter:rolleyes:

 

I'll keep ya all informed

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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do you need a template for accepting it on your terms - there are a few around - did they include the aq fee? well done you, you should be able to smell the money - it's very, very close. michael browne has written several - i think the one on gordylar's thread is similar - just say you will only accept a cheque and no conditions - and don't forget to say thank you for the offer.............but, unfortunately!

nearly there.

keep focused!

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  • 4 weeks later...

Yet again I've been slack, but I'm posting cause I have positive news :)

 

I sent off my thanks for the offer, but I really don't like your conditions letter.

 

On wednesday HSBC Replied with the most bizarre undecipherable bit of legalise I've ever read, but the last couple of lines seemed to indicate a check was on it's way. Imagine my surprise when I got home last night (Thursday) and found the check waiting for me on the door mat:)

 

Anyway I'll be paying it in this lunch time and as soon as it clears I'll post here and get the thread updated to a WIN.

 

Although if the check bounces I will have to add £25 pounds to my claim, just to cover costs you understand:rolleyes:

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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Thanks.

 

Not calling it a win until the cheque clears mind.

 

I'm to pesamistic for that;)

MBNA: £545.88 recovered in full

HSBC: £2192.50 LBA sent

HFC: £160 biding my time

Citi: £550 Biding my time

Halifax: £350 Biding my time

 

Total - £3798.38

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