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    • Thanks. I often use this free site  https://www.sejda.com/compress-pdf  for work to compress PDFs. If it's no good, as you say, split it, and we'll do the biz at this end tomorrow. Knackered here - more in the morrow.
    • This is the covering email response (all personal details removed) - the pdf with all the info is 8mb - too big to upload - I'll need to split it and redact it tomorrow. Dear, We write further to your recent correspondence. We note from this that you have submitted a Request for Access pursuant to Article 15 of the UK General Data Protection Regulation (UK GDPR). We wish to confirm that the response provided below, and via the enclosed documents, concerns the Parking Charge referenced above. This data is provided on the basis that we note that you have already been identified as the registered keeper of the vehicle in question in relation to the dates of 22nd August 2023 and 11th September 2023 and therefore we can be satisfied, to the standard required, that the data collected and processed in respect of that vehicle on that date is personal data pertaining to you. We can confirm that your name and address were provided by the DVLA on 26th August 2023. This data was provided as you were identified as the registered keeper of vehicle in respect of a breach of the parking terms and conditions that took place within Mary Street, Carlisle on 22nd August 2023 Parkingeye can confirm that we issued a total of 5 items of correspondence to yourself to date prior to any further recovery or legal action. The address used was the address as held by the DVLA for the Registered Keeper of the vehicle. As no response was received to any of the correspondence sent, Parkingeye contacted a tracing agent to obtain any potential alternative address. To which end, an alternative address for yourself was provided and further items of correspondence were sent. Please note, whilst Experian are a credit referencing agency, no credit check has been undertaken in relation to this Parking Charge. We only utilise their tracing service in order to obtain alternative contact details. For clarity, personal data sent to our tracing agent is done so via an encrypted transmission route, therefore we do not hold physical copies of the same. The categories of personal data we send to them is your name, address and vehicle details. As Parkingeye did not receive any response to the correspondence sent, we entered into legal proceedings on 8th January 2024 in order to recover the outstanding sum owed for the Parking Charge and further costs were incurred. We can confirm that your name and address were provided by the DVLA on 15th September 2023. This data was provided as you were identified as the registered keeper of vehicle in respect of a breach of the parking terms and conditions that took place within Mary Street, Carlisle on 11th September 2023 . Parkingeye can confirm that we issued a total of 5 items of correspondence to yourself to date prior to any further recovery or legal action. The address used was the address as held by the DVLA for the Registered Keeper of the vehicle. As no response was received to any of the correspondence sent, Parkingeye contacted a tracing agent to obtain any potential alternative address. To which end, an alternative address for yourself was provided and further items of correspondence were sent. Please note, whilst Experian are a credit referencing agency, no credit check has been undertaken in relation to this Parking Charge. We only utilise their tracing service in order to obtain alternative contact details. For clarity, personal data sent to our tracing agent is done so via an encrypted transmission route, therefore we do not hold physical copies of the same. The categories of personal data we send to them is your name, address and vehicle details. As Parkingeye did not receive any response to the correspondence sent, we contacted our recovery agent in order to recover the outstanding sum owed against the Parking Charge. For clarity, personal data sent to our recovery agent is done so via an encrypted transmission route, therefore we do not hold physical copies of the same. The categories of personal data we send to them is your name, address and vehicle details. We can confirm, in line with s.(1)(h) of Article 15, that no automated decision-making or profiling, referred to in Article 22(1) and (4), has been undertaken in relation to personal data in this case. We note that Article 22 states as follows, “The data subject shall have the right not to be subject to a decision based solely on automated processing, including profiling, which produces legal effects concerning him or her or similarly significantly affects him or her”. We can confirm that you have not been subject to such a decision and that the processing falls outside the scope of Article 22. Any automated checks undertaken by Parkingeye in relation to ANPR data will only result in a decision not to issue a Parking Charge. Should the ANPR data we process indicate that a breach of the parking terms and conditions has taken place, any subsequent decision to issue a Parking Charge will require that data to pass through a substantial checking process that includes human intervention. Please note that the UK General Data Protection Regulation provides the following further rights:   •             The right to request from Parkingeye access, rectification or erasure of your personal data; •             The right to request from Parkingeye restriction of processing of your personal data; •             The right to object to the processing of your personal data.   Please note that some of these rights are not absolute and will only apply in certain circumstances. We will review each request we receive in respect of these rights. We do not have to agree with a request but if we refuse, we will still contact the data subject within one month to explain why. You also have the right to lodge a complaint with the Information Commissioner’s Office (ICO). For further information, please refer to the ICO website, www.ico.org.uk. You may also seek a judicial remedy. For further information about your rights as a data subject, plus information about the categories of data we process, data transfers, the legal basis for our processing, and the purposes of processing, please visit: https://www.Parkingeye.co.uk/privacy-policy/   Yours sincerely,   Parkingeye Privacy Team
    • Thanks to you both.  I'd guessed it was CCTV, but the creeps who sneak up and take photos of the vehicles also use time stamps. BTW TT98, what you have received is not a fine, you can never be clobbered for the statutory consequences of not paying a fine - because it isn't one.  It's an invoice, and they have the same right to sue you as you have the right to sue anyone as a layperson who doesn't pay you for an invoice.  It's just a simple civil matter about a "debt".  Nothing worse.
    • As Dave has already said there are Consideration periods and Grace periods to be taken into account when private parking is involved. Before looking at that the first thing is to check whether your PCN complies with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4 which regulates the private parking rogues. They were very good at twice quoting from the Act but they missed Section 9[2][e] (e)state that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper— (i)to pay the unpaid parking charges; They didn't do that so they have not complied with the Act which means they cannot pursue you as the keeper only as the driver which they said themselves when quoting Section 9 [2][f] . In addition they are supposed to quote the period of parking but instead given the times of arrival and departure of your vegicle which is not the same thing.Obviously their times  include the driving times to the parking place plus later from the parking place to the exit. So removing those times from your 15 minute overtime and that doesn't include extra minutes when your car was held up by stopping for pedestrians or other cars passing in front of you as well as returning the shopping trolley and possibly  queueing to get out of the car park. And that doesn't include children and or disabled people causing greater differences betwen their times and the actual parking period which is what is specified in the Act. It is perfectly possible that as much as fifteen minutes longer  could be taken in a larger busy car park compared to their spurious ANPR times. You may have noticed sating well done to you in his post. that was for two reasons. The first for giving us all the necessary details surrounding the alleged breach. the second well done was for not appealing a possibly giving away who was driving. As you the keeper is not responsible now for paying the PCN and Highview do not know who was driving they will have difficulty if the take you to Court since Courts do not accept that the keeper and the driver are the same person which is quite right considering that quite often family members often drive as opposed to the keeper as can loads of other people drive your  who have valid insurance motor policies. So don't worry even if you have to go to Court as the odds are in your favour and that's before we see the contract and Witness Statement which often give more ammunition against them.
    • Thanks. The way the court system works, with fixed costs included in the claim, means you have nothing to lose by fighting on. Give in now and you pay them their claim. Lose in court and you pay them their claim.  So why not fight? In fact were you to lose in court it's highly likely that the judge would increase the amount by their £25 hearing fee but then decrease it by disallowing the £70 Unicorn Food Tax they have just made up and added to the claim. It was however a mistake not to park in the far bay. But what about their negligence in allowing a disgracefully-parked vehicle to stay where it was and prevent your BB access? In any case, there is a long, long way to go before court.  A lot of these companies start a court claim in the hope that the motorist will wet themself and give in.  If a case is robustly defended and a decent Witness Statement produced, a good 20% of the time they drop the cases.  We'll support you all the way.
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G24/Trace/BW ANPR PCN appeal refused - now Letter of Claim - Costa Coffee Car Park Perivale, West London, off the A40


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Parking area: Costa Coffee Car Park Perivale, West London, off the A40

 

The alleged infringement took place in February 2022 but I was NOT notified of the parking infringement till August 2022 when the matter went to a debt collection agency, thus I was not given the opportunity to dispute the fine with the original Parking agency.

Circumstances of the incident: I was transporting 2 elderly gentlemen. Both are frail. One is registered disabled, the other is frail with multiple medical conditions including prostate cancer, blood clots in his leg, head attack and open-heart surgery. The delay was because one of these gentlemen (Mr X) needed my assistance while using the bathroom due to his prostate/ bladder problems- I was involved in his personal care while he was using the bathroom which resulted in me getting back the car 11 minutes late. I overstayed in a car park by 11 minutes above the maximum of 90 minutes.

I was not notified by the company that operates the car park (G24) at all and had no idea of the parking infringement.

I first found out about the fine when I was contacted by a company called TRACE which is a debt collection agency. The original fine was £100, but after the case was passed to TRACE it had risen to £160.

I wrote back to TRACE requesting details of the alleged infringement together with evidence and they sent me a copy of the parking ticket issued by G24 which I received in the first week of September 2022.

I wrote to G24 in September and informed them that I did not receive their original ticket and also explained my circumstances.  They said "as your appeal has been rejected, any further correspondence may not receive a response". I have not made an appeal to them because I didn't know I had been issued a parking fine.  They said that I either pay or deal with the debt collection agency. I attempted to lodge an appeal with The Independent Appeals Service (www.theIAS.org) but my ticket number was not recognised. I also attempted an appeal via the Parking on Private Land Appeal service (POPLA www.popla.co.uk) but they wanted a reference number from G24. I emailed G24 but the email is a "no reply" email so I did not receive a response regarding both these appeals.

I wrote back to TRACE and provided them with an explanation of my circumstances as well as evidence (I supplied Mr Y's disabled badge as well as a medical report for Mr X), but my case was then passed from TRACE to BW Legal (another debt collecting agency).

I have been in contact with BW Legal several times and again I passed them the evidence to support my explanation. They seemed dissatisfied with my evidence and demanded further proof for it, but this is not possible given the circumstance- I was helping a very frail elederly gentleman with his personal care. They have now issued me with a "letter of claim" demanding that I either agree to own the debt, agree to some of the debt, don't know whether I own the debt, or dispute the debt.

I'm not sure where to go with this, how I should answer the "letter of claim" which states "if a payment OR A RESPONSE is not received from you by 13 January 2023 we are instructed to issue a County Court claim without further reference to you", however they have given a very narrow margin of reasons for disputing the claim, such as "I don't owe the debt" or "legal problems with the credit agreement". 

 

The debt agency has given me a letter with the estimated costs of taking me to court:
principal= £160,
Interest= £10.50,
Court fees = £35,
Solicitor fee = £50,
total £255.50

 

I would appreciate your thoughts on the matter. It seems very unfair and unreasonable.

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Thanks for your detailed explanation.

 

Firstly, it's not a fine, a private company doesn't have the power to fine you, what you have received is a simple invoice.

 

The good news is that there is a 10-minute minimum grace period to exit a site, in both the government's Code of Practice and in both trade associations' Codes of Practice.  Clearly an extra minute is fine for assisting elderly, frail people.  Indeed, equality laws would back you up.  So far so good.  You are clearly legally in the right.

 

As this is the first time this has happened to you, it's completely normal that you wrote to G24, Trace, BW Legal, etc. and expected them to see sense.

 

We on the forum however have seen this hundreds of times before.  You are dealing with spivs, charlatans and fleecers who are only after £££££.  They will never see sense.

 

What you need to do now it to stop being polite, you need to reply to the conmerchants, ridicule their claim, show you've sussed them as the fleecers thy are, and make it clear that if they took you to court they would only end up with a huge hole in their wallet.  We call this the "snotty letter" strategy.  If you do a search for "snotty letter" on the site, you'll soon get the idea.

We could do with some help from you.

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  • dx100uk changed the title to G24/Trace/BW PCN appeal refused - now Letter of Claim - Costa Car Park Perivale

Also - belt & braces - get onto the CEO of Costa Coffee  https://ceoemail.com/s.php?id=ceo-10314&c=Costa Coffee-CEO  explain what happened, and demand they call their dogs off.

 

If you're sure this is a Costa car park, rather than a retail park including Costa, i would think they would intervene immediately.  In any case, nothing ventured ...

 

We could do with some help from you.

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you need to reply to BW with a snotty letter.

however.

 

we need you to fill this out first:

 

and scan up all letter or comms to everyone in/out (bother sides of all letters) to one mass PDF after CAREFULLY reading our upload guide.

 

dx

 

 

 

 

  • Like 1

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Could you please post up the PCN so we can see if they have complied with the law.

 

You will need to remove your personal details such as your name and address as well as the car registration number.

 

Please do not remove dates and times.

 

As the PCN was not received by you is the address where you are currently living or a new address 

 

The quicker you reply to our questions the quicker we can show you how to avoid paying the PCN.

 

Time is important now as you may have to go to Court if we cannot beat them down before then 

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The car Park is for use by Costa Coffee and KFC customers- these are the only two shops there. 

 

It seems that he CEO link does not work, as it happens,

 

I was taking these two elderly gentlemen to meet up in Costa for the first time after covid - as a way to socialise and improve their mental health!> 

Edited by dx100uk
unnecessary previous post quote removed
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I will answer the questions on the link regarding "You have received a Court Claim ISSUED IN ENGLAND & WALES What you need to do" but as yet I have NOT received a court claim, just a letter threatening court action. Is that the same thing? 

 

I have been asked to answer the following questions as per the link: https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/357877-you-have-received-a-court-claim-issued-in-england-wales-what-you-need-to-do/

 

 

Edited by dx100uk
unnecessary previous post quote removed
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Nope,

 

You're looking at the wrong sticky.

 

DX said to use this one...

 

 

 

Could you also please scan up the "letter of claim", just so it can be verified.

 

The fleecers often deliberately  use languge that can easily be misconstrued!

We could do with some help from you.

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Their case against you is extremely weak.

 

But that doesn't really matter.  The fleecers regularly start absolutely hopeless court cases because they think the motorist may give in.  They are particularly interested in -

 

1.  motorists who don't reply to a Letter of Claim.  They might not reply to a claim form either.  So a nice easy default win for the charlatans.

 

2.  people who appeal, indulge in lengthy correspondence and in general are polite and accept the spivs' systems as official and to be respected.  That's you.

 

As others have said, we needs to see the original PCN and LoC, and we need the sticky filled in.  The clock is ticking towards court.

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

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1 Date of the infringement 16/02/2022

 

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] I did not receive any notification till I was contacted by TRACE the debt collection agency in August 2022. I asked for the original PCN to be sent to me. 

 

3 Date received 06/09/2022

 

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?] yes

 

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? yes

 

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal] I missed the 28 deadline for the appeal because I didn't receive the PCN on time, so I did not use the official appeal process.

 

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up Yes, I have attached their email reply below. they say that "my appeal was rejected, but I didn't go through the proper appeals process as I didnt receive the PCN in time. 

 

7 Who is the parking company? G24

 

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Alperton Lane, Off Western Avenue, Greenford, UB6 8AA.

 

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under.

IAS - I tried to appeal via the AIS website but my ticket number was not recognised by the system. 

 

 

 

From: <[email protected]>
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2022, 3:00 am
Subject: RE: Contractual Parking Charge Notice XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
To: XXXXXXXXXX


Dear Mr XXXXXXXXXXXXXX

RE: Contractual Parking Charge Notice XXXXXXXXXXX

Thank you for your email.

The first Contractual Parking Charge Notice was issued on 16.02.22 and set to the address provided by the DVLA.

Please direct all further correspondense to the debt company.

As your appeal has been rejected, any further correspondence may not receive a  response, the options below are still open to you.

Unfortunatley your period of appeal has expired as explained on the back of your Contractual Parking Charge Notice.

You now have one of the following options available to you:

1. Pay the outstanding Parking Charge. Payment of your Contractual Parking Charge Notice can be made via the payment line: 0333 733 3000 or by sending a cheque or postal order to G24 Limited, PO Box 3320, Gerrards Cross, Buckinghamshire, SL9 8WT.

2. If you choose to do nothing, we will seek to recover the monies owed to us via our debt recovery procedures and may proceed with Court action against you.

The Independent Appeals Service (www.theIAS.org) provides an Alternative Dispute Resolution scheme for disputes of this type. We may engage with the IAS Non-Standard Appeals Service at our discretion should a dispute arise over this charge in the future.

Appeals Team
G24 Ltd

 

 

PCN anon.pdf letter of claim.pdf BWLegal reply form.pdf

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  • dx100uk changed the title to G24/Trace/BW ANPR PCN appeal refused - now Letter of Claim - Costa Coffee Car Park Perivale, West London, off the A40

was your car at the time registered to another address?

we need to see your appeals too please? and their replies.

one mass multipage PDF is ok.

 

you need to reply with a snotty letter by but close too 30days from 8th dec.

 

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Thanks.  Will get back to you after work this evening.

We could do with some help from you.

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Thanks for all the information.

 

So it's a proper Letter of Claim so dx is right, in January you need to reply ridiculing their claim and showing you would be big trouble for them if they were daft enough to do court.  They generally give up at this point and go and find someone else to hassle who might be scared and give in.

 

They really haven't got a leg to stand on.

 

What is strange is that you didn't receive any of the original correspondence.  Is it possible you moved and didn't update the vehicle log book?

We could do with some help from you.

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just type 

no need to keep hitting quote .

 

makes the thread twice as long and difficult to find the start of your reply on a small screened device

 

dx

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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A little light has just come on in my brain that we have a huge number of G24 cases regarding a particularly bad scam they have going on in a car park in Stoke.  Despite all their bluster and threats, they've taken no-one to court.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

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Where does anything say it is FINE??

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

Thanks for all this.  Now to read through it all.

 

10 minutes ago, Hamz909 said:

I must say I'm finding all this very draining.

Don't worry.

 

Their case is ridiculous.

 

You are legally in the right.

 

They won't take you to court.  A snotty letter in January will see them crawl back under their stone.

 

Even if by some horror you became one of the very, very few people they take to court - you would win.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

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As you were told +20 posts 2 pages ago 

 

Use our enhanced Google search box for snotty letter.

 

Dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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I have written multiple letters, I explained about the elderly people I was transporting, I was only 11 minutes late, it was due to a care issue with one of the elderly gentlemen etc.. all not made any difference. 

Not sure what else I can say.

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