Arrow/NCO - old Vaniquis Card Debt - New wrongly dated default! **SETTLED**

[dx100uk]

can you please stop swearing no need for it

 

use the sites listed on upload pdfreducer etc.

 

yes need the fmotl letters too please

everything. 

[dx100uk]

no good you hiding dates and figure please

put them all BACK!!

 

dx

 

[SardoN]

Swearing I did not swear

 

I can't put the dates back .. it's already redacted..

 

I'll have to do it again.. I do see why the day of the month matters.. I redacted them for good reason

 

Swearing I did not swear

 

I can't put the dates back .. it's already redacted..

 

I'll have to do it again.. I do see why the day of the month matters.. I redacted them for good reason

 

What is an fmotl letter ??

[Badtimes123]

FMOTL - Free man on the land, referred to affectionately by dx as twaddle

 

dx - there was a letter in the bundle requesting Deed of assignment..

[SardoN]

why do they dates & figures matter? surely they can be used to identify me.

 

That's the lot 

[dx100uk]

is there an IP address on that agreement where it states signed at:

 

yes or no 

 

dx

 

[SardoN]

No IP .. that redacted section contained my full name and the date and time it was I presume electronically signed, which was sometime in 2014

 

 

[Badtimes123]

That section you redacted with your name doesn't look authentic to me.. perhaps a reconstruction? it just looks out of place with formatting etc..

[SardoN]

it actually contains a third party signature which I also redacted.. it could be an electronic signature can it not?

 

Also badtimes, you said above somewhere that no default or whatever is a good thing?

 

Not sure if you have read the entire thread, but I've approached all the credit reference agencies and there is no record of vanquis or NCO/Arrow.

 

Zoomed inCCA signature at bottom.pdf

 

[Badtimes123]

Yes I read the whole thread, which is why I said this should be good for you!

 

I don't know everything, just trying to help and I'm sure others will correct any glaring mistakes in my comments

[SardoN]

No I appreciate it.

 

I never received a Default Notice not that I'm aware of. Which lead me down the path of obtaining ones credit reports.

 

I approached the main ones like Equifax, Experian and TransUnion.. No record of vanquis or Arrow/NCO. And I've recently obtained up to date ones too and there is no trace.

 

Is it not possible the that OC sold the debt and just passed the file onto NCO/Arrow for them to add a default later?

 

The reason I ask is because NCO have recently just said, they've added the default to my file. I don't see how this is possible if it didn't exist in the first place.

 

It is my understanding that if a debt is sold to a DCA, then a default should be registered prior to that debt being sold and as you stated, by the OC (original creditor).

 

Speaking of sold.. Arrow/NCO lay claim that the debt was never bought or sold to them. However, this is not true. I spoke to vanquis on the phone and they said the debt was sold to them.

 

Now, if you take a look at the "freeman twaddle" in my bundle PDF,  page 8 is the response from NCO and take a look in the middle about the deed of novation, they state that the DOV is not relevant in this case, because the debt wasn't purchased. However, it was! 

 

[Badtimes123]

Yes they've just simply rebutted your claim to it, I believe this is because you requested it from NCO, not Arrow.. NCO are simply acting on behalf of Arrow so they are quite right and accurate in their claim that they haven't purchased the debt. Anyway let's forget the Deed of Assignment.. or whatever you call it because you have no legal right to see it anyway

 

Have you got a SAR running to Vanquis yet? that's your next step here

Edited May 20, 2022 by Badtimes123
clarity

[SardoN]

NCO and Arrow are one and the same apparently. 

 

I will SAR vanquis next 

[Badtimes123]

Just now, SardoN said:

NCO and Arrow are one and the same apparently

Yeh I have seen the comments about that, just strange that they send letters like they do. I suspect NCO are Arrows in-house DCA - I think dx would say same office just a few desks closer to the toilet

[SardoN]

I googled SAR Vanquis and it bought me back to the consumer action group and a vast number of posts on the subject.

 

Lots of people querying SAR vanquis and vanquis not providing all information, talks about sending in £1 as per CCA request for copy which is then disputed etc.

 

If I've stumbled across this, then it seems I'm gonna be subjected to it too. Under a SAR one should obtain all information but seems some people have been mugged off.

 

Talks about going to court etc..

 

Total nightmare, you know I'd be better off calling the plebs at NCO and and cutting some kind of cash settlement deal and laying this to rest.

 

Seems like a lot of effort on all our parts and I have most certainly appreciative of all the help from you guys especially Dx as he's been responding from day dot.

 

But if in the end I need to pay this DCA then what's the point in it all.

 

I wouldn't have never queried this, if they were on my credit report in the first place.

[Badtimes123]

12 minutes ago, SardoN said:

you know I'd be better off calling the plebs at NCO and and cutting some kind of cash settlement deal and laying this to rest.

No - because that's the reason these parasites are in business, not because they have a legitimate business, but because people roll over and pay them..

 

If this was an enforceable debt, why do you think Vanquis sold it? don't give in now to DCA's with no power to enforce make them prove it first! I would bet my house they can't produce enforceable paperwork.

 

SAR to vanquis, don't google it, just click this: SAR

 

--------------------

 

PS. sounds to me now that you are aware you had a credit card and this has pushed you to think you're going to lose in the long run... am I right?

Edited May 20, 2022 by Badtimes123

[dx100uk]

nco are part of the arrows group.

by stating our client ( which will be stated on their letters as arrows at the top), all they are doing is what all DCA groups do, make it appear its in some kind of hierarchy chain, trying to con you another level has more powers . ofcourse they don't, just differing desks in the same big call centre with some desks being manned by blokes in a different coloured skirt sitting nearer or further away from the bog door.

 

just hit SAR and send that to vanquis as is after filing in yours and their details

no need to change nowt else, and most certainly no need to even consider paying anything yet.

 

the agreement details at the bottom right are from a sticker or the returned application form you sent and placed on the last page before photo copied. it states that if you read things properly. but ofcourse the T&C's could have come from anywhere , here in old upload arrows filing cabinet....certainly not from vanquis themselves. if you do a bit of research HERE on vanquis threads with uploads, your paperwork looks nothing like others for that period.

 

did those T&C's have your name and address on them in the correct part on the 1st page? and if they did, was this your correct address for that time of take out in 2014.

 

as for your continued bumbling's about this 'default'

i've already carefully explained it once here but i'll do it again as it's not sunk in.

 

the debt owner can default you - meaning adding a D to the monthly report. (which only you and they can see anyway)

that is TOTALLY DIFFERENT from issuing a default notice letter under the consumer credit act sec 87/88 etc. that then gives the OC the OPTION to register a defaulted date in the debt summary line on your credit file that all can see. 

ONLY the original creditor can do that, a debt buyer cannot in 99% of cases.

 

the DCA have said nowt about issuing a default notice....it's all hot air and pointless as the debt isn't showing anyway for whatever reason.

which probably means the OC did issue a default notice more than 6yrs ago so the debt vanishes on the DN's 6th B'day, never to return.but that does NOT mean it's not still owed.

 

oh and the FmOtL letter is a classic one...me sovereign name of one legged fruit bat family xxxxx....

 

if you could just remove the A/C number column from the statement so we can see the rest this would be helpful along with putting back all dates and figures in the whole PDF please

and you DONT need to hide anyone elses details just your name address and any card/dca debt ref numbers.

its simply to stop a dca from finding you here and blowing your anon status.

 

so sar time

sit on your hands

and until/if you ever get a letter of claim you IGNORE everything they send,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Badtimes123]

Well I wasn't too far off!! me thinks I'm learning haha

 

Thanks for returning dx and confirming it all in one post.

 

Sardon - do it! I'm not sure I've ever seen dx write so many words to someone

[SardoN]

14 hours ago, Badtimes123 said:

SAR to vanquis, don't google it, just click this: SAR

 

I take it I should use this template that begins with

[Their address]

[Date]

Dear Sir/Madam

GENERAL DATA PROTECTION REGULATIONS - SUBJECT ACCESS REQUEST

ACCOUNT /REF NUMBER XXXXXXXX

 

 

?

 

14 hours ago, Badtimes123 said:

 

PS. sounds to me now that you are aware you had a credit card and this has pushed you to think you're going to lose in the long run... am I right?

I wasn't aware I had a card from vanquis and like I said, I was obtaining credit reports to establish the validity of NCO/Arrow and there was no trace of vanquis/arrow/nco on my credit report. This is the reason the dispute has commenced. In addition, I have no past correspondence from vanquis at all which is bizarre. 

[Badtimes123]

1 - Yes

2 - Ok

 

Then

 

14 hours ago, dx100uk said:

sit on your hands

and until/if you ever get a letter of claim you IGNORE everything they send,

 

But just to be clear, ignore everything BUT a letter of claim

 

Good luck

[SardoN]

Thanks dude

 

I'm just going through the response from DX but I'll sort out the SAR and have that sent of sharpish via Royal Mail signed for...

 

18 hours ago, Badtimes123 said:

SAR to vanquis, don't google it, just click this: SAR

 

I take it I should use this template that begins with

[Their address]

[Date]

Dear Sir/Madam

GENERAL DATA PROTECTION REGULATIONS - SUBJECT ACCESS REQUEST

ACCOUNT /REF NUMBER XXXXXXXX

 

 

?

 

18 hours ago, Badtimes123 said:

 

PS. sounds to me now that you are aware you had a credit card and this has pushed you to think you're going to lose in the long run... am I right?

I wasn't aware I had a card from vanquis and like I said, I was obtaining credit reports to establish the validity of NCO/Arrow and there was no trace of vanquis/arrow/nco on my credit report. This is the reason the dispute has commenced. In addition, I have no past correspondence from vanquis at all which is bizarre. 

 

18 hours ago, dx100uk said:

nco are part of the arrows group.

by stating our client ( which will be stated on their letters as arrows at the top), all they are doing is what all DCA groups do, make it appear its in some kind of hierarchy chain, trying to con you another level has more powers . ofcourse they don't, just differing desks in the same big call centre with some desks being manned by blokes in a different coloured skirt sitting nearer or further away from the bog door.

 

- That's actually pretty descriptive and probably accurate in terms of them sitting near the Bog.

 

just hit SAR and send that to vanquis as is after filing in yours and their details

no need to change nowt else, and most certainly no need to even consider paying anything yet.

 

- OK I'm on it.

 

the agreement details at the bottom right are from a sticker or the returned application form you sent and placed on the last page before photo copied. it states that if you read things properly. but ofcourse the T&C's could have come from anywhere , here in old upload arrows filing cabinet....certainly not from vanquis themselves. if you do a bit of research HERE on vanquis threads with uploads, your paperwork looks nothing like others for that period.

- I will have a look at the threads on here for vanquis and compare.

 

did those T&C's have your name and address on them in the correct part on the 1st page? and if they did, was this your correct address for that time of take out in 2014.

 

- There was no address, as you read it within the contained PDF is what and how I received that paperwork in it's entirety from NCO.

 

as for your continued bumbling's about this 'default'

i've already carefully explained it once here but i'll do it again as it's not sunk in.

 

the debt owner can default you - meaning adding a D to the monthly report. (which only you and they can see anyway)

that is TOTALLY DIFFERENT from issuing a default notice letter under the consumer credit act sec 87/88 etc. that then gives the OC the OPTION to register a defaulted date in the debt summary line on your credit file that all can see. 

ONLY the original creditor can do that, a debt buyer cannot in 99% of cases.

 

the DCA have said nowt about issuing a default notice....it's all hot air and pointless as the debt isn't showing anyway for whatever reason.

which probably means the OC did issue a default notice more than 6yrs ago so the debt vanishes on the DN's 6th B'day, never to return.but that does NOT mean it's not still owed.

 

- I do apologies to you for having to have made you repeat yourself DX. It's sunk it now. I do understand it now.

 

oh and the FmOtL letter is a classic one...me sovereign name of one legged fruit bat family xxxxx....

 

if you could just remove the A/C number column from the statement so we can see the rest this would be helpful along with putting back all dates and figures in the whole PDF please 

 

-  I cannot simply put back redacted data. Those redacted bits are permanent. I'd have to merge all those documents again and start all over, highlight sections of the document I need to redact, now I don't mind doing it again but it worries me as surely a DCA could possibly identify me if they read through a particular thread find a one legged fruit bat client of theirs and search for the balance of the alleged outstanding debt (which is not a lot anyway) and the actual date of the letter sent out and by whatever member of staff who is sitting closet to the bog who composed the correspondence and that in itself would be enough to be identified surely

The only reason i redacted the correspondence the way I did, i.e. day of the month only removed, the balance and any names etc both my own and bog mob and obviously my account number, reference numbers etc 

 

and you DONT need to hide anyone elses details just your name address and any card/dca debt ref numbers.

its simply to stop a dca from finding you here and blowing your anon status.

 

 

so sar time

sit on your hands

and until/if you ever get a letter of claim you IGNORE everything they send,

 

- Just want to say I really appreciate the help DX. Thanks to badtimes too for  jumping in and throwing in a few pointers. All of which is all appreciated.

OK I'm going to get on top of this SAR next and get it out the way.

 

 

 

 

[Badtimes123]

5 minutes ago, SardoN said:

OK I'm going to get on top of this SAR next and get it out the way.

Yes! then sit back and relax for a month awaiting their reply.

 

That paperwork (assuming that's everything they sent as you say) is not enforceable, it's missing key elements that would prove authenticity and is likely a cobbled together reconstruction from stuff they found in the trash hoping you except it and pay them.. this should be unlawful, but hey that's what they do!

 

The reason dx was asking for unredacted is so we are able to tailor the advice more effectively, that's all.

[SardoN]

I just called vanquis to get the proper official address to send the SAR and the woman on the phone said I can set it up over the phone don't' worry.

 

I then said, that I'd rather send in the correspondence in writing.

 

Anyway she couldn't verify me using a memorable word and then went on to ask for my passport  We're not going down that route. Nor do I have the time to faff about with Vanquis.

 

I then asked her to confirm if the debt was sold to Arrow Global and she said yes and it was sold on them in June 2019

 

I then asked if the account was ever defaulted and she said that would be uncovered in the SAR but nothing is showing to hand on the system notes, but she also confirmed that before an account is sold normally they are defaulted. 

 

Mine wasn't and if this is all legit it would be mind blowing.

 

Anyway I've got the address and SAR will be posted today.
 

[dx100uk]

Don't believe what phone jockeys say too much 

 

Get the SAR back and then we will deal properly rather than guess work  

 

Dx

[SardoN]

No worries I'm on the way to the post office now to post it.

 

It'll be sent 1st class signed for.

 

If NCO contact me before Vanquis return the SAR, should I just ignore them ?