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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
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PCM/Trace/Gladstone 2*PCN's - ignored everything - Residential Parking - now gladstones letter


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Hello I would love some help please, 

 

I have received a letter from Gladstone Solicitors regarding 2 pcns from a car I use to own from a residential car park where I live which is housing association.

 

I have had a quite a few but they have pick up on these 2 and decided to send these to Gladstone Sols and this is the first letter I have received from them.

 

It doesn’t state anywhere in tenancy about parking and would like to know if I should ignore or what I should prepare for or write back in return etc as the last thing I need is bailiffs or ccjs as I literally have no money from my ex leaving me in absolute debt and slowly starting to climb out of it.

 

Thank you 

 

gladstone (1).pdf

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Hi.

 

You need to edit your pdf please. I can read the car reg without too much effort and could probably read other things through the bits of post-it with a bit of effort.

 

Have a read of our upload guide and it tells you how to block out text.

 

HB

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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doing pdf now

 

please complete this:

 

Have you received a Parking Ticket? - Private Land Parking Enforcement - Consumer Action Group

 

PDF done

you can't get bailiffs until its been to court.

 

have you any other paperwork?

 

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please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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No I kept getting letters from Trace which I would rip up and ignore and I haven’t had my car that these charges relate to since 2019.

 

This is first letter I have had from solicitors I usually only ever get Trace contact me through letters or Text messages 

 

Thank you deleting PDF 🙏🏻

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so you have moved since you used to park in that private estate?

 

dx

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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so why after being here for over 10yrs and having felt the wrath of Courts and bailiffs before are you still ripping things up and not asking for help earlier to avoid situations escalating by taking what you think might be the correct actions yourself?

 

DX

  • Like 1

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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If you can be anything in this world be Kind???

 

I haven’t come here to be spoken to like this as I have a million and one reasons

 

I am asking for help now which if you are not willing to help either then thank you for taking a look into my case asking me questions editing my PDF and then judging me????

 

I’ll see if there is someone else who can not judge but can just provide help and guidance 

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well try not to make our free voluntary help more difficult by not doing stupid things..

 

can you fill that link out i posted above?

 

but the bottom line is you are safe to ignore gladdy's until/unless you receive a letter of claim.

as since you were last here there now exist the pre action protocol they must abide by.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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The regulars here are certainly available to help.

 

However, these threads are read by other motorists in a similar situation so it's important that we point out what to do - but also what not to do.

 

Please fill in the sticky in post 3, twice (once for each ticket).  This will help us see if the fleecers have sent out their demands within the correct legal time frame, 'cos a lot of the time they don't.

Edited by FTMDave

We could do with some help from you.

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Thank you for you help.

 

I have used this site previously mainly for council pcns which helped me a lot and I have even attended court before through using this site and won a few appeals one when I was heavily pregnant with my son who is now 9. 

 

I had a few private ones which I was fighting but due to stress etc a family member paid them for me which is why I never got to continue appealing them.

 

These ones all of a sudden have appeared out of no where and because I know how useless Trace is I do usually ignore their letters of demands for money and never hear anything after a while. 

 

With this letter from Solicitors I have decided to ask for help rather then ignore any more so thank you for your continuing support and help.

 

Sorry what do you mean by sticker in post?

 

I haven’t been on here in a while and I’m very not up to date with it all I’m sorry. 

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please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Click on this link

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/391121-have-you-received-a-parking-ticket/

 

You will see a list of questions to answer if you originally got a windscreen ticket.  And a different one if it were ANPR cameras that clocked your plate.  Whichever one it was, please copy and paste the questions and answer as best you can.  Any info., even if paltry, will help us build up a case to fight the fleecers.

 

  • Like 1

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

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1 hour ago, munksey2001 said:

from a car I use to own from a residential car park where I live which is housing association.

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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I understand why you paid those when you did but once you pay word gets around and future parking tickets don't get cancelled by them as they think you will give in again. But prepare for the long haul.

 

Once we have seen your PCNs with their dates we should be able to see if they have gone wrong already pursuing you. Still doesn't mean they will give up even when you know they are ripping you off.

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  • dx100uk changed the title to PCM/Trace/Gladstone 2*PCN's - ignored everything - Residential Parking - now gladstones letter

I know what you mean by once you make one payment they think they have you!! I totally agree with you and in all honesty I have ignored the majority of them and they all went away this is the furthest a private parking ticket has gone so this is why I need the help now. 

 

following questions....

 

1 The date of infringement?

05/04/2019 and 22/04/2019 (date of charge)
 

2 Have you yet appealed to the parking company yet? [Y/N?]

No and No
 

If you have then please post up whatever you sent and how you sent it and the date you sent it,

suitably redacted. [as a PDF- follow the upload guide]

 

Has there been a response?

N/a
 

Please AS A PDFFILE  ONLY ..post it up as well, suitably redacted. - follow the upload guide]

 

If you haven't appealed yet - .........DONT ! seek advice on your topic first.

 

Have you received a Notice To Keeper? (NTK) [must be received by you between 29-56 days]

I think so but not 100% sure 
 

What date is on it?

Not sure 

 

Did the NTK provide photographic evidence?

Not sure
 

[scan up BOTHSIDES to ONE PDF of the PCN and your NTK - follow the upload guide]

 

3 Did the NTK mention Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA) [Y/N?]

Not sure
 

4 If you appealed after receiving the NTK,

did the parking company give you any information regarding the further appeals process?

[it is well known that parking companies will reject any appeal whatever the circumstances]

N/a
 

5 Who is the parking company?

Parking Control Management (UK) Ltd
 

6. Where exactly [Carpark name and town] did you park?

Romford, Essex (Residential Road)

 

thank you for your help 

 

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you haven't received any letter of claim yet, you've not moved, so a 'solicitors' letter is simply them acting as another DCA just like the previous lot and trace do.

safe to ignore.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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19 hours ago, munksey2001 said:

I have had a quite a few

Thank you for posting the info we asked for.

 

This sentence worries me.  Are you saying there are likely to be more than two tickets?  These companies are normally reluctant to do court for a single ticket as anything they might win will be eaten up in legal costs, but if there are several tickets it is highly likely they will start a court claim some point.

 

The good news is that residential parking claims are the hardest for these fleecers to win.  So -

 

1.  Ignore Gladstone's letter.  It's not a Letter Before Claim and in the short term they will do nothing.

 

2.  Get a SAR off to PCM tomorrow so we can get to the bottom of how many of these invoices they are and if they bothered to follow the law when sending them out.  Simply send 2nd class post, but get a free Certificate of Posting from the post office.

 

Could you tell us briefly what the fleecers reckon you did wrong?

 

Plus what is your housing situation?  Presumably you have the right to park a vehicle outside your property?

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

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My housing association is L&Q London and Quadrant. I parked in my specified parking bay that the housing association allocated to me to my property but my permit wasn’t on show. I’m not even sure how many charges I have actually got on this car from PCM but more then certain it was more then 2. 
 

Thank you recommending a SAR letter to send (if there is a link to the template that would be fab thank you) and I will prepare now to send to them. 

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click sar

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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By the sound of it you haven't kept any of your PCNs. If you have one though could you please post it up-they still make mistakes on them despite the number of years they have been sending them out.  Intelligence is not their strongest point.

In fact it doesn't seem to be in their DNA at all.

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Your housing/parking situation is excellent, as you almost certainly have Supremacy of Contract which would see off any PCM court claim.

 

That's probably why they haven't done anything previously, except get pointless letters sent by Trace.

 

Anyway, get the SAR off tomorrow.  Come back here when you get a reply or if they don't respect the legal time frame.

 

If they are daft enough to send a Letter Before Claim later on they can be told by snotty letter that they would be thrashed in court.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

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Thank you so much my anxiety just coming on this website at the start and dealing with this matter goes through the roof but I know I have to face this sort of things or else it makes me so ill and now I feel a weight off my shoulders so thank you. I will get the SAR off tomorrow and get the proof of postage and 100% keep you updated. Thank you 

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no need to be anxious about any stupid speculative invoice scammers that's for sure.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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