maxine989 v NatWest ***WON***

[maxine989]

I won with egg today...

 

charges plus 16.9% plus court costs... YAY!! See how here:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/other-institutions-successes/57794-egg-battle-2.html

 

[doo]

Nice one, just off to check your thread:D

[Parkvale]

Maxine congratulations on your egg win . Don't shell out on to much, and have a smashing time.

[maxine989]

Maxine congratulations on your egg win . Don't shell out on to much, and have a smashing time.

 

It's a conicidence that we are buying some space off the property next door... they have been stalling and eventually put the price up... it turns out my egg win is almost exactly the same figure as the extra cost we a purchasing from next door.... In One Hand And Out Of The Other Eh!!

[maxine989]

I have finally got a court date for the other account claim...

 

'DISTRICT JUDGE ***** has considered the statements of the case and allocation questionnaires filed and allocated the claim to the small claims track.

 

The hearing of the claim will take place at 12.00 on the 16th JULY 2007 at ***** court and should take no longer than 1 hour.

 

It is ordered that:

1) This cliam is allocated to the small claims track and the parties are referred to Part 27 of the civil Procedure Rules and the Practice Direction of that PArt for guidance on how the hearing of the claim will be conducted.

 

2) The claim will be heard at **** on a date and time which is set out on a notice attached to this order or which will be sent to you later.

 

3) From the available papers, it is estimated that the hearing will take 1 hour. If a party is aware of a reason why this is estimate might be inaccurate, tht party must notify the cort immediately.

 

4) The parties are encouraged always to try and settle by negotiation. The parties are encouraged to contact each other with a view of trying to settle the case or narrow the issues.

 

5) The following paragraphs set out the Judge's directions for preparation for the hearing. Failure to comply with the directions may result in the case having to be adjourned and the party at fault having tp pay costs.

 

6) Each party must deliver to every other party and the court office copies of all documents on which that party intends to rely at the hearing no later than 14 days before the hearing.

 

7) The origianl documents must be bought to the hearing.

 

8) The judge may refuse to consider a document or take it into account if a copy of it has not been sent to all the parties as required by this order.

 

9) The documents to be sent to the parties and the cort must include the statements of all witnesses (including the parties themselves).

 

10) Witness staements must:

a. Start with the name of of th case and claim number;

b. State the full name and address of the witness;

c. Set out the witness's evidence clearly in numbered paragraphs on numbered pages;

d) End with this paragraph 'I believe the facts stated in this witness statement are true.' (or words to that effect); and

e. Be signed by the witness and dated.

 

11) The judge may refuse to hear evidence, or consider any blar blar... if not in accordance.

 

12) Neither party may rely on any report from an expert at the hearing unless permission has been granted by the court beforehand.

 

13)Because this order has been made by the court without considering representations from the parties, the parties have the right to apply to have the order set aside, varied or stayed. A party wishing to make an application must send or deliver the application to the court to arrive within 7 days of this order'.

 

So.... here begins to start of gathering info on what to do next.

 

Any advice is welcome.

 

Maxine

[GaryH]

Standard small claims track directions pretty much.

 

There is a CPR compliant Witness statement here -

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/82148-got-court-date-important.html#post732096

 

Amend to suit, becouse it was written with Lloyds in mind - although most of it is relevant.

[muggins73]

Hi maxine,

Firstly congrats on your egg win:D (apologies for the delay:o)

Secondly,excellent news that your court date is finally set. The victory jig (minus the naked ladies) should be comin' soon:p

[maxine989]

Hi maxine,

Firstly congrats on your egg win:D (apologies for the delay:o)

Secondly,excellent news that your court date is finally set. The victory jig (minus the naked ladies) should be comin' soon:p

 

ha haa yes.. very funny. I'll make sure I video it for my o/h to see incase the Naked Ladies do arrive after all...ha!!

 

I am just compiling various court bunbles (for different claims) at the moment... blimey... need more paper...more ink and more folders...

 

Did you put your court bundle in a folder with a contents page? Or am I going over the top?

 

I feel like I am back at uni doing assignments with deadlines...lol

 

Funny Natwest card called me today to tell me I had missed payment... which they have charged me for and made me go over my limit... which of course they have charged me for again making my balance even more over my limit.... Bugger!!

 

I told the woman at natwest that I hadn't been able to afford to pay because of the court costs, AQ fee, paper and ink I have been having to shell out for over the past few months in order to take Natwest cards to court for the £1900 they owe me!! She said that I would get a default notice in two weeks if I didn't pay up... Oh... If only it were as easy the other way round eh?...ha!!

 

Anyway... my court date for my Natwest Card is 2 July 2007

 

Natwest bank account... 16th July 2007... busy month... YIKES!!

 

I can't wait to get some dosh back so I can finally pay these bl**dy cards off once and for all!!

 

Hope all is good with you.

 

[maxine989]

Hiya... I am now compiling and printing out the court bundles ready to send off. I have added a section to the bundle called "Grounds for Claiming

Compounded Contractual Interest".

 

I have added it as part two of the bundle (part one is the witness statement). I have 12 parts in all and a contents page. I sent the same bundle to Barclays (with a few edits here and there) last week and got a letter offering me the full amoun within a week!! SO.... it's got me thinking that maybe sending the bundles to them early might get them to pay up... AND maybe the part two bit about contractual interst helps... I dunno! This is what I added as part Two (taken from an edited POC):

 

The Claimant claims compounded contractual interest on the amounts claimed using the Defendants own current published rates and method specified in the said contract, and as applied by the Defendant to monies it is owed.

 

'The Claimant’s grounds for seeking a compounded rate of interest are:

 

1.That there is an explicit or implied term of mutuality and reciprocity within the contract, and equity dictates that sums owed by the Defendant should be subject to interest under the same terms and at the same rates that the Defendant has itself imposed upon the Claimant throughout the term of the contract.

 

2. That the defendant has and would also continue to be unjustly enriched if the Claimant's entitlement was limited to the statutory rate of interest. The Defendant is a large corporation with specialist investment capability, as such the Defendant has had use (and would also continue otherwise to have use) of the sums taken to invest and re-lend at commercial compounded rates. It has unjustly profited and would also continue to greatly do so should the Claimant’s entitlement to interest be limited to statutory rates.

 

3. Under the terms of the contract money taken without prior permission constitutes "Unauthorised Borrowing" and is subject to specific rates for such. The Defendant is clearly in a privileged position to have had direct means of withdrawing monies from the Claimant’s account. Since it was clearly not in the Claimant’s contemplation when entering into the contract, that the Claimant would authorise the Defendant to apply unlawfully high charges and interest thereon to the Claimant, then the Defendant took the charges and resultant interest from the Claimant without prior permission. By the Defendant’s own definition money taken without prior permission is equivalent to "Unauthorised Borrowing", So, similarly sums taken by the Defendant from the account in such a manner should be deemed subject to interest at the same rates and same manner imposed by the Defendant.

 

A schedule of the interest calculated in such a manner is annexed to the covering letter to the bundle.'

[muggins73]

I shan't be counting those chickens just yet, but it sounds as though it's only a matter of time. Victory Dance Part II in the bag;)

 

As for sending the court bundle early, I'm not sure whether this alone will have enticed them into coughing up sooner rather than later. I think on the whole, when they see that you are willing to pay for the priviledge to take them to court, (followed by the AQ fee and god only knows how much the court bundle costs in the end), it certainly acts as an eye opener. The banks are made aware of the fact that you mean business, that's for sure.

 

I'm away next week, so wont be able to congratulate you when the money is finally paid into your account. So, for arguments sake (and i do hope that I don't jinx you) let me be the first to congratulate you for your well earned payout next week:D

[maxine989]

It might be a while yet... court date 16 July

 

Gotta go and get a load of ink for my printer... and paper

 

All these court bundles are costing me a fortune... lol

[maxine989]

Nasty West Card account court date 2 July 07

 

Nasty West Bank account 2 court date 16th July 2007

 

The dates are getting very near... and all is quiet.

 

Both court bundles have been put together and sent off.

 

I called the court today to see if they have any court bundles from Cobblers... nothing as yet.

 

I called Cobblers to ask them if they had recieved my bundle and to ask them if they have sent out my copy of the bundle for the hearing on the 2nd. I spoke to a young sounding girl who took the referece numbers from me and told me there was nothing on the system but she would leave a messgae with a collegue who will look into it.... ???... SO not much news there either. To be honest, it sounded like she (the cobblers girl) just couldn't be bothered to go and find out for me. Anyway... my bundle was sent recorded delivery, so I know they have recieved it.

 

What happens if they don't bother to send me or the court a bundle? Does the hearing happen anyway without their evidence being allowed to be used???

 

Roll on the 2nd. I hope I get a cheque before the date (this is for the card account... for almost 2k) I have got bills coming out of my ears. I have got quite behind with a lot of stuff due to all the court fees and AQ fees I have been paying over the past few months... and of course I have incurred yet more charges... ARGGGHHH... it's never ending.

 

I am looking forward to paying off the cards and o/d's... Oh to be in the black... it must be bliss!!!

[maxine989]

Think I might give the courts and Cobblers a call again... it's all gone very quiet and the court dates are almost here... YIKES!!!

 

My Natwest CC court date is a week on Monday (2nd)... double YIKES!!!

 

And Nasty west bank account claim two weeks after that (on the 16th)... triple yikes!!!

 

[maxine989]

Hmmm..

 

Another confusing day for me. What with all these hearing dates coming up I have been dreaming about court bl**dy bundles, A4 paper and postmen, Judges and computers...ARRRGGHhhh!!

 

I called cobbetts regarding my credit card claim. The court date for this hearing is on the 2nd July (1 week on Monday).

 

I asked Cobblers if they had recieved my court bundle... which they said they had. I asked them if I was going to recieve a copy of there court bundle/trial bundle... as ordered by the judge in the notification of the hearing.

 

The woman from Cobbetts said that they wouldn't be sending me a court bundle as they have nothing to add????

 

Nothing to add to what I asked?? She said "we have got your bundle and we have nothing to add to that".

 

"So"... I said, "you are using the documents in my court bundle to defend yourselves with".

 

"No", she said "we have your documents and we have nothing more to add".

 

I probably sounded really stupid, but I don't know the ins and outs of it all do I? lol and she wasn't helping the matter by being so sharp ond patronising. She could have quite simply explained the proceedure with this sort of thing.

 

I was very confused by this... what does she mean?? Do they not need a bundle to use in court?? Does the defendant just use the defence that they sent me right at the beginning when I first filed at court?? And have no need to send a trial bundle of documents to me or the court??

 

So I called the court to see if they have recieved a bundle form them and they have just got mine. I asked the lady at the court about this and she said that out of courtesy cobbetts should inform me if they are not going to rely on any additioanl info in court other than what they have sent me.

 

Ok... so I think I am getting the jist of this court bundle business... So, it is only the claimant that must submit a bundle? And if the defendant had any additional documents that they wish to rely on in court then they must send it to me and the court 14 days before otherwise they will only use the original defence??? Have I got it right now?

 

Cor blimey. I learn something new every day!!!

 

As for the other Nasty West claim... (the bank account number 2 claim)... well the hearing date for that is the 16th July. I spoke to Cobbetts about this case and this time I got to speak to a nicer woman who explained that her clients were about to make another offer and I should hear something about it over the next week or so.

 

Oooooo... That sounds promising!!

[holster73]

Nice, Maxine, nice.

 

Re the card case, perhaps it's that they can't add anything because, quite simply, they don't have a leg to stand on? ? I would imagine that the volume of cases, the fact that the woman's job must be rather mundain at the mo' and it's a Friday afternoon meant that you got the 'I give up' sarcy treatment.

 

Good for you for checking with the court - let's face it, Cobblers aren't exactly fast to resond on the necessities, let alone courtesy!!

 

Can feel the excitement building about the other offer too - keep us posted!

[maxine989]

Will do holster...

 

Thank goodness it's Friday eh!!

 

Where's the chilled wine... oops, suppose I had better wait until at least 6pm before I crack it open. ha!

[maxine989]

Hey... Whoopie!!

 

Today I had a call from Cobblers regarding my NatWest credit card claim. They offered me the full amount plus 8% so I agreed to it. I was gunning for the 20.9%, but to be honest, I am so skint that I can't even afford to but the paper and ink need to print out my bundle to take the the hearing on Monday so I agreed. They already gave me a part payment in January, so the difference between what they have offered me and what I was claiming with the 20.9 was only a few hundres quid... to be honest I am happy to accept the 8%. I am skint, up to my eyeballs in flood damage and the remnants of the plumbers mess... bills about to be debited on the 2nd and so a quick flurry of cash is just what I need.

 

Yay yay yay! I won!!!

 

FANSTASTICO!!

[muggins73]

I should go away more often, 'cause as soon as I do you're quids in, hun:p

 

Well done, lovey, who's next?

[hedgey06]

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!

Sorry - missed this one!!!

Best wishes, hedgey xx :D

[maxine989]

Next is Natwest bank account number 2.

 

I am taking a big chance here... but Cobbetts phoned today and offered full charges plus the 8% (the same figure they offered us months ago).

 

I said no... court date is Monday... I said that I had put a lot of effort and time into my court bundle including a large section called 'grounds for claiming compounded contractual interest'... and that I would prefer the judge decide which interest rate I am entitled to. They were friendly enough and said that we will see in court on Monday...

 

So... Court this Monday 16th, Yikes!! I am taking the chance and going for the whole lot I originally claimed for. I have only got one shot at this and so I am hoping for the best. If I win, then I can pay off a let of debt which will ease the stress a great deal.

 

If the judge decides to just award the 8% then I will be happy with that... but I want the judge to decide... not Cobbetts, and besides I have been having all these court dates recently and all of the claims have been settled before the date. I want to go the whole hog and see what it is like at court so I can inform and prepare myself for my barclaycard claims (which I haven't begun at court yet).

 

Some of you might think I am being silly for going the whole hog with the contractual... but I am willing to take the risk to find out one way or another. Nastywest have messed me and my o/h around so much in the past causing us to be utterly skint and stressed out about paying our bills when our salary was sucked away by charges. We have tried to discuss solutions to the financial mess we got in when I took a drop in pay have a baby but Natwest have never been keen to help... they just keep on smacking us with more charges and taking away our food shopping money before we have even had chance to draw it out.

 

We both work hard and never have any of our money left over each month to have a family day out or trip to the cinema. I am fed up with banks making life even more difficult than it already is... so because of these reasons and many more... I am willing to go to court and state my case.

 

we will just have to see how it goes.

 

if it all comes back in my face with disasterous consequences, then I can only blame myself.

 

Here we go... wish me luck for Monday.

[muggins73]

Well, knock me down what fighting spirit you have;)

 

You certainly have my vote, and all the luck of the irish. I'm sure the judge will see sense, but hey, if he/she doesn't and awards you 8% then it's better than a kick in the teeth:D

 

Good luck and all the best, I have every faith in you.

 

Make sure you post as soon as you get home on Monday.

[claimb]

sorry to interrupt does anyone know any natwest claims going to court over claiming contractual interest and having to pay court costs i thought claims under 5k are not liabe for court costs

thanks!

[GaryH]

Next is NatWest bank account number 2.

 

I am taking a big chance here... but Cobbetts phoned today and offered full charges plus the 8% (the same figure they offered us months ago).

 

I said no... court date is Monday... I said that I had put a lot of effort and time into my court bundle including a large section called 'grounds for claiming compounded contractual interest'... and that I would prefer the judge decide which interest rate I am entitled to. They were friendly enough and said that we will see in court on Monday...

 

So... Court this Monday 16th, Yikes!! I am taking the chance and going for the whole lot I originally claimed for. I have only got one shot at this and so I am hoping for the best. If I win, then I can pay off a let of debt which will ease the stress a great deal.

 

If the judge decides to just award the 8% then I will be happy with that... but I want the judge to decide... not Cobbetts, and besides I have been having all these court dates recently and all of the claims have been settled before the date. I want to go the whole hog and see what it is like at court so I can inform and prepare myself for my barclaycard claims (which I haven't begun at court yet).

 

Some of you might think I am being silly for going the whole hog with the contractual... but I am willing to take the risk to find out one way or another. Nastywest have messed me and my o/h around so much in the past causing us to be utterly skint and stressed out about paying our bills when our salary was sucked away by charges. We have tried to discuss solutions to the financial mess we got in when I took a drop in pay have a baby but Natwest have never been keen to help... they just keep on smacking us with more charges and taking away our food shopping money before we have even had chance to draw it out.

 

We both work hard and never have any of our money left over each month to have a family day out or trip to the cinema. I am fed up with banks making life even more difficult than it already is... so because of these reasons and many more... I am willing to go to court and state my case.

 

we will just have to see how it goes.

 

if it all comes back in my face with disasterous consequences, then I can only blame myself.

 

Here we go... wish me luck for Monday.

Is this Birmingham County Court?

 

Is the CI based on mutuality and reciprocity?

[steven4064]

sorry to interrupt does anyone know any NatWest claims going to court over claiming contractual interest and having to pay court costs i thought claims under 5k are not liabe for court costs

thanks!

You are right in that a person claiming under £5k, if the claim is allocated to the small claims track, will not get costs awarded against them if they lose.

 

The point of Gary's post above is that, if you are claiming CI on the basis of mutuality and reciprocity (or fairness) then there is a test case that says you are not entitled to it and you would lose that aspect if it came to court.

 

If you are claiming CI on some other grounds, then who knows (at the moment).

 

Steven

 

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[claimb]

Good luck Maxine! if theres any justice you'll win CI