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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
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The Reverend And old Abbey OD sold to Arrows


The Reverend
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Good afternoon everybody,

A long time since i've engaged on this fantastic site,had an awful lot of trouble at the Vicarage but thats for another day.

 

 

Just a little bit of thought regarding this matter would be welcome,

 

Abbey National - Santander

 

Had a bank account and overdraft got into difficulties not going into more detail no need to at this point in time.

 

Account ended up at Debt Managers around 2006, balance of around £2500 i did setup a payment plan and that continued until June or so this year.

 

Received letter from Arrow - Capquest, saying Capquest are now managing on behalf of Arrow, balance around £2100.

 

The question is do i engage with Capquest and set up new payment plan ? i have no problem with that for time being,as some more hornets nests are gonna get rocked over next few months i think.

 

I think a cca request doesn't count in this situation ?

 

 

Bless You, The Reverend

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Wait for Capquests missive and then decide from there...the longer it does the rounds the less chance of a court claim Reverend

 

Regards

 

Andy

We could do with some help from you.

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Thanks for quick reply Andy,i've actually received a letter from Capquest today,just the standard contact us blah,blah,blah.Like i said i don't have a problem setting up new repayment plan,would you suggest that as being route to go down ?

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why not get an sar of to satans bank

get all the statements

this could well be 99% unlawful bank charges & their interest.

if so very questionable they'd go anywhere near a court with it.

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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And if it is 99% bank charges & interest do you really want to pay it...not that we condone debt avoidance in anyway Reverend you understand....just fair treatment to consumers.:wink:

We could do with some help from you.

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Thanks for replying dx and Andy, yes would be a lot of charges on this account. If i go down the SAR route,do i wait until i get that info before making any contact with Crapquest,and wait for next Threatagram ?

[COLOR="black"][SIZE="7"][/SIZE][/COLOR][COLOR="palegreen"][/COLOR][COLOR="darkorange"][/COLOR]Bless You,The Reverend[FONT="Century Gothic"][SIZE="6"][/SIZE][/FONT]

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I wouldnr be rush to tell or do anything with cabot.

 

they are not bailiffs and have zero legal powers

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Capquest not Cabot

 

Would i send to Capquest Or Satan ?

And are we still talking 40 days to comply ?

And also reading the origina letterl from Arrow the account goes back to 1998,

would they hold info that long ?

[COLOR="black"][SIZE="7"][/SIZE][/COLOR][COLOR="palegreen"][/COLOR][COLOR="darkorange"][/COLOR]Bless You,The Reverend[FONT="Century Gothic"][SIZE="6"][/SIZE][/FONT]

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sar to OC

well if you cant get ahold of the data

99% guaranteed arrows wont either!

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Not had a chance to get SAR sorted will try tomorrow when have a little more time.

 

On a seperate note,

on the SAR page you have a link to create a tamper free sig,

seems a great idea,

so paid my £4 via paypal,

and got sent back to a template page,

which i don't really want,

how do i login or create account to create the tamper sig ?

 

 

I can't any way getting past that page

,and don't have a password to access the signature creator or no link to create an account,

perhaps I'm just being thick :-)

[COLOR="black"][SIZE="7"][/SIZE][/COLOR][COLOR="palegreen"][/COLOR][COLOR="darkorange"][/COLOR]Bless You,The Reverend[FONT="Century Gothic"][SIZE="6"][/SIZE][/FONT]

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is the sar going to the original creditor?

 

 

sorry about that sig thing its a nuisance

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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no need to munge a sig on SAR to the OC

as the sar says if you read all the posts there.

 

they'll only ask you for it unmunged

don't forget a ctax copy if you've moved too

 

yes , we'll sort the £4 for you.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Wasn't going to use on that document just thought it was a good idea.

I've read over was needed for the SAR request and again dx thanks for the reminders much appreciated.

[COLOR="black"][SIZE="7"][/SIZE][/COLOR][COLOR="palegreen"][/COLOR][COLOR="darkorange"][/COLOR]Bless You,The Reverend[FONT="Century Gothic"][SIZE="6"][/SIZE][/FONT]

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I had an overdraft of around £2k with Abbey when it was defaulted. It was quickly sold to Debt Managers and I started to make repayments to them.

 

Then I found this message board and CCA'd Debt Managers (not knowing at the time that overdrafts weren't covered by a CCA request)

 

However, Debt Managers managed to obtain and send to me a copy of the application form used to open the Abbey National Bank Account.

 

On the Application Form there was a box that had to be ticked if you wanted to request an overdraft. I hadn't ticked that box.

So I wrote back to Debt Managers and pointed that fact out to them and stated that I had owed nothing to Abbey National or Debt Managers, and therefore stopped making payments to them.

 

I've never heard from them since and that was almost 10 years ago.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi Guys,

not had a chance to get SAR off to Satan,

One question can't seem to find an address to send to

 

Would this one be applicable ?

Complaints, Santander UK PLC, PO Box 1125, Bradford BD1 9PG

[COLOR="black"][SIZE="7"][/SIZE][/COLOR][COLOR="palegreen"][/COLOR][COLOR="darkorange"][/COLOR]Bless You,The Reverend[FONT="Century Gothic"][SIZE="6"][/SIZE][/FONT]

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Well its not a complaint ...its a legal request and should be addressed to Data controller.

 

 

Andy

We could do with some help from you.

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Hi Andy,can't find an address for Data Control nothing on their website,would i send it to Data Control Bradford ?

 

Their website is blooming awful.

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Not sure if this is current ?

 

Data controller: Santander UK PLC

Address: 2 Triton Square, Regent's Place, London NW1 3AN

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

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  • 1 month later...

Just a small update, SAR sent off to Satan,had a reply from Satan, we will send requested info within 40 days blah,blah,blah.

 

Have this week recieved a further letter from our friends at Capquest,after the usual three weekly you haven't contacted us regarding this account. I did send a cheeky CCA request i no doesn't apply but i was in a cheeky mood.

 

Now the letter this week is offering a reduced settlement,and my question would be,does anybody think this is because the SAR is going to reveal a few charges i will be able to get refunded,or just a complete concidence ?

 

The CCA of course they haven't responded to at all,was just expecting my PO returned and a you do realise this doesn't apply to an overdraft.

[COLOR="black"][SIZE="7"][/SIZE][/COLOR][COLOR="palegreen"][/COLOR][COLOR="darkorange"][/COLOR]Bless You,The Reverend[FONT="Century Gothic"][SIZE="6"][/SIZE][/FONT]

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they wouldnt know about the sar.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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I did send a cheeky CCA request i no doesn't apply but i was in a cheeky mood.

 

.

:)

worth a try, gives them something to think about.

have done one, and in mine it is applicable (re the full terms) (though they say it isn't) :)

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:)

worth a try, gives them something to think about.

have done one, and in mine it is applicable (re the full terms) (though they say it isn't) :)

 

Never even got a reply,or my £1 sent back,they certainly haven't taken it off the balance outstanding.

I'm pretty certain now the reduced settlement letter was to get me to call,learnt a very very long time ago.

Never speak to these people on the phone ever.

[COLOR="black"][SIZE="7"][/SIZE][/COLOR][COLOR="palegreen"][/COLOR][COLOR="darkorange"][/COLOR]Bless You,The Reverend[FONT="Century Gothic"][SIZE="6"][/SIZE][/FONT]

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