Article 50 Discussion

[buckthorn]

So much for a problem with exports to thee EU and tariffs.

Cornish Baker exports 4,500 pasties to France, no problem.

http://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/baker-to-export-4-500-pasties-to-france/story-29436703-detail/story.html

 

Just love it, don't you?

[buckthorn]

The makers of Melton Mowbray pies, is afraid that because of

Brexit the country could get flooded with cheap, inferior versions

of the pie, this could also affect Cornish clotted cream, because

they would no longer have the protection of the EU food protection

label, below are some of the EU food products which also have this

label, so if they do it to us we could also do it to them.

 

Our own English Champagne, Gorgonzola, Parmigiano etc; etc;

All I can say is dig out!

 

hams, sausages, olives, olive oils, Balsamic vinegar

Gorgonzola, Parmigiano-Reggiano, Feta,, Piave cheese, Asiago cheese, Camembert,

Cider, Cognac, Armagnac and Champagne can only be labelled as such if they come

from the designated region.

Roquefort, for example, cheese must be made from milk of a certain breed of sheep,

and matured in the natural caves near the town of Roquefort-sur-Soulzon in the

Aveyron region of France, where it is colonised by the fungus Penicillium roqueforti

that grows in these caves.[5]

This system is similar to appellation systems used throughout the world, such as the

appellation d'origine contrôlée (AOC) used in France, the denominazione di origine

controllata (DOC) used in Italy, the denominação de origem controlada (DOC) used in

Portugal, the denominación de origen (DO) system used in Spain and the Denumire

de origine controlată

 

 

Edited July 3, 2016 by buckthorn
add

[buckthorn]

unlikely, as any trade to the eu wld have to comply with eu regs. so, not quite free from eu laws there.

 

Did I mention anything about trade with the EU?

re-read my post protection labels, was the subject.

[buckthorn]

yes, you said mowbray was afraid the country cld get flooded with cheap inferiors etc. then you said we cld do the same to them.

maybe you shld reread your own post.

The subject was protection labels!

[buckthorn]

I see the world is queuing up to trade with the UK

on Brexit from the EU. so much for the rubbish spewed out by the inners.

Have some links,

World queues up to win trade deals with Britain after Brexit

Daily Mail‎ - 15 hours ago

Countries are lining up to enter trade talks with Britain in the wake of the decision to leave ...

The World Queues Up To Win Trade Deals With Britain After Brexit

Breitbart News‎ - 12 hours ago

Mickey Rourke threatens to beat up former baseball star Lenny Dysktra

Daily Mail‎ - 9 hours ago

More news for World queues up to win trade deals with Britain

________________________________________

World queues up to win trade deals with Britain after Brexit: US ...

▶ 2:44

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR0zGTJIRWs

2 hours ago - Uploaded by Sheryl Wajid

World queues up to win trade deals with Britain after Brexit: US clamouring for a deal while talks are set to ...

The world queues up to win trade deals... - Nick Griffin British Unity ...

1. Cached

The world queues up to win trade deals with Britain after Brexit: America is clamouring for a deal while talks are set to begin with Australia, South...

11 Countries Gearing Up to Strike Trade Deals With Britain | Heat Street

https://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

5 days ago - While Brexit doom-mongers have been focussing on the challenges of keeping access to the EU's single market (16% of global trade – less ...

Project fear in ruins as world queues up to win trade deals with Britain ...

http://www.theway.co.uk/news-10253-project-fear-in-ruins-as-world-queues-up-to-win-trad...

1. Cached

Apart from the financial markets returning to normal after Brexit, Nations outside Europe are eyeing opportunities to increase trade with Britain for th.

World queues up to win trade deals with Britain after Brexit | Latest ...

news.s3.webdigital.hu/.../world-queues-up-to-win-trade-deals-with-britain-after-brexit

1. Cached

15 hours ago - The country will be free to negotiate its own deals after quitting the EU, and business secretary Sajid Javid (pictured) is already preparing for a ...

Obama stands by 'back of the queue' Brexit warning - how the world ...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/.../eu-referendum-what-the-world-is-saying---britains-historic-d...

1. Cached

25 Jun 2016 - The world woke up to the news that Britain had decided to leave the European union. ... would move to the back of the queue when it comes to trade deals. ... leader, praising the British decision, adding: "freedom has won".

World queues up to win trade deals with Britain after Brexit ...

http://www.stormfront.org › News › Newslinks & Articles

1. Cached

I guess the remain people were wrong. World queues up to win trade deals with Britain after Brexit | Daily Mail Online.

World queues up to win trade deals with Britain after Brexit - Trendolizer

uk.trendolizer.com/.../world-queues-up-to-win-trade-deals-with-britain-after-brexit.ht...

1. Cached

The country will be free to negotiate its own deals after quitting the EU, and business secretary Sajid Javid (pictured) is already preparing for a hectic schedule of ...

World queues up to win trade deals with Britain after Brexit: - ZetaBoards

w11.zetaboards.com/UK_Debate_Mk_2/topic/11694954/

1. Cached

6 hours ago - World queues up to win trade deals with Britain after Brexit: US clamouring for a deal while talks are set to begin with Australia, South Korea ...

[buckthorn]

Just thought I would give you Guardian supporters,

lefties and whingers something more to whinge,

about and have a go at the leavers for.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2016/jun/27/brexit-family-rifts-parents-referendum-conflict-betrayal

 

This lot says it all most probably could not get out

of bed, or were up to their knees in mud at Glastonbury

while being legless on booze.

 

They think everybody owes them something, and older

people should not have a say in anything about the future,

of this country.

Scroll down Guardian video.

[buckthorn]

I don’t think May should be made PM, they keep

having a go at Andrea Leadsom, about her CV etc.;

but there really is a conflict of interests where May

is concerned.

 

LINKS:-

 

[edited at buckthorn's request]

Edited July 9, 2016 by honeybee13
Post below says it's the wrong link

[buckthorn]

Wrong link given .

Correct link:- https://www.change.org/p/david-came...home-secretary-due-to-a-conflict-of-interests

Edited July 9, 2016 by buckthorn

[buckthorn]

Sums up my views.

 

Plus add in the vast complexities of the existing trading arrangements between companies based in the UK and EU mainland, which are covered by legislation and contracts agreed over many years. The UK government would have a duty to fully engage with all of the companies that could be affected by Brexit. Otherwise they risk a huge number of court actions that could go on for years and cost a fortune.

 

Also what about the 27 other countries within the EU that have their own issues. You can't just look at the UK and consider Brexit from a narrow view point.

 

Could I have a link please.

[buckthorn]

Could that be because Article 50 has not been triggered and the status Quo is continuing?

 

Not forgetting the currency exchange has fallen through the floor with price of imports going through the roof

 

It has only been eight weeks since the Referendum as well

Imports have ‘not’ gone through the roof at all and inflation is still only 0.6%.

 

“Economists hike forecasts as Brexit confidence grows”

 

http://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/topstories/economists-hike-forecasts-as-brexit-confidence-grows/ar-BBvRoQw?ocid=spartandhp

Edited August 21, 2016 by Andyorch
edited

[buckthorn]

I will agree with that a little education would not do you any harm.

Edited August 21, 2016 by Andyorch
edited out personal remark

[buckthorn]

Have you seen how much Pounds Sterling has fallen since 23rd June. It will mean UK companies are at risk of takeover, as it will be cheaper for foreign buyers. Also foreign buyers might look to continue investing in UK property, keeping price increases going.

 

Any impacts on inflation won't be seen until later in the year, as increased costs of imports start to feed through.

 

I am not convinced Theresa May will trigger Article 50 during 2017, as i think it is possible that this is not seen as the best route to take. The Italian who wrote this article said he was not convinced about it being the way to exit the EU. The EU/UK might instead choose to negotiate a different arrangement, as the EU tries to keep the UK within the single market, but with concessions agreed by all 27 other countries.

 

Have you got a link to that?

[buckthorn]

Link to what ?

 

This:-The Italian who wrote this article said he was not convinced about it being the way to exit the EU. The EU/UK might instead

choose to negotiate a different arrangement, as the EU tries to keep the UK within the single market, but with concessions agreed by all 27 other countries.

[buckthorn]

Their is a load of rubbish flung about that we cannot sell to the single market – without agreeing to the free movement of people. (C**p)

 

Question what is the single market’?

The ‘Single Market’ simple means that any business in an EU country can sell to anyone else in an EU country, without paying tariffs

(taxes on imports) or facing ‘non-tariff barriers’ (tricks which countries use, like complicated rules and regulations, to make it difficult

for foreign companies to sell into their markets).

 

In return for this, they agree to the ‘free movement’ of four things: goods, services, capital- and people.

 

There are more than 100 non-EU countries with some kind of trade agreement with the EU. Only 4 have

‘free movement of people’ in their agreement. One of those (Liechtenstein) is actually let off, because it is

too small. Another, Switzerland, has voted to get rid of it.

 

So what they are saying is ‘We can have either have free movement of people, or agree to pay tariffs.

If we agree to pay world tariffs, like all other non-EU countries do, we will pay less than the EU currently

charges us to be a member (and gain more)!

 

As we are their biggest customers, they may want to cut us an even better deal, for lower tariffs. That is

what is being negotiated.

 

This is some of the countries who have signalled that they would like to open trade talks with the UK:

Australia-Canada-China-Ghana-Iceland-India-Mexico-New Zealand-South Korea-United States.

 

Meanwhile German industrialists had told their government that they expect it to ensure a free trade deal with the UK.

Edited August 29, 2016 by silverfox1961
removed provocative line of text

[buckthorn]

Having monitored this thread over the past few weeks, it seems some of you have ego's that will fill a room. That's fine in a personal capacity but not here. I, for one, am getting heartily sick of all this bickering which the mods then have to go in and decide what is best. That is part of our role. What we are not here for is to moderate a pi**ing contest.

 

CAG, as a community, will always get differences of opinion but if you lot don't know how to do so politely, what the hell are you doing here?

 

If you disagree, say so and put your explanation and links where there is any. if you cannot substantiate what you are saying then that is opinion, not fact.

 

Please don't make our (voluntary) work harder for us.

 

 

 

 

Why did you find it necessary to remove my signature Agent Provocateur

from my post No;250? While at the same time allowing a post by obiter dictum,

(post 63-Corbyn & the labour party).

 

I am beginning to wonder if there is one rule for some and another rule for others??

who contribute to the Bear garden.

 

Post aimed at me, made by OD:-I will return later, we have an Agent Provocateur, better

known as an inciting agent trying to cause trouble.

 

Its ok for him to call me that and get away with it is it?

The second part of his post well I just can’t be bothered to lower myself to comment on it,

and yet you have allowed it to remain but removed mine, why??

[buckthorn]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-eu-referendum-britain-theresa-may-article-50-not-supposed-meant-to-be-used-trigger-giuliano-a7156656.html

 

i predict that the courts will rule that Parliament must take decisions before a minister can trigger any EU treaty clause, because the EU referendum never contained any binding authority.

 

When they get around to looking at this properly and discussing it with EU/EU country leaders, they will come to the conclusion that triggering Article 50 with a supposed 2 year period to negotiate exit, is not the best way. Instead they will negotiate UK's position with the EU and see where it goes. Because the 2 year period can be extended, it could get pretty silly with financial markets looking at a timetable and investors looking at possible ways of making short term profits. And people who voted leave would be extremely annoyed if Article 50 time period kept being extended. Better to have meaningful negotiations within the whole of the EU to decide on new treaties. Those countries not in the Euro will want to see changes anyway. The EU can't keep

putting off not negotiating treaties because countries have referendum commitments.

 

 

Theresa May has let it be know she will use executive powers to enact Article 50,

rather than allow disaffected MPs the chance to obstruct its implementation.

 

A group of over a 1,000 lawyers, led by the firm Mishcon de Reya, is threatening

legal action against this, claiming the Government has no right to invoke Article 50

without consulting Parliament—and the referendum was only ‘advisory’.

What a bl**dy nonsense their litigation will fail any way, still they should make a lot

of money out of the tax payer who will have to pay for it.

 

At no point in the passing of the referendum Bill in the Commons was it ever declared

to be merely an advisory vote.

[buckthorn]

I have reluctantly come to the conclusion that there really is

no point in continuing to post in the Bear garden, it has

become so one sided, not in respect of the subjects, but

in the censorship and bias of site team members.

 

I have never been aggressive to other contributor, although

I cannot say the same about some of the other members

who contribute, (not all) who are allowed to get away with

anything, with no come-back just because

their politics is the same as the moderators.

 

I have been warned on a number of occasions, over comment

I am supposed to have made, yet other contributors have said

the same thing, and it has been allowed, this is pure victimisation,

there is a complete bias on one side, this is wrong and should

not be allowed, but then if it’s the same politics as the team

then it’s ok.

 

One of the most annoying, actions taken by the site team is to

delete part of a post thereby changing its content, with no

explanation, it seems to be a case of I can do what I want like

it or lump it.

 

Like other members who have been forced to leave because of

the I’m always right attitude of the mods, I have decided to lump it,

(not that you really care anyway) and make no more

contributions to the Bear Garden, which allows you to talk among

yourselves.

 

I also think you should change it to the Kintergarden as it much

more reflects what goes for a discussion forum.

 

I expect this post to be deleted, as that seems to be normal practise in the kindergarden.

[buckthorn]

How much longer is indecision and foot–dragging going to be the way forward with Brexit?

 

Has the word ‘democracy’ been reinterpreted? Why is it that so many in power have difficulty

with this concept? A wise and learned person would never ask a question that they did not

already know the answer to or at least have a fall-back position if the answer wasn’t what

they’d expected or wanted.

 

Those elected decided for whatever reason to go to the people of this nation and ask should

we stay in or leave Europe? The people voted and it is irrelevant whether you voted in or out,

the majority decided that Europe was no longer a viable option.

 

Despite predictions of the consequences of a ‘no’ vote, the world hasn’t come to an end, our

houses are not now worth 50% less, the pound has not been devalued. Organisations that

spread fear and misinformation have proved to be wanting, on both sides of the argument.

 

We have heard ludicrous arguments that one side or the other didn’t know what they voted for,

or the old voted the wrong way because they didn’t understand the question, or they’re all racists;

the one I found to be most offensive was that the young should get two votes while the old only

get one; comments like that prove that even with the best education some are too stupid to learn

the meaning of democracy or one person one vote.

 

What we should all draw from this is that whatever we voted for we have been let down. The principal

is a simple one, the Government is elected by the people for the people, we have all to some extent

become conditioned to the lies, and corruption in high office but woe betide any politician who feels

they can decide above the will and rights of the people because if any government is foolish enough

to-rewrite the answer or make a decision contrary to the will of the people, the ‘in’ and the ‘outs’ will

be looking for others represent them at the next election and many who have enjoyed the free lunch

and gravy train will soon come to realise that being an ex-politician qualifies you for very little in today’s

job market.

[buckthorn]

The value of the pound against other currency’s

has dropped. IT HAS NOT BEEN DEVALUED.

Only the Bank of England can devalue our currency.

[buckthorn]

Prove it????

[buckthorn]

You said this I did not. which as far as I am concerned is an assertion

so prove it.

 

same thing as far as i'm concerned.

the cost of shopping (prices) etc has gone up as a result

plus, am pretty sure it has been devalued, according to its general definition.

 

 

Why do you think Greece is in such a mess,

it has not been able to devalue its currency

because of the EU and the euro,

the UK exchange rate with other countries

has changed, but the pound has not been devalued

only the Bank of England can do that.

[buckthorn]

Basic economics, supply & demand.

 

You are correct but that has got nothing to do with devaluation??

That's the exchange rate with other currencies.

Edited November 26, 2016 by buckthorn

[buckthorn]

Thought this may be of interest.

This is a piece written by Frederick Forsyth!

Some people have very strange hobbies and a mate of mine has steeped

himself so long and so intently in a life long study of the British constitution

that he leaves professors of government scratching their heads before

admitting he is right after all.

 

It is fashionable to say we Brits have no constitution but that is rubbish.

Also rubbish to claim we have no written constitution. It is part-written,

part unspoken custom. But there is nothing unwritten about the English

Bill of Rights of 1689.

 

What IS true is that, unlike all others, ours was not written in one

place at one time by one group of scholars and stored in one place. But it

is still there. he says My mate claims that with all their powers there are two

things our parliament cannot do. It cannot legally disempower itself and it

cannot require our monarch to break her Coronation Oath.

 

“this is the most interesting part” He then goes on to affirm that the

passing and ratification of the Treaty of Lisbon did both that and is therefore

invalid. He says this is being taken extremely seriously in very high places.

 

Now supposing he is right? It would make Brexit not a Brexit but a breakfast-a

dog’s breakfast. It would mean our politicos passed all those sovereign powers

from London to Brussels illegally. In which case there is nothing to discuss.

 

We walk without any more need-bending and trade with the rest of the world

on the best terms we can get.

“Whoopee”

 

[buckthorn]

9 hours ago, honeybee13 said:

Good article by Alistair Campbell in today's Guardian. Here's a quotea;

'The Irish backstop was the main reason for the opposition to her deal. But there were plenty more. And those reasons have not changed either: we know the promises made for Brexit will be broken; we know real facts about the real costs of leaving the EU; we know the deal guarantees no clarity about the future, just a crisis that goes on and on.

He's not keen on TJ's friend Mr Codpiece either.

'

Is that the same Alister Campbell who with his mate Tony Blair

took the country into an illegal with Iraq that cost so many live 

 and resulted in the formation of ISS?

You really think we should take notice of anything he says!

[buckthorn]

6 hours ago, Surfer01 said:

As the leave campaign won, why would any Brexiter want to have petitions to leave or why would a Brexiter want to sign the petition if they won the referendum.  Still cannot understand why the Remainers are still crying into their cups and wanting to hold onto Mommy's apron strings to stay in a dictatorship?  After all when the EU states "jump" you can only ask how high!

Did you know that the authorities were last night

looking at the legitimacy of signatures on this petition?

 

It has emerged that people from Afghanistan,  Zimbabwe

and Russia have signed up, it was revealed yesterday that

more than 120,000 signatures on the petition had come from

outside the UK. Their were also signatures from China, Cuba,

 North Korea, and Zimbabwe.

 

Most of the international signatures from France, Germany

and the United States , were from expats.

 

There is no limit to the number of times anyone can sign up

 online, there is no limit to the international integrity of it -people

are signing up from all over the world.

This makes an absolute nonsense, of this Remainer exercise to ditch

a democratic vote.