Repossession hearing on 3/10 any advice?

[Ell-enn]

OK, why did you offer to pay a reduced amount ?

 

??????

[pebb1e]

financial circumstances due to reduction in self employment work

[Ell-enn]

OK, now we're getting somewhere. It's extremely unlikely that a lender will accept reduced payments if they have no clear idea of when the payments will return to normal. If your mortgage is a capital and interest one then you can ask the lender to change to interest only for a period of time to allow you to explore ways of increasing your income for the future. Which kind of mortgage do you have and who is the lender ?

[pebb1e]

Self cert - interest only on part & repayment on part.

Lender TMB - no longer exists bought by Lloyds TSB, HBOS

Edited October 1, 2013 by pebb1e

[Ell-enn]

Is there any likelihood of your income returning to the level needed to make normal monthly payments?

 

Do you have copies of all letters you sent to them with your explanation and offer - were they sent by recorded or special delivery so you could prove they signed for them ?

[pebb1e]

Theres always a possibility my income could return to a level needed but its uncertain as it self employment.

 

All my letters are sent recorded delivery and i have proof of receipt

[Ell-enn]

How much of a reduction in payment are you making ?

 

You now need to construct a statement and take it to court tomorrow together with some sort of proof of your fall in income and a budget sheet showing your income and expenditure (you can get this from the link I gave you earlier). Have you thought about the Mortgage Rescue Scheme? depending on the value of your property it may be an option which would allow you to stay in your home. Do you have dependents ?

[pebb1e]

We are at present making a £900 ish. Reduction in payment.

There are 2 dependant children in the property.

[Ell-enn]

OK, I'll understand if you don't want to put figures on the open forum - so can you please send me a PM with what the normal monthly payment should be, how much you are actually paying, the outstanding amount of your mortgage and the current value of your property.

[pebb1e]

Will do

[pebb1e]

Had court hearing today, got a suspended possession order to be reviewed in 6 months at another hearing.

The hearing wasn'nt going too good until we mentioned the HMLR deeds. Firstly the mortgage number is incorrect, it is not signed by the lender and the property address is incorrect! The Judge didnt seem too impressed by this and the claimants representative put it down to 'procedural errors' Any advice on what we can do?

[honeybee13]

Hello there.

 

You've posted the above twice on different threads. I think it's best to keep the information on the one thread so I've merged them for you.

 

If you want to change the title, please let me know.

 

My best, HB

[pebb1e]

Sorry, very new to this....not quite quite sure what I've done.

[Greentea]

A friend of mine sent me this link concerning a repossession and it is well worth a look. The guy in it knows his stuff even the police were very good in protecting the tenant from the bailiffs.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8g_tNimjEo

[pebb1e]

Very informative, thanks:-)

[Lea_HTH]

Misleading too: the Bird family were evicted a few days later.

 

Incorrect paperwork can occur - it won't defeat ultimate possession because it is very easily remedied; the thing that does stop possession is the ability to pay the CMI plus something towards the arrears to clear them in a reasonable time frame.

 

Same goes for the incorrect paperwork referred to in post #36. The bank/mortgagee are likely to be able to provide correct paperwork at the next hearing; if not, it should be challenged, though even without a deed, there was still money loaned and it will become equitable in court, i.e. money is still owed.

[applecart]

Had court hearing today, got a suspended possession order to be reviewed in 6 months at another hearing.

The hearing wasn'nt going too good until we mentioned the HMLR deeds. Firstly the mortgage number is incorrect, it is not signed by the lender and the property address is incorrect! The Judge didnt seem too impressed by this and the claimants representative put it down to 'procedural errors' Any advice on what we can do?

 

Hi Pebb1e

 

Tell me more - when you say the Judge 'didn't seem too impressed by this'........(in regard to the deeds issue)

 

Did he still agree the suspension of the hearing on terms for you to maintain CMI payments plus something towards the arrears?

 

Apple

[Ell-enn]

Apple, if you read the thread you will see that the OP isn't in a position to make full CMI payment let alone payment towards the arrears.

[applecart]

Apple, if you read the thread you will see that the OP isn't in a position to make full CMI payment let alone payment towards the arrears.

 

Thanks Ell-enn

 

I was directed here after the OP posted on the Deeds thread.

 

But, thanks for letting me know.

 

Apple

[pebb1e]

Hi, to stop 28 day possession order and agree a suspended possession order we agreed on a payment in line with the norgan minimum .

So at present we are going to have to pay CMI and a little extra.

The whole hearing was a total shock, from the minute we stepped into the court it was all about figures. We took extensive notes and really got no chance to ask any questions as we were bamboozled by law quotes etc.

We actually filed a counter claim and this wasn't mentioned at any point, we had several pieces of evidence in relation to non compliance with pre action protocol and the anomalies with the deeds.

The pre action protocol was acknowledged which is why we think we got a six month review.

However the deeds were acknowledged then dismissed. The judge expressed that it was 'not good and was going to adjourn, until the claimant pointed out in legal speak that this was not possible and that when he granted suspended order.

 

Where do we go from here?

Can we file to have the order set aside?

How do we counter claim, we paid the court to file it but judge never mentioned it.?

Should we apply to HMLR adjudicator?

[Lea_HTH]

Hi, to stop 28 day possession order and agree a suspended possession order we agreed on a payment in line with the norgan minimum .

So at present we are going to have to pay CMI and a little extra.

 

Standard.

 

The whole hearing was a total shock, from the minute we stepped into the court it was all about figures.

 

Always is. It's all about affordability.

 

We took extensive notes and really got no chance to ask any questions as we were bamboozled by law quotes etc.

 

It's a five minute hearing list, the judge doesn't have time to listen to questions that aren't relevant to the claim before him. That is, unless the questions relate to the actual claim, he/she won't hear them.

 

We actually filed a counter claim and this wasn't mentioned at any point, we had several pieces of evidence in relation to non compliance with pre action protocol and the anomalies with the deeds.

 

It may not have been married to the court file - therefore the judge may not have been aware of it. You should have asked, when the judge came to you, about whether he had it in front of him and been prepared to provide him with a copy. It would not have been heard there and then - if you counterclaim, the matter will likely go to trial and costs will increase.

 

The pre action protocol was acknowledged which is why we think we got a six month review.

 

You got a six month review because the claimant thinks you can't afford the CMI plus arrears figure as you unilaterally reduced the payment without their consent showing that you could not afford it. The judge is erring on the side of caution by ordering a review, this is so YOU can show that you can maintain payments, and if you can, at the review the SPO will be allowed to continue.

 

However the deeds were acknowledged then dismissed. The judge expressed that it was 'not good and was going to adjourn, until the claimant pointed out in legal speak that this was not possible and that when he granted suspended order.

 

Clearly the 'legal speak' was valid or the judge would not have been so persuaded.

 

Where do we go from here?

 

Make sure you make every payment on time and in full. Anything less will alert the judge to affordability issues.

 

Can we file to have the order set aside?

 

No. You were present. You have no other grounds to set aside the order.

 

How do we counter claim, we paid the court to file it but judge never mentioned it.?

 

Write to the court and ask that they ensure that your counterclaim is put before the judge in time for the next hearing or go to the court and request a refund and then refile it as a separate claim.

 

Should we apply to HMLR adjudicator?

 

Why? The matter is already before a court.

[pebb1e]

How do we get the SPO removed?

[Ell-enn]

You can't get the SPO removed until all the arrears are paid and you have a record of maintaining normal payments for 6 - 12 months thereafter. As you are unable to comply with the terms of the SPO you should be looking at getting the house on the market so if the lenders enforces the order due to non compliance (i.e. an eviction notice) you could apply to the court for a hearing to suspend the eviction while the property sells.

[applecart]

How do we get the SPO removed?

 

A suspended Possession Order is as it says.... an order of the court...it means that the Judge has granted possession of your house to the Lender subject only to you maintaining the terms of the order......it binds you to do what it says...which is to pay the lender...if you do not....then the lender has the right by order of the court to apply for a warrant of execution; which is a quick request made to the court bailiff for a date for eviction....you will lose your home if you do not maintain (pay) the lender...

 

The only means of removing the SPO is to pay off all the arrears in full and continue re-paying the loan.....the order of the court will stay in place even after you have repaid the arrears.....(there is case law to show that just because you have cleared the arrears .... does not mean that the order of the court cannot be restored should you fall into arrears again).

 

You can appeal to a higher court to get the SPO removed so long as you are sure you have legitimate and lawful grounds to do so...i.e - the lenders deed is void.....

 

As you know Pebb1e... on the deeds thread...we assert that a lenders deed is void.....what this means in simple terms is that we are saying....the lender has not secured a lawful right to take possession of your home.

 

We also assert that you had no power to grant the lender a 'mortgage' in any way shape or guise....

 

These are issues that have been taken on board by the Property Chamber on behalf of other borrowers - the first case is as I understand it ... to be heard in January 2014.

 

Because you have a SPO..... your situation will differ from those applications that have been sent to the First-tier Property Chamber so far......

 

You have a civil right to make an application to the Property Chamber for a determination as to the validity of the 'mortgage' deed.....to put to them the question....Is This Deed Valid?

 

Applications to the Property Chamber are Free.....

 

You will not know if your lender has a right to possession of your home without making an application....you will know one way or the other if your application is accepted for their consideration.

 

In the meantime - it is imperative that you maintain payments to the Lender....not because you can truly say that the lender is 'entitled' to the payments - but because the Courts Order says you MUST.....

 

If you are self-employed and your business income is low - make an application for tax credits.... if you have not already done so...that should help sure up your income to assist you maintain payments under the court order - ok...

 

Think positive...it is not all doom and gloom; you have to do that which will empower you despite the predicament you find yourself in right now......

 

Have a read of the deed thread (Is It Me's thread that is) and increase your knowledge......this is a self help forum...there is plenty of information on that thread to assist you make an application to the Chamber.....

 

In the meantime...Maintain your payments.....show the court and lender that you can pay......so that they do not possess your home....

 

If it turns out that the deed is void....the Chambers Order is just as affective as that of a High Court.....with it....you can always go back to court and show that the lender has no registered charge upon which it can rely to take possession of your home......

 

If it turns out that your deed is valid.... then your lender is wholly entitled to take possession of your home if you do not maintain the order of the court.....

 

Hope this helps?

 

Apple

[applecart]

Misleading too: the Bird family were evicted a few days later.

 

Incorrect paperwork can occur - it won't defeat ultimate possession because it is very easily remedied; the thing that does stop possession is the ability to pay the CMI plus something towards the arrears to clear them in a reasonable time frame.

 

Same goes for the incorrect paperwork referred to in post #36. The bank/mortgagee are likely to be able to provide correct paperwork at the next hearing; if not, it should be challenged, though even without a deed, there was still money loaned and it will become equitable in court, i.e. money is still owed.

 

I'm sorry - but I disagree..... the money owed will not become 'equitable in court'.....even though money is allegedly owed....we are talking 'a transaction to do with the interests in land'....the lender must meet ALL formalities in relation to a) the deed and then b) the agreement.......before he can truly claim any 'equitable' right to the money that he intends a court of law to enforce.

 

Apple