HELP just paid £800 to have a clamp removed due to PCN charges

[seraphim]

Hi There,

 

My Husband has just informed me that he had to pay £800 to Bailiffs to remove a clamp relating to a PCN for Wandsworth Council back in 2010.

He has received to paperwork regarding this, can the bailiff do this even though the car was on private property at the time?

apparently had a warrant which relates to a different address. does this make the warrant invalid if on private property?

can we get a refund?

[ManxRed]

Can you list what paperwork your husband has received and sent and when? It'll be something like 1. PCN from council, 2. (appeal from husband?), 3. rejection, 4. Notice to Owner from council, 5. (appeal from husband?), 6. Notice of Rejection, 7. Charge Certificate, 8. Order for Recovery, 9. Bailiff. When you say the warrant was for a different address, did you move house and not inform the DVLA (in other words, all the paperwork I've just listed has gone to some old address?)

[seraphim]

thanks for replying,

Well we haven't received anything as we moved in July 2010. We didn't inform DVLA so I'm not sure what would have been sent to our previous address.

I believe the warrant address the bailiff had was our previous one.

Apparently the bailiff spotted him whilst he was driving to work and followed him to his office.

I have checked and the bailiff is certified. Can a bailiff use a warrant of execution on private property? as this happened whilst my husband was at work. They have a private Car park with security.

Also can a bailiff charge for each visit? or is it just the statutory charges?

[hallowitch]

apparently had a warrant which relates to a different address. does this make the warrant invalid

 

yes

 

 

 

 

have a read of these threads will ask for this tread to be moved to the bailiffs forum

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?251314

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?332096-Bailiff-and-parking-penalty

[sailor sam]

Just because you didn't inform the DVLA of your change of address dosn't get you off a PCN i'm afraid. Yes the bailiff can clamp on private land if it has unristricted public access or he has been allowed in. But to get to the bailiff stage, a lengthy process has had to been taken in the form of what Manx has posted. This would of given you opportunity to appeal the original PCN at various stages. Not sure how you can get a refund now as the process has ended. You would have to have a pretty good argument that the PCN was issued incorrectly in the first plave I would of thought or there has been some kind of clerical error (on the council's part) resulting in you not receiving any correspondence.

[42man]

Moving to the bailiff forum...

[seraphim]

thanks

[ploddertom]

Just because you didn't inform the DVLA of your change of address dosn't get you off a PCN i'm afraid. Yes the bailiff can clamp on private land if it has unristricted public access or he has been allowed in. But to get to the bailiff stage, a lengthy process has had to been taken in the form of what Manx has posted. This would of given you opportunity to appeal the original PCN at various stages. Not sure how you can get a refund now as the process has ended. You would have to have a pretty good argument that the PCN was issued incorrectly in the first plave I would of thought or there has been some kind of clerical error (on the council's part) resulting in you not receiving any correspondence.

 

Not quite right although I agree the ticket has to be paid. All the correspondence has gone to a previous address & the Warrant is for the old address although the Bailiff has now "cleansed" this - this is not allowed and the ticket has to revert back & can be charged back out at its original price.

[seraphim]

Just because you didn't inform the DVLA of your change of address dosn't get you off a PCN i'm afraid. Yes the bailiff can clamp on private land if it has unristricted public access or he has been allowed in. But to get to the bailiff stage, a lengthy process has had to been taken in the form of what Manx has posted. This would of given you opportunity to appeal the original PCN at various stages. Not sure how you can get a refund now as the process has ended. You would have to have a pretty good argument that the PCN was issued incorrectly in the first plave I would of thought or there has been some kind of clerical error (on the council's part) resulting in you not receiving any correspondence.

That wasn't my question. What I need to find out is how can a PCN amount to £800.00 and a warrant for 1 address cannot be used for another which is private property the bailiff had no paperwork. The warrant was on his phone not a paper copy.

Bailiffs should not be allowed to fleece people like this and simply get away with it

[hallowitch]

That wasn't my question. What I need to find out is how can a PCN amount to £800.00 and a warrant for 1 address cannot be used for another which is private property the bailiff had no paperwork. The warrant was on his phone not a paper copy.

Bailiffs should not be allowed to fleece people like this and simply get away with it

 

I will do my best to answers your questions

 

A bailiff enforcing a Pcn can levy /clamp/ remove a vehicle from private property

 

not 100% sure about the warrant having to be on paper I'm sure it can be done by electronic transfer which would/may cover his phone

 

The most important thing about this is the address on the warrant is your previous address which means you did not receive the PCN ,notice to owner ECT

 

you need to get in touch with TEC on Monday and ask them to confirm the address the address on the warrant(this will be your previous address) they will e-mail you the forms for you to fill out (as per tomtubbys post on the link in post 4)

 

Once /if it is accepted (and i see no reason why it wont be) the PCN reverts back to the original fine

 

any overpayment should be recovered from your local authority they are fully responsible for all actions of there bailiffs including there fees

[hallowitch]

The Enforcement of Road Traffic Debts (Certificated bailiffs)(amendment) Regulations 2003)"

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2003/1857/regulation/2/made

 

again read posts by tomtubby

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?197308

[seraphim]

I will do my best to answers your questions

 

A bailiff enforcing a Pcn can levy /clamp/ remove a vehicle from private property

 

not 100% sure about the warrant having to be on paper I'm sure it can be done by electronic transfer which would/may cover his phone

 

The most important thing about this is the address on the warrant is your previous address which means you did not receive the PCN ,notice to owner ECT

 

you need to get in touch with TEC on Monday and ask them to confirm the address the address on the warrant(this will be your previous address) they will e-mail you the forms for you to fill out (as per tomtubbys post on the link in post 4)

 

Once /if it is accepted (and i see no reason why it wont be) the PCN reverts back to the original fine

 

any overpayment should be recovered from your local authority they are fully responsible for all actions of there bailiffs including there fees

 

Thank you I tried to call them this afternoon but i think they close early on a Friday. So I'll give it another go on Monday.

I was thinking about taking the bailiff to court to reclaim any overpayment, do you think I should stick with then Council for now?

[seraphim]

Thanks, Just had a look seems like they have overcharged us by about £700.00 taking into account we never received any paperwork. Even if we had they still overcharged us by £500.00

 

I hate bailiffs with a passion. wish i was there my husband just paid as he was at work and didnt want to cause a scene.

[hallowitch]

Thanks, Just had a look seems like they have overcharged us by about £700.00 taking into account we never received any paperwork. Even if we had they still overcharged us by £500.00

 

I hate bailiffs with a passion. wish i was there my husband just paid as he was at work and didn't want to cause a scene.

 

 

the bailiff probably went to your previous address however £800 is taking the xxxx

 

look to recover the money from the council first then you take them and the bailiff/firm to court I don't know much about that side of it (going to court) but there are plenty people who do and they will gladly walk you through the process

 

what bailiff firm is it you are dealing with

did you check to confirm the bailiff is certificated and to the company he is collecting for

[tomtubby]

I would IGNORE the charges that have been applied as this merely takes away from the real issue which is that the bailiff enforced a warrant when all statutory notices had been sent to a PREVIOUS address.

 

All local authorities know that if they are made aware of a NEW address or if notified that you had not received statutory notices that they MUST NOT enforce the warrant.

 

What you need to do is to file an Out of Time Witness Statement which SHOULD be accepted. It does NOT matter at all that payment has been made. If accepted, this will REVOKE the warrant and you may then make an application to the LOCAL AUTHORITY for a refund. They are the liable party. NOT the bailiff company.

 

Phone the Traffic Enforcement Centre on Monday and ask them to confirm the precise address on the warrant and they will forward a TE7& TE9 for you to complete. When you get this, post back on here and advice can be given to you as to what you need to put on the form. Their number is 08457 045 007

[sailor sam]

thanks for replying,

Well we haven't received anything as we moved in July 2010. We didn't inform DVLA so I'm not sure what would have been sent to our previous address.

I believe the warrant address the bailiff had was our previous one.

Apparently the bailiff spotted him whilst he was driving to work and followed him to his office.

I have checked and the bailiff is certified. Can a bailiff use a warrant of execution on private property? as this happened whilst my husband was at work. They have a private Car park with security.

Also can a bailiff charge for each visit? or is it just the statutory charges?

 

Although I think the bailiff fees in your case are excessive, I'm not sure how they (or the council) can be 'at fault' if they could not find you. No doubt because you failed to update the DVLA (by your own admssion) is the reason you never received the NTO and the following correspondence. Who knows, you may have even been able to challenge the original PCN.

[tomtubby]

Damn.....I wrote a long response and it went missing. Running late so have to be quick.

 

The local authority know that if their bailiff is made aware of a new address that they MUST contact the Traffic Enforcement Centre BEFORE enforcing the warrant to obtain their consent to reissuing the warrant to a new address.

 

However, this consent will ONLY be given if the address changed AFTER the date of the warrant (which in your case, it did NOT).

 

All local authorities were sent the following notice in May this year and you will need to read the last paragraph on page 2 and the further reminder on page 3.

 

http://www.britishparking.co.uk/write/Documents/Library/Execution%20of%20Warrant%20Information%20Note%20f%20doc.pdf

 

 

You can file an Out of Time Application with the Traffic Enforcement Centre. Call them on 08457 045 007 and ask them to confirm the address on the warrant. They will also send you the forms by email. The relevant forms should be the TE7 & TE9. If you need assistance with completing the form, please post back.