Advice with Evans Halshaw and Ford Credit

[manipulated]

Hi,

 

Just looking for a bit of advice really.

 

My local Evans Halshaw dealer wants me to renew my car currently with them on ford options, 1 yr.

 

They said if I renew, they will settle the figure with ford and move me onto a new agreement with no debt/equity carried over, it would be a new agreeement completely.

 

Now my question is, I want to be out of this Ford options altogether because I cannot afford it now. I havent seen the paper work for evans to buy my car/settle it with ford, but I have seen the new car agreement and it is just exactly same as if you was a new customer.

 

Now, Could I have my dealer take my current ford options car off me, settle it with ford within a few days and for me sign up for this new car agreement.

 

Once the finance has been settled I am then looking to cancel my new car agreement within the cooling off period which is 14 days.

Providing that the new agreement doesnt say anything about my previous outstanding balance with the previous car etc. Would this be ok to do? and would evans be able to try and do a U turn and tell me that if I cancel the agreement that I have to pay the extra 2k on the previous car, I know they will try, but can they legally do that as if the new agreement doesnt say anything about that and the transfer of car doesnt state anything about taking a new vehicle on.

 

I mean, I know they wont be happy, but if the writing doesnt say anything about the previous outstanding figure then I should be ok right?

 

Not sure if anyone is aware of how dealerships take your current car off you and settle it, but if you have any information that would be much appreciated! e.g Does the transfer of vehicle state that you have to take out a new agreement?

 

Thanks!!

[kurvaface]

Are you going to pay any deposit towards the new car?

 

have you had a written quotation / offer on your old car?

 

Why don't you have your car independantly valued? There are enough sites out there that do it and you'll probably find that the value is greater than the outstanding finance on your current car or doesn't the agreement allow for this?

[manipulated]

Hi,

 

Thanks for the reply!.

 

The deposit for the new car would only be a small £300.

 

They printed off a sheet which I shall have to check at home, but I dont think they gave me any figure/offer on my car. They just spoke to the used car salesman privately, asked him how much they could get for my car(never told me) and then gave me a quote on a new car and I specifically asked about the finance on the old car and they said its no problem they will settle it. I did see a little note on his desk with my name and car reg and it said "12,300" although this figure never came into play anywhere, so i think it was a reminder for the sales guy or a max value of what they think they can get for my car, not sure

 

Ive tried a few websites to see how much my car is worth, but as its a new car 11plate, most sites dont offer a value or say that its too new. Tried webuyanycar, motorhog, webuyanycar offered 9k, but the outstanding finance is about 11k

[maroondevo52]

Hello and Welcome, manipulated.

 

I've moved your thread to the appropriate Forum.

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[kurvaface]

The website you mention does not give YOU the going rate for your car.

 

My honest opinion is that you would be foolish to allow the dealership to settle your finace. Your car will undoubtedly be worth more than the outstanding finace and thengetting you to pay a deposit on the new car is really taking the p**s.

 

They win 4 times: Sell your car :quids in, take your deposit : quids in, sell you a new car : quids in, Commission on new finace: quids in. They must have seen you coming lol.

 

 

Seriously, if you decided to do this, not only is it like throwing money down the toilet, but you need to be sure that the settlement of your car and the purchase of the new car are totally unlinked independent transactions.

[Slaac]

Interesting what you are saying is that once they settled your outstanding finance you want to then just discontinue your agreement to buy a new vehicle?

 

Although the paperwork might not indicate the deals are linked there would be a fair chance that the dealership would look to prove that they were indeed joined

- "we agreed to buy and settle your car AND you agreed to buy a new one from us..." -

 

should they choose to get litigious about it then its your word vs. their word on what was/wasn't agreed and if I was the judge I think I'd find in favour of the garage.

 

Risky... and as previously pointed out you'll get more money on your car from doing a small bit of leg work.

[manipulated]

Thanks so much for the replies!

 

Yeah they did see me coming ha, I think its because ive done a bit more mileage than a car less than 1 year would have done im guessing? 12,500 miles upto now and I only got car in March. But I was travelling over 100 miles a day, the past 6 months got a new job and been doing less than 70 a week.

 

So I think ill go with what you 2 set, wait a little bit longer paying the monthly payments and wait for the age/mileage to even out and get a value on it.

 

Do you have any recommendations on what sites/places offer best value?

 

Slaac: yes that is what I was thinking, that they would basically headhunt me and look to prove that it was agreed verbally etc and that it looks kind of obvious that they only settled the finance on a basis of me buying a new car.

 

It was just a thought

 

Thank you so much.

[kurvaface]

If you google "Value my car" you'll get quite a few sites coming up.

 

What I usually do is go to the manufacturer's used car search engine and search for a 2nd hand car that is the same spec as my own. Also Search Autotrader. You will soon get a picture of what your car is worth. Note that dealer sold vehicles can be considerably more than private sales because of the back up etc and if you get a value from a delar you need to take into account their mark up.

[Slaac]

thats good - I'm all up for seeing the consumer do well in a deal but be sure most vehicle retailers have a finely honed legal arm!

[kouri123]

Hi

I work for a Ford dealership,

i am aware of options deals,

if you sign a new agreement you will be dealing with Ford credit(fc) not Evans Halshaw (eh).

 

you will see on the finance agreement what your true deposit is, anything over 300 is your equity from earlier car.

 

what would happen is your settlement figure would be contra-settled ie taken out of monies paid to eh.

 

should you then cancel deal in cooling off period it would then bring into question whether your earlier deal would be re instated.

 

As if you were able to walk away with no debt everyone would be moving negative equity over to new agreements and walking away from their defecit.

 

your other option is to downsize cars if you want to lower expenses or shop around to see if there are any better deals out there.......

 

..............................regards Neil

[manipulated]

Hi,

 

Just wondering what some of your opinions would be on my current finance deal.

 

Bit of a story so forgive me!

 

1 year ago to this date almost, I purchased a Ford from Evans halsaw on a PCH options scheme.

When originally getting quotes, It was just out of my budget as I was travelling about 25k miles a year - one of the sales guys mentioned I would need a used car.

 

weeks later, I thought i would re-visit Evans about a car.

 

They were still persistant on getting me into a nEw ford,

he came back with these great deal, an upgraded car 1.6 zetec instead of 1.4 edge, white and it was for £10 cheaper a month!.

 

Looking at the details it was because he had changed the mileage to 6k a year, the 3 sales people I dealt with all knew I was doing 20k plus.

 

I mentioned this to them and they said ignore it, it doesnt matter as I will trade the car after 1 yr and I would have positive equity and mileage doesnt matter,

only if I keep it for 3 yrs and give it back.

 

Me been quite a lot naive!!,

 

1st car on finance and didnt even know what equity was at the time!.

Signed it etc,

 

i did ask about servicing aswell as I also didnt want to pay for this, in the end I did pay for it :/

 

1 yr later,

I go in to trade in like he says and to try and reduce my monthly payments...

 

.I now have a negative equity..quite large!..about 3-4k and will only get bigger as the months go on.

 

I even tried to speak to them about downgrading the car and just never hear anything.

 

so my best bet is to keep the car and pay,

but the monthly payments are getting too much and I also have the extra mileage to pay for at the end of the agreement

even if I do give car back and I have trebled my allowed mileage in 1 year

 

I feel I was mis-sold/mis-represented this , i completely agree I shouldnt have been so naive.

.and signed the document when it only said 6k,

I only signed the agreement on the basis he said I would earn positive equity after 1 year and keep trading car for a new one

and my payments would go down each year and mileage didnt matter...

he even told me about his daughter doing the same thing!..

 

what is the best place to go about this.

 

Im currently about to do a Subject Access Request to Evans,

but I am also been told elsewhere that my deal is with Ford Credit so should speak to them and that the legal rights/liability is with them,

that Evans only act on their behalf etc, but then elsewhere that its nothing to do with Ford, its all Evans

 

Thanks

[dx100uk]

two threads merged

 

please keep to ONE THREAD per issue

 

save wasting past advise given.

 

dx

[manipulated]

Just Thought I would update this post incase anyone in future has similar issues or would like to know the outcome.

 

Basically I spoke to Financial ombudsman who sent a complaint on my behalf to Pendragon which is the Head Office for EvansHalshaw.

I also sent a SAR request with the £10.

 

After the 40day passed, I called up and they tried to tell me the SAR is 40 working days, after I told them it was 40 Calendar days, they sent me my information the next day. However it seems to be totally incomplete.

 

They seem to have only sent me my Credit Agreement and in the letter explained that its not their responsibility to keep this, but out of best practice they have.

I have since sent the template letter off of this website informing them that my SAR is incomplete and that the 40 days is not about 10 days overdue, as a copy of the agreement is not what I asked for, I asked for all Data held on me.

I know for a fact if I walked into my local dealer and gave them my name and registration information they would be able to retrieve my previous quotes and other information such as services due etc.

 

Today I also received a final response in response to my complaint. which basically says they spoke to the salesman in question and that they guided me through all of the steps correctly and that I signed the agreement and they were not present when these alleged conversations took place and as such there is no proof so they will not be upholding my complaint.

 

I am now going down the Ombudsman route as I am well aware that Yes, i should of read the mileage and understood the terms. but also at the same time I did question it and bring to the salesman attention but he said ignore it its fine and I would be able to trade my car after 1 yr with positive equity. had this not all of been said, I wouldn't of bought the car!....Which in hindsight Is probably a lot worse then not reading the letter as I signed it knowing what it said. Also the salesman they have asked these questions to is not even the salesman I was dealing with, I only spoke to this guy on a few occasions.

 

I am going to have another good look at home for my ORIGINAL quote which shows mileage at over 15,000 miles....all I have at the moment is an old Insurance quote and a tea stained bit of paper that I wrote down what they was offering me on

 

Also uploaded an exact copy of the information they sent to me for the SAR request, except invoice detailing the car specs and drivers license as seem irrelevant. Ive edited out account numbers and signatures but left half of the signature in so you can see if it was signed or not.

 

I also never seem to have received a Pre-Contract, although not sure how valid that is

ford_finance_edited.pdf

Edited May 22, 2012 by manipulated
Added PDF

[kouri123]

how much neg eq do you have??

how old is your car??

how much mileage?

any extra's street pack b/t usb etc and what condition is it in??

have you taken it to any other dealers for a valuation to see what they will offer.

 

i know it is common practice to use less mileage in pcp agreements but it is normally only when customer pays a substansial deposit.

 

you have definitley been mis advised but proving it could be difficult if it is your signiture on everything including the demands and needs.

 

have you gone back and fronted the salesman that told you all this??

tell him you have come back as he suggested and want to do as he said ie change car for lower amount?

 

take someone with you and say they were with you when you signed and was witness to his comments

[manipulated]

how much neg eq do you have??

how old is your car??

how much mileage?

any extra's street pack b/t usb etc and what condition is it in??

have you taken it to any other dealers for a valuation to see what they will offer.

 

i know it is common practice to use less mileage in pcp agreements but it is normally only when customer pays a substansial deposit.

 

you have definitley been mis advised but proving it could be difficult if it is your signiture on everything including the demands and needs.

 

have you gone back and fronted the salesman that told you all this??

tell him you have come back as he suggested and want to do as he said ie change car for lower amount?

 

take someone with you and say they were with you when you signed and was witness to his comments

 

1. I think about 3-4k neg Equity?

2. 1 year old, its an 11 reg

3. 16k mileage after 13 months

4. no extra street pack, just the usb voice control, which was free on offer at the time. great condition, apart from a dint on the side of the rear door after someone hit it whilst it was parked, obviously happy to pay for this myself

5. yeah I got an offer about 7-8k a few months back

 

I didnt pay any substantial deposit, yeah it was a very stupid thing to sign :/ even the warranty in the needs and demands I couldn't get, because they cant give you a warranty if your doing over 20k miles, and they knew I was even though the agreement said 6k, so thats why it says they couldnt give me a recommendation lol

 

I did go to the salesman a few months ago to do exactly what he said with a friend, unfortunately they said I had neg equity, which is how I found out about all of this etc, They offered me a lower model car etc but for the same payments, I didnt take it as I would just be going more into negative equity. I did have a friend with me when they offered me the offer after 1 year but had no-one with me when I was first getting the car.

 

Im still pursuing the SAR request because I know that at least my most recent quote should still be on the system. Ive also been reading up about a bit of this, I never received a Pre COntract, which I took away with me etc, so im interested in if this SAR request will return one, I dont know how important it is though.

[kouri123]

that demands and needs could be your gt out of jail card, if it actually says your doing over 20k per annum. if so get in touch with FSA AND ALSO get in touch with ford credit and tell themto get involved. 7/8k offeredis way way to cheap for a zetec s tdci, nearly half price with only 13k on i dont think so!! i am actually going on holidays tomorrow so will not be able to offer any help for a week but if not resolved when i come back i will be in touch with you.....neil

[manipulated]

Hi Sorry for the delay, I too have been away and been busy. Thanks a lot for the help!

Im not sure about the Demands and Needs, I mean it doesnt specifically say Iw as doing over 20k, it says that They cant offer me warrant because either I am doing more than 20k or I rejected it.

In this case, It was because I was doing more than 20k but it doesnt specify anywhere...unless youve seen something ive missed?

 

Ive submitted my complaint to the ICO, just because I think the SAR request is still in complete. They sent me a screenshot of me on their system, it shows I received quotes, but as its only screenshots of the logs, you cant see anything about the quote etc. I dont think its too much trouble for them to click "Details" and then print a sheet, instead its just a screenshot of my history with lots of words and descriptions truncated as its in a list view.

 

I havent got Ford Credit involved just yet, because when I first spoke to Financial Ombudsman, they said its nothing to do with them. They just provided the credit and that it was Evans acting on their behalf, therefore the complaint is with Evans.

 

Thanks a lot for the help!