Diddled into giving back car HELP PLEASE!! bluestone/close credit management

[Gaston Grimsdyke]

Are they refusing or saying the docs are destroyed? Why do you think you're entitled to all of your money back?

[HadEnough]

They said that they were going send me the info then said that they were not sending me anything.

 

As for why I feel they owe me some or all the money back is because I was lied to and forced to sign the car over to them

and forced to sign an agreement to carry on paying for the car at a reduced rate.

 

I had paid almost 50%, or maybe just over 50%, when I asked if I could pay what was outstanding, about £400

they said I could only pay the full amount, about 6k, or they would be starting a CCJ that afternoon

and I'd get a CCJ and costs if I didn't sign the car over THERE and THEN.

 

Then of course theres PPI and unlawful charges.

 

All this is explained in more detail earlier in this thread.

Thanx

[Gaston Grimsdyke]

This all happened in 2005 so you are statute barred now.

[dx100uk]

you can still get the PPI back though

 

dx

[dx100uk]

post 1 says was still paying the reduced amount until the start of the thread

 

so not SB'ed?

 

dx

[Gaston Grimsdyke]

Payments made only extend limitation on a claim against a debtor, this is a claim by a debtor. Think OP could recover payments made in last 6 years, but nothing before that.

[dx100uk]

charges yes 6yrs

ppi no time limit

 

dx

[HadEnough]

I'd have thought that as I was still making payments then it's NOT sb'd as the account is still live?

I thought the six years starts once the last payment is made?

If it's different then how have I claimed bank charges back way older than 6 years?

Also as I was deceived into signing the car over and into making payments which I wasn't liable for would count for something?

 

So confused now?

[dx100uk]

pers i'd carry on with your thoughts

 

GG was confused i think

 

dx

[Gaston Grimsdyke]

No I am not in the least confused.

You have 6 years to bring a claim from the date the cause of action accrued.

 

That was in 2005, so its too late now.

 

Have a read of s29(5) of the Limitation Act and you will find its only a payment by the person facing the claim that extends time.

You can't avoid limitation of your own claim by making a payment, that would be a nonsense.

[HadEnough]

We seem to be going round in circles, we've been through this earlier in the thread.

My thoughts are that the limitation act can be waived as the 6 years starts from the date when you could be reasonably expected to realise there is a cause of action, i

n the same way that bank charge have been and still are being claimed back WAY beyond 6 years.

 

That said I think I'll take the easy way and just claim back any charges, PPI and everything I've paid to CCM since 2005.

 

I've roughly worked it out and it should be over 6k,

 

I'll claim the PPI seperately as this doesn't need a Judge to decide and I'm suffering financial difficulties and this will keep the rest of the claim well below the 5k small claims limit.

 

I feel that if I went for the full amount I wouldn't have the time in my busy day to get to know the relevent laws as fully as I'm sure I'd need,

as I'd expect CCM to have representation and fight this tooth and nail.

 

I know I would if I'd bought a debt and was then faced with having to pay out twice as much as they expected to gain, although I do admit I'd love to do it .

Thanx once again for all your input guys.

[HadEnough]

well, I'm back on the war path and desparate to sort this out so I 've worked out the PPI plus contractual interest and 8% simple.

 

Ive had to alter the template letter slightly so just want clarification that its ok to use.

 

In the meantime I am going to draft a letter asking for all payments I have made to Bluestone to be refunded and my reasons for this.

I belive its worth a try through small claims.

 

this is the letter I am sending for ppi:

 

DearSir or Madam,

 

 

Ibought the above plan from First National Motor Finance.

As you now own this account I wish to claim back my PPI premiums plus interest.

This policy was mis-sold, I contend, for the following reason(s): -

 

 

•I was self-employed and could not have claimed fully on the policy without ceasing work

– a more onerous condition than someone employed. I was not informed or warned of this.

 

Your staff stated or led me to believe that taking out a policy was a pre-condition of applying for a loan.

 

•Your staff did not offer me a clear choice of the loan with and the loan without insurance.

 

•Your staff did not give me an illustration showing the repayments with and without insurance until after I signed for the insurance.

I now contend that I was mis-sold this policy.

I claim back all the premiums and interest a tthe rate that I was charged on the account, (breakdown attached),

I have paid in connection with this payment protection insurance policy to the amount of

£3,091.19 plus statutory interest at 8% which totals £1,065.90.

The total amount of this claim equals £4157.09 (or whatever other rate the courts might order)

from the first payment that I made until the date of yoursettlement of this claim.

 

If I do not receive a favourable response from youwithin two weeks I will pursue this claim through the courts.

[HadEnough]

Anybody?

Can anyone advise me of what I can put in the letter asking for all the payments to be paid back please too?

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

I think you have done it yourself.

[HadEnough]

Thanks for the reply,

however it is the letter requesting the payments back I paid the debt company,

 

due to being cash cowed that I need help with.

 

There is no paperwork to prove that I owed the debt apart from the 800 pounds arrears from the original credit agreement.

 

I found a credit report that has no record of the debt,

it was dated 2007, the original agreement ran from may 2002 to may 2005.

 

That was on the report.

 

I have a recent credit report which also has no record of the debt even though I only stopped paying it last year and I ended the payments before I'd finished paying.

[dx100uk]

post 23 is useful

 

dx

[HadEnough]

I received a copy of original doc for car agreement and ppi with thick penned line through the ppi stage, mine does not show this line or a sig.

 

however, unless the PPI is in the car cost I cant find evidence of payment.

 

Setting PPI a side

 

I am going to write a letter claiming back all payments made due to their deceitful behaviour.

 

The debt was clearly £800 not £5224.

 

They have never sent me any evidence of the car sale after they took it, surely this is standard practice to prove sale.

 

They also sent a letter last year when I put the account in dispute saying they werent legally obiliged to send docs beyond 6 years

yet they suddenly come up with a doc apparently confirming no PPi being paid, so why the deceit??

 

Can anyone give me help with the wording or any legal arguments I can use please?

 

I have taken what I think will help form post 23 of this thread as you ahve suggested dx but need a bit more help please.

 

I know im dragging this out but now im off sick for a few weeks I am on it and egar to sort this out.

 

I have checked two credit reference agencies so far and no record of this debt either.

 

Going to check experian too and if thats clear does that mean they probably have recorded it at all?

 

the others checked are noddle and equifax.

thanks in advance for any help.

[HadEnough]

I've had another credit report and there is nothing on there for the debt at all.

Anybody?? can you offer me any advice please. Is it important to my case for refunding all payments made to them? Shall I mention this in my letter?

I want to claim the whole amount back that I've paid but need help with any relevant laws.

Edited May 8, 2013 by HadEnough
forgot something

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

DID you send the letter in post 62#?

[HadEnough]

Hi, Yes I did and thge info in post 63 is what I received back.

 

They have given up hassling me for the 700 outstanding on the account since I sent a letter disputing the debt.

 

Their reply last year was a flat refusal to send any original docs as they statute barred however,

they sent a copy of the original agreement with the pen through the PPI to 'prove' I haven't paid PPI.

 

They are now back to harassing me by phone...

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Ok so the ''creditor'' states that the documents are ''statute barred'' but documents MUST be retained for 6 years AFTER the account is closed, what is the situation with this account, if I'm going to try to put together a challenge together for you I would like the data fresh rather that having to glean bits here and there from old posts.

[HadEnough]

The original debt was a HP agreement with First national finance for a brand new MG Rover ZR.

The agreement was three years paying £218 per month.

 

At the end of the three years I was to give back the car or pay the balloon payment of £4156.50.

I defaulted on the last four payments

 

however,

I did keep in touch explaining that I was waiting on a remortagage and that I was out of work sick which is why I had missed the payments.

 

I was contacted by the company and told that a 'debt advisor' from the company must visit to discuss any options I have.

 

I was never told then that I could have given back the car with only the arrears to pay as I had paid over the £6224 that the credit agreement states

 

I could do should I want to terminate the agreement. (I had lost the original copy of the agreement when I moved two years before)

 

When the 'debt advisor' which I now know to be a collection agent called round to see me and my partner

at the time we were told that the only option we had was to voluntarily surrender the vehicle

and failure to do so then and there would result in a court order being obtained immediately along with court costs and a CCJ.

 

As I was younger and more nieve then I signed it over but only after asking him to see the original agreement which he said he didn't have.

I also enquired as to the fact that I had paid over a 1/3 so surely i had more rights, to which he said

'No you needed to have paid over half of the costs and that didn't apply anyway as i was in arrears.

 

I had discussed with the original finance company that I was trying to sell it to pay off the balloon payment and arrears

and even then they never told me about my right to terminate.

 

I signed the car over and they took it away to sell at auction.

 

I have never received evidence of sale or know what it went for.

 

They set up DD to pay £20 per month and all the info I was given was the amount I owed them after the sale of the car.

 

In total the debt to the original debtor was £5224, only £849 was arrears.

 

I did offer to pay the arrears off by the time the debt advisor came but he said it was too late.

 

The car was to be handed back the week before and wouldn't allow me to do that.

 

I have been paying the debt ever since until last year

 

I came accross the original doc stating my rights over termination and I noticed the PPI amount too.

 

I then put the account into dispute, SAR'd them.

 

To which they sent a few bits of paper of phone calls and the VS.

I then received a letter after I told them I wanted ALL info on me and they replied with a refusal as it was beyond 6 years.

 

So I sent a PPI claim letter and I received a letter stating I didn't pay it and the attached copy of the original agreement

(they obviously decided it was ok to send it to deny a PPI claim) with a penned line right through the middle.

 

Mine doesn't have a line through.

 

However, I can not find anywhere that I paid it unless it was part of the cars cost on the agreement.

I think that is everything.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

The 6 year point: The Finance Company must keep documents for 6 years AFTER an account is closed, was this the case here?

[HadEnough]

I'm still paying the debt, or I was until I put it into dispute.

[dx100uk]

you need to get them on the changed agreement too [ppi being struck through]

 

if this is true

 

then the agreement is void.

dx