Car Fault Not Declared By Dealer

[davej974]

Hi,

 

I bought a vehicle from a dealer in Durham this week. The car was advertised with no faults but on my way home i noticed that the steering wheel shakes under braking meaning that there is a fault.

 

I have called the dealers and stated this but they are refusing to pay any costs. They require me to drive all the way back to them so that they can inspect the car. I live over 250 miles away from them so it is not feasible for me to drive all the way back there.

 

Can someone please tell me where i stand legally? Should they pay for repair costs if i send them another garages invoice?

 

Thanks

 

Dave

[Conniff]

Welcome to the forum Dave. I have deleted your other thread on this subject, so just post in here now.

 

Your problem could be brakes or bushes but needs checking out to see if it renders the car dangerous in which case it would be illegal to have sold it.

 

Do you have a copy of the advert where they describe it having no faults? if no, get hold of and keep it safe in case there are later problems when it will come in handy.

 

When is the MoT certificate dated? If new, do you have any advisories with it?

 

As you are some distance from the seller, you could contact him and say you are getting it checked out locally and will advise on completion. It would be preferably to do this in writing, so email if you can and if not, phone him and also send a letter telling him the same thing, keeping a copy of the letter.

Use a garage that can give you a vat invoice with written report on their diagnosis.

 

If he says you can't do that and he must look at it, tell him in that case, he will have to pay to have it transported back to him.

 

When you know the extent and cause of the problem, you will then be better placed to decide what action to take.

 

For info, the seller should be given the opportunity to do the repairs first. If the car is considered undrivable, then it would need to be transported back to him or him to give authorisation to have it fixed locally to you. All this can be decided when you know what the problem is.

If he should agree to it being sorted locally, get that in writing also.

Edited November 25, 2011 by Conniff

[davej974]

Thanks for the reply.

 

Vehicle came with 12 months MOT. I reckon the fault is a warped break disk as this is not visible to the eye so would have got through a MOT.

 

I still have car advert and it does not mention any faults.

 

As i live so far away, can i demand they pay for petrol costs if they want to inspect vehicle before they authorize repairs?

[Conniff]

I still have car advert and it does not mention anyfaults.

 

That's a bit different to it being advertised as having no faults which is what you said in your original post, can you make that clearer please.

[davej974]

Sorry the advert just doesn't mention any faults. Surely they would have to list any faults on the advert though if there was some?

[scaniaman]

Dave, get real! Nobody will declare faults unless they are selling for spares or repair. Maybe not even then.

This thread could open up a can of worms in respect of who's responsible for costs in conveying car to selling dealers premises. In my humble opinion, except in exceptional circumstances, the buyer should bear these costs. After all, you chose to buy a car so far from home.

In this instance, i would have thought that the fault would have shown up on an extended test run. I say "extended" as i would not buy a car so far from home without giving it a thorough test first. Sorry, i know this is not what you want to hear.

[davej974]

Dave, get real! Nobody will declare faults unless they are selling for spares or repair. Maybe not even then.

This thread could open up a can of worms in respect of who's responsible for costs in conveying car to selling dealers premises. In my humble opinion, except in exceptional circumstances, the buyer should bear these costs. After all, you chose to buy a car so far from home.

In this instance, i would have thought that the fault would have shown up on an extended test run. I say "extended" as i would not buy a car so far from home without giving it a thorough test first. Sorry, i know this is not what you want to hear.

 

So you are saying dealers should be allowed to sell faulty cars??

The reason people buy from dealers is so that you can buy a car in the confidence.

[blackknight]

So you are saying dealers should be allowed to sell faulty cars??

The reason people buy from dealers is so that you can buy a car in the confidence.

 

Thats not what he said, he said nobody will say there is a fault in the hope the customer will ignore it or repair it at thier own cost.

As to transport charges, if the car is driveable (if its just a warped disc it will be) the costs will be down to you to get it back to the dealer.

You obviously had a reason to travel 250 miles to buy the car (probably price) but thats not the dealers fault.

Problems with the car,yes, but the fact you live 250 miles away is not his problem.

Get an estimate and try to have a deal with him

[grahamengineering]

blackknight and scania, couldn't of put it better myself.

[heliosuk]

Car? Year? Mileage? Price?

 

Might be a good place to start perhaps.

 

Vibration through the steering you state but can it be felt through the pedal as well?

 

And to what extent is it shaking?

 

It's important to define what the problem is before accusations of faulty cars are banded about and screaming SOGA.

[scaniaman]

Thank you blacknight. Dave, what do you call a dealer? Is it a firm who have premises like a showroom and a workshop? or a numpty that hangs around auctions several days a week hoping to pick up cheap cars to sell off his roadside yard complete with portacabin?? Up until 2005 i bought all my cars privately because i don't trust many in the second hand car trade---very little problems as i inspected them thoroughly prior to parting with cash. The new cars i have had since 2005 have been bought from main dealers, and two of the three i have had trouble with. In one case, the dealer( arnold shark) and the MANUFACTURER refused to carry out enough enquiries in order to ascertain what the fault on the car was. Marque dealers are a NO No as far as i'm concerned.

Many complainants on this site buy old, high milage cars and expect them to be fault free (so why did previous owner get shot?). Others who know little or nothing about modern cars are prepared to hand over £1000s for a car but are not willing to spend a few hundred on having the car professionally vetted before purchase.

As stated by Heliosuk, many in the motor trade today don't know themselves when a car has a fault, as salesmen and their superiors have little or no mechanical knowledge----all they know about is various finance deals AT BEST.

Edited November 25, 2011 by scaniaman

[oddjobbob]

It all deepnds on how bad this 'vibration' actually is.

 

If the braking system on the car would pass a current MOT test then, by definiton, it is safe to drive and the vibration from what is probably a slightly warped brake disc could, in a reasonable man's view, be taken as wear and tear and part of motoring.

 

A brake disc, by the way, is a SERVICE ITEM... they do not last the life of the car and need intermittent replacement.

 

It all depends on the age, mileage and price paid... if its a 1 yr old car with 7000m and was £15,000 then the dealer should obviously change the disc/ bush .... but if its a 6yo car with 65000m and was £3000 then I would expect somethnig to be wrong with it.. if it wss £20k new and £3k now, then it's 85% worn out.

 

A pair of brake discs should be

[traffer]

When buying a car more than a couple of years old (depending on mileage) it is probably wise to budget for a set of disks/pads. Even if a car has been hanging around a dealer forecourt for months, the pads/disks may deteriorate to such an extent that they need replacing anyway. Also, a lot of "cheap" aftermarket pads are available that are really not much good as the performance standards for them to get the "E" mark are quite low. It is always well worth spending a little more to buy a good brand, for example Mintex, Ferodo etc. (no plugs here just examples!)

 

The other thing it is worth doing when buying ANY car is to check that the wheel nuts can be undone! and are then re-tightened correctly.

[grifty]

Have the car inspected to determine the fault. Regardless of where you bought it the sale of goods act applies. Get a quote for repairs and call them again. If they wont play ball you still need to repair the car anyway. Then You can take them to the small claims court. TBH if it is a used car pitch you're probarbly wasting your time. The mot test is the minimum standard required to drive on UK roads and should never be used to determine a cars mechanical condition, always get an independant report before you part with your cash.

 

grifty

[oddjobbob]

If the dealer takes it for an MOT and it the braking system passes ok, do uo think there's any way a jusge will award any money to the buyer? I think not, after all a government agency has declared the car to be safe so where do you g ofrom there?

[heliosuk]

If the dealer takes it for an MOT and it the braking system passes ok, do uo think there's any way a jusge will award any money to the buyer? I think not, after all a government agency has declared the car to be safe so where do you g ofrom there?

Not true bob. The test is only valid at the time of inspection and is not a statement as to the roadworthiness of the car at any future date.

It cannot be relied on.

With this case it is important to understand the age, mileage, price paid and what the fault actually is being complained about before any qualitative advice can be given.

[oddjobbob]

@ helios

 

No I don't mean passed an mot 3 months ago... I mean today.. if it passes an MOT in its current condition tomorrow morning then by definition it CANNOT be dangerous as a government test has proven it to be safe.. on the day. Even with the wheel wobble, which i suspect is slight.

 

I know an MOT is useless as a histroic document, don't worry, been there, done that

[sailor sam]

How far into the journey home did you notice this 'fault'? Surely if it was that bad, you would of turned around and taken it back? Having said that, if it can be established that there was a fault at the point of sale, then the seller would be responsible for the cost of repair and any consiquential losses. Follow Conniff's advice and contact the seller (in writing) and ask him what his intentions are. As for buying a car 250 miles away, well personally I wouldn't BUT what is the difference in the OP buying locally to him and then taking the car on a long journey and having the same problem where it may be dangerous to drive it back?

[oddjobbob]

@ sailor

 

it does depend on how bad the fault is. ANY secondhand car will have faults, that's why cars a year old and 10,000m are only 65% of their new cost.

 

I don't think personally that SOGA is the way to go with a warped disc... which MUST be only slight as otherwise, like you say, the buyer would have turned round and taken it back there and then.

[oddjobbob]

Also, we've never heard the year / mileage / history / prive of this car fron the OP.

 

The dealer has asked them to take it back for inspection by them.. fair enough.

 

As helios said we cannot comment further till we know