Caught usining freedom bus pass that belongs to aunt - very frightenend

[london 2]

Hi All,

 

I was caught today using the freedom pass of my aunt in the morning outside the station. I am very frightened to all of this happening to me. I should not have used it in the first place, but my financial condition has led me into doing this as my aunt is currently out of the country and she is not aware of all this. The TFL staff have confiscated the freedom pass and have asked me several questions including whether it was my intent to travel by dodging the fare. I have got a small contract job in central london and was costing me a lot to travel to the office in the peak hours which led me to do this wrong thing. I agree i did wrong and have evaded the fare, but the officer refused to budge even after repeated attemps to persuade him that I am ready to pay the fine. I was told I might as well be prosecuted for the wrongdoing. I am not from this country and am planning to go back soon and am very worried and frightened about my outcome and what implications it would have on my future travels and visa. WOuld I be getting a criminal record?? This is the most dumbest thing I have ever done in my life for saving money and have never done anything wrong. I have been going through a lot of tough times and now this fare evasion case is giving me jitters...Is there any way I can call the tfl and request them an out of court settlement by paying the fine as I dont have enough visa as well to stay here longer. Please Help me guys...

[honeybee13]

Hello there and welcome to CAG.

 

It might be better for you to start your own thread, I'll ask the site team to have a look for you.

 

I have to tell you, and you won't want to hear this, that Freedom Pass misuse is taken very seriously because these passes are funded by the local authority and/or taxpayer.

 

When you say you will leave the country shortly, will you be coming back? I'm not sure what you mean about impact on your future travels or visas. Whose address did you give to TfL, your aunt's?

 

There is no point contacting TfL until they write to you. If you ring or write without their reference number on it, they won't be able to find the correspondence.

 

It would help people trying to help you if you could edit some paragraphs into your post please.

 

My best, HB

[london 2]

Thanks for replying friend,

 

My current visa to stay in this country is expiring soon and I have to leave the country as I would be ineligible to reside after my visa expiry date.

I wanted to know if this case of fare evasion would be entered into the criminal records bureau?

I would want to come back if I get a job opportunity here and am concerned about how it would affect me if i am convicted for this wrong doing. I am afraid I would be denied entry to UK or other countries...

Is there any chance of going for a out of court settlement as I am unable to stay in this country for long and avoid being put up on the criminal records?I am really ashamed of my wrong doing and this would not happen again whatever my situation and has been a learning lesson for me.

My aunt and myself stay at the same address and have given them the same and would like to know if she can apply for a new card or can she get this card back?

After seeing your reply regarding the treatment given to freedom pass abusers, i am more worried and dont know what to do...I feel like a moron for doing this thing

[honeybee13]

Hello again and thank you for the extra information.

 

I've told you as much as I can from reading the forum and what you need is our guys from the transport industry. I would hope they'll be along later. Try not to worry too much for now, they should be able to tell you how to deal with this.

 

My best, HB

[london 2]

Thanks for your help HB, I hope the transport guys help me out of this

[SRPO]

I find freedom pass abuse particularly distasteful, its like stealing from the elderly or disabled (even though its us tax payers that actually foot the bill).

I wont offer any help to the OP.

[rambo]

TFL will prosecute IMO, and rightly so.

[honeybee13]

Hello SRPO and Rambo, I respect your views.

 

Can anyone advise how the OP stands if s/he leaves the country before this is resolved please? It seems they may have left before there is a conclusion.

 

My best, HB

[honeybee13]

My aunt and myself stay at the same address and have given them the same and would like to know if she can apply for a new card or can she get this card back?

 

Having read another recent thread, probably the one you posted on, I believe the holder of the Freedom Pass needs to reapply for it.

 

My best, HB

[Old-CodJA]

It is possible that a summons could be served on the address given and if the defendant has left the country, therefore no response received, the case could be proven in absence.

 

Whilst the conviction for an offence of this nature is not a serious enough matter to affect freedom to travel, it could well catch up with a returning traveller and then the person convicted will have to attend a court to make a statutory declaration on oath, confirming that they did not know of the hearing and the Court will set aside the conviction.

 

This would not be the end of the matter as the rail company will then be free to re-issue the Summons without time constraints and start the case all over again

[london 2]

I understand misusing a freedom pass was very wrong and I am very sorry for my actions and I want to correct my mistake by repaying the tfl and close this matter before I leave the country. What are the chances of me given an out of court settlement for this?

[honeybee13]

Hello OC.

 

I apologise if this is a naive question but would value your opinion, as ever.

 

Have you come across this in your work at all? I just wondered if people in this situation ignore the letter and take any consequences if they return? I suppose the alternative is to plead guilty by post from out of the country and then arrange to pay any fine levied by the court, which may not be attractive to everyone.

 

I probably haven't worded this very well, I was just sort of wondering aloud about the options, never having been involved with a court.

 

My best, HB

[honeybee13]

I understand misusing a freedom pass was very wrong and I am very sorry for my actions and I want to correct my mistake by repaying the tfl and close this matter before I leave the country. What are the chances of me given an out of court settlement for this?

 

Hello again. Our posts crossed just now.

 

I don't know if you will be offered the chance to settle out of court for a Freedom Pass case. OC may be able to make an educated guess, but it's up to TfL in the end. As I said, you need to wait for their letter before you contact them.

 

How much longer are you here? These letters can take some weeks to arrive. Will your aunt be able to forward the letter to you maybe? That way you could write to TfL and ask them if they will settle.

 

My best, HB

[Old-CodJA]

Yes, the longest lapse between a conviction and a re-opening that I have experienced was a case heard in 2004 and proven in absence. The defendant was out of the country until late 2009 when he returned to a new address and was reported for a new matter. At that time a previous conviction came to light. He made a statutory declaration to say he was in India at the time of the 2004 hearing and did not know of the listing. The case was re-issued and heard afresh, when he pleaded guilty.

[london 2]

I am eligible to stay until the beginning of January 2012. But I am planning to leave by November end due to financial difficulties.

My aunt does not know yet about this and am really frightened to tell her about this...but I know I have to tell her at some point and am assuming she could let me know if she receives the letter after I left.

[hungryhiphoe]

I suggest you contact a solicitor that deals with fare evasion asap. Just type 'fare evasion solicitor' into google. You're likely to be prosecuted for your actions, and likely to receive a criminal record. This may indeed prevent you from entering the UK and from finding a job if you were successful in re-entering. It is perhaps also best to alert your aunt as to your actions as soon as possible. If she knows now, and has time to cool down, a letter of good character from her is a very useful tool, as it was her card you used. If you tell her closer to the date, she may be less likely to write the letter if she's angry. I do suggest that you contact a solicitor as soon as possible on this case though. Depending on the circumstances using one may cost you about the same amount the fine would, and would prevent you from getting a criminal record. Best of luck.

[Old-CodJA]

I suggest you contact a solicitor that deals with fare evasion asap. Just type 'fare evasion solicitor' into google. You're likely to be prosecuted for your actions, and likely to receive a criminal record. This may indeed prevent you from entering the UK and from finding a job if you were successful in re-entering. It is perhaps also best to alert your aunt as to your actions as soon as possible. If she knows now, and has time to cool down, a letter of good character from her is a very useful tool, as it was her card you used. If you tell her closer to the date, she may be less likely to write the letter if she's angry. I do suggest that you contact a solicitor as soon as possible on this case though. Depending on the circumstances using one may cost you about the same amount the fine would, and would prevent you from getting a criminal record. Best of luck.

 

Whilst I agree with some of your post and I agree that telling the rightful holder of the pass as early as possible is very sensible for the reasons that you state, consulting a solicitor is not a magical remedy. It will not guarantee that this 'wouid prevent you from getting a criminal record' as you suggest.

 

Consulting a solicitor does not make a crime go away, but it MAY help you to avoid a conviction by reaching an agreement to deal with it by an alternative to prosecution. The rail company do not have to agree to this and it would be entirely wrong to give the impression that would be the case

[london 2]

Thanks again OC, HB and hungryhiphoe,

 

Could you please tell me how much would it cost me if I approach a lawyer regarding my case ? I am not financially sound to afford a lawyer and is there any other way to get advice for my case?

 

I would also appreciate if you could please let me know what should be done to get the freedom pass back to my aunt ? I have done this wrong thing without her knowledge and she has to suffer for it. What can I do to get her pass back ?

 

Can I apply again now or she has to do in person ? Can she apply when she comes back or does she need to wait for the case to be completed? She does not know that I took her pass as she was away.

 

I am really worried about the outcome of my case and is giving me sleepless nights for which I am solely responsible. I want to correct my mistake by repaying the fare and penalties.

 

Could you please advice how much would I be fined and how much would it cost me to settle approximately ?

[honeybee13]

Hello again.

 

Could you please tell me how much would it cost me if I approach a lawyer regarding my case ? I am not financially sound to afford a lawyer and is there any other way to get advice for my case?

 

Well, you're getting a bit of advice here from a senior prosecutor, aren't you? The easiest way to find out the cost is to ring a couple of solicitors and ask them. I don't know if the Community Legal Service people would help with this sort of case? Try contacting them as well.

 

As for getting a new pass, I said a few posts back that your aunt will have to apply herself, so you do need to let her know. TfL are probably keeping the confiscated one as evidence. I don't know if she can apply while the case is going on.

 

I hope OC or someone from the industry will tell you about possible fines and costs. Settling is up to the company to decide. Once you hear from them, you'll be able to send a letter and ask for that.

 

Have you heard from them yet?

 

My best, HB

[Old-CodJA]

So far as consulting a lawyer is concerned, the only way to be sure what they will charge you is to ask THEM I'm afraid.

 

This is not normally a charge that will qualify for legal aid. You might ask a Solicitor local to you who deals with criminal matters for an initial short consultation at an agreed fixed fee, but that's the best I can suggest.

 

Only your Aunt can apply for a replacement of her Freedom Pass and the best way to do this will be for her to show evidence that you had taken it without her consent whilst she was out of the country and that TfL are intending to prosecute you for the offence.

[london 2]

Hi HB,

 

Sorry I was not clear in my question regarding the solicitor representation...

 

I was worried on the earlier comments regarding the prosecution and criminal record and was wondering if I need to actually hire a lawyer to accept my mistake or I can be represented by someone if the tfl decided to prosecute. I would want to pay the fine and dont go the court as I would be ruined if I get a criminal record.

I have not yet received any communication as of today from tfl

 

Best Regards,

[honeybee13]

I was worried on the earlier comments regarding the prosecution and criminal record and was wondering if I need to actually hire a lawyer to accept my mistake or I can be represented by someone if the tfl decided to prosecute. I would want to pay the fine and dont go the court as I would be ruined if I get a criminal record.

 

You're not at the court stage yet though, are you? Once you hear from TfL, I imagine you'll be writing to them along the lines I hope OC will tell you. It would only go to court once they've considered what you say and if they decided not to settle with you.

 

As for being represented if it did go to court, I think I'm right in saying that can only be a lawyer, but maybe someone else will comment on that. Or you could write to the court instead, if you're not in the country by then.

 

My best, HB

[SRPO]

If you intend to plead guilty there is no requirement for a lawyer, you could have a friend speak for you (with permission of the court) if you feel unable to properly present any mitigation.

[Old-CodJA]

If it does get to issue a Summons to attend Court and you wish to plead guilty, there is no need for you to attend Court. You could write a letter of apology, explain your financial circumstances and ask the Magistrates to deal with it without you having to be there. They would almost certainly impose a fine and the Court would write to you telling you how and when to pay.

 

The case is not at this stage yet.

 

You need to slow down a little.

 

Wait until they have written to you and wait and see what they decide after you have written in reply.

[mrdell80]

Hi manoj london. You really cannot do anything without the letter.

The letter took me about 6 weeks to arrive. So don't expect anything soon!