Racial Discrimination: Advocacy Fees and Schedule of Loss

[Sokoto]

Please, I would need answers to:

1) What are the likely total fees for an advocate to represent a claimant in a seven day Racial Discrimination hearing at an Employment Tribunal?

2) What is the likely amount to be paid to an advocate accepting a No-Win-No-Fee premise for the same 7 days hearing as in item (1) above?

3) Is there any source through which one can confirm awarded payment on racial discrimination cases? Is it possible an award can be made without the award ever coming to public knowledge? I have asked this question because I would like to know if compensatory payment for racial discrimination could be as high as £1million? If not what are the likely variables to consider.

Thanks!

[Sidewinder]

On the subject of recent tribunal awards, a Personnel Today article last month gave a breakdown of figures over the year from September 2010 to September 2011 and the details are here http://www.xperthr.co.uk/article/110471/race-discrimination-awards-2010-11.aspx

 

They show that the maximum award in the last year was just over £62,000 and the average payout just over £12,000. That is some way down on previous years awards, but it has always been the case that the largest awards will only be made where the claimant has suffered the most serious type of discrimination resulting in the biggest loss of earnings. By far the biggest part of any award would reflect losses suffered either as a result of the discrimination or where future earnings are likely to be affected, thus, an employee on £200,000 a year and whose career is likely to be affected will be awarded far more than a £20,000 employee.

 

As far as I am aware Tribunal awards are a matter of public record.

 

Can't help with the legal costs question, as I guess that it varies wildly depending on who you choose. I can only suggest making a few phone calls and get some outline quotes.

[Sokoto]

Sidewinder,

Thank you for the lead.

Could you help in understanding the distinction between:

1) racial discrimination as a background claim to unfair dismissal and not a free standing claim.

AND

2) racial discrimination as a free standing claim and unfair dismissal a free standing claim.

Which should be better to argue for during the hearings?

[madari]

Discrimination is better to argue as the burden is on the employer to prove that they did not discriminate.[this is difficult for the employer to defend/prove]

 

Where as in unfair dismissal the the burden is on the employee [reversed]to prove that they have been unfairly dismissed.[this is difficult for the employee to prove]

 

Why do you ask?

Edited October 4, 2011 by madari

[honeybee13]

Hello there.

 

You've asked some quite technical questions which are outside my knowledge and maybe quite a few of the people here. But I'm pleased to see you've had some answers from people in the know here.

 

To try to progress your question about representation, I'm not sure if by 'advocate' you mean a solicitor or a barrister. As Sidewinder said, to find out solicitor costs you need to ring some, but I would say from posts on the forum that a NWNF one if they accepted the case would want around 30% of the award, possibly plus some disbursements.

 

Barristers I would guess come in at a four-figure sum for a day. I understood you approach them via a solicitor, but I could be out of date on that.

 

My best, HB

[Sokoto]

The Order that came out was confusing so wanted to seek ideas before requesting the ET where necessary for the Order to be changed to reflect that the claim is on these fronts: (A) Unfair dismissal and (B) Race Discrimination and © Unfair dismissal on the basis of race discrimination. The relevant order that came out that is causing the confusion:

1. Was the Claimant dismissed because of his race. The reference to preceeding matters in the Claim Form is to background rather than any free standing claim.

2. If the Respondent failed to follow a fair procedure should compensation be reduced on the basis that the Claimant would, or might have been, dismissed had a fair procedure been followed.

 

 

Discrimination is better to argue as the burden is on the employer to prove that they did not discriminate.[this is difficult for the employer to defend/prove]

 

Where as in unfair dismissal the the burden is on the employee [reversed]to prove that they have been unfairly dismissed.[this is difficult for the employee to prove]

 

Why do you ask?

[madari]

I would go with the first one [number 1]

 

You will struggle with Number 2.

 

Good luck

[Sokoto]

honeybee13,

Thanks for the idea. But is it possible to have a cap on what the Advocate (The legal expert to represent at the Hearing) could receive?

The option for now is on NWNF advocate because our experience showed that some legal experts are fundamentally corrupt and your cant see it written on their heads. When you pay them they might not do so much research and work to ensure you are victorious.

I could borrow money to pay a legal expert if one can be certain that such an individual is to fight for me 100% including looking at the European Law to get extra remedy as it seems that they have messed my career life. No paper evidence to show that they have messed my career but it seems that I would have to be retrained to get a new job and start life afresh which is easier said than done. For the past several years I was confined to doing this routine technical work with no approval from management to allow me develop on any other areas of the business. Now this technical area is limited and someone called me over the phone with withheld number that they dont give job to someone with the potential to take them to ET.

[madari]

NWNF are the most corrupt, stay well clear !!!!

 

Sorry to tell you this,but you will find that the only winners that will come out of this are the legal experts and NOT you nor your employer.

[Sokoto]

Maybe I was not very clear.

The question I wanted to answer is the distinction between (A), (B) and © in my earlier response to you which I had requested and the final ORDER from the CMD which you referenced as number 1? The number two would set in when the ET finds merit in my case.

 

I would go with the first one [number 1]

 

You will struggle with Number 2.

 

Good luck

[madari]

If you can prove to the ET that your dismissal was on the grounds of your race then number two does not enter the equasion ,as it then becomes an `automatic unfair dismissal`

[Sokoto]

madari,

I am sorry that my question still lingers on. Let me rephrase it this way. What is the meaning of these statement included with empasis on the underlined words in the Order number 1 above:

 

The reference to preceeding matters in the Claim Form is to background rather than any free standing claim.

[madari]

hi,

it simply means that the ET will only consider discriminatory allegations/elements which led tto your dismissal as nothing more than background information.

 

If i was you i would challenge this and try to bring the discrimination claim to the fore otherwise your case will be very weak.

 

Without knowing the full basis of your claim i am unable to give any further feedback

[Sokoto]

Thank you. So any suggestion on what need to be done to ensure that the Discrimination issue is considered independently as well as consider as a contributory factor to the unfair dismissal? The law is just too technical and complicated.

I do not know why the Order was done that way. The Counsel representing the employer raised the issue as to whether racial discrimination was out of time since it was claimed it started several years ago.

[madari]

The `out of time ` argument is what all employer`s use,it is a common tactic.

 

I strongly suggest that you seek legal advice as they are obviously trying to confuse you.

 

I Stress without a valid discrimination claim you are literally wasting your time and money with your case,therefore it is in your interest that you get the CMD order reviewed and amended before it is too late.

 

May i ask who represented you at the CMD?

Edited October 4, 2011 by madari