Help needed please - Council Tax Baliff charges for not visiting

[Wisingup]

good morning all, apols for not posting for a while I was thinking about what I should do.

 

I can confirm that the £130 has been credited to our account this morning, so now I feel able to continue the pursuit of monies I feel that are owed to us. I did contact Mr Head of revenues yesterday to ask for a response to my email of over a week ago, and no surprise that I have not received an answer despite copying in Mr CEO. I am tied up for a bit this morning but will come back and read the post again that HW has posted as it certainly looks like the route that I need to go down.

 

What I dont get is why they are avoiding the issue - surely they should be whiter than white especially in todays world? What do they have to hide that the Council wont give me the answers we want?

[ploddertom]

What I dont get is why they are avoiding the issue - surely they should be whiter than white especially in todays world? What do they have to hide that the Council wont give me the answers we want?

 

That is quite easy, the Council haven't a clue and because they believe the Bailiffs are holier than thou, they think everything the Bailiff does, says & charges is correct. A better solution for some of the Councils would be to employ someone whose sole purpose in his/her job is to:

a - monitor this site to see the sorts of tricks they get up to

b - scrutinise more of what the bailiffs are doing

 

PT

[Wisingup]

well know me over, I have received an email response from Mr Head of revenues and have attached the levy they claim to have made. I am not sure what to do next. and as for the levy well I am just astounded as Mr Bailff never ever attended and we have never seen this notice before, and the details on the notice are extremely scarce considering they are required to complete a minimum amount o informationif he called during work hours the car would have been parked at work and I can prove it as I have to pay for my parking! he called at 6.50am on the morning of 6 Jan because we saw him parked outside. anyway the content of the email is as follows. All thoughts would be gratefully appreciated as I am fast losing steam and getting more and more annoyed with this bunch of incompetent muppets.

 

Dear Mr & Mrs Very Hacked off

 

Re: Council Tax

 

I refer to your email dated 1 February 2011, concerning Council Tax account xxxxxxxxx. Your enquiry has been investigated and I can advise you as follows.

 

When dealing with enquiries, we carry out a thorough investigation of the complaint itself and the accounts for the customer. This is the reason why we have mentioned the amounts outstanding on your 2010/2011 account.

 

One of my officers has been in contact with Equita Bailiffs and confirms the dates for each visit and levy of goods as follows:

 

 

Amount of Fee

 

 

Description

 

 

Date

 

 

£38.00 Levy 05/01/2011

 

 

£24.50 1st Visit 09/12/2009

 

 

£18.00 2nd Visit 16/12/2009

 

 

£130.00 Use of Vehicle 05/01/2011

 

 

 

 

Total £210.50

 

As requested I have attached a copy of the levy that was obtained on 5 January 2011.

 

Equita Bailiffs have advised that they responded to your complaint about Mr XX (bailiff) on 28 January 2011. I have also attached a copy of that letter for reference.

 

I trust this clarifies the situation. However, if you require any further assistance with this matter, please telephone the Customer Service Team on 0121 464 8299. Alternatively, for general Council Tax enquiries, please contact the Revenues Service on 0121 303 1113.

 

A copy of this response has been forwarded to Mr CEO for his records.

 

Yours sincerely

Mr Head of Revenues

20110208114913494.pdf

[ploddertom]

I assume this is the first you know of this? My great problem with these are that the Form 7's are not sequentially numbered, this could have been written yesterday for all you know. Also where is your copy, where did he leave that? If you can prove the vehicle was elswhere on the day he claims then stuff him. He is also trying to claim Levy Fee & "Van" Fee at the same time so he is wrong there as well.

 

PT

[Wisingup]

My car was parked in a car park in Birmingham City, and I can prove the time I left my office that night so it would be impossible that my car would have been at home before 7pm or thereabouts.

 

He is also trying to claim levy Fee & "Van" Fee at the same time so he is wrong there as well, why is he wrong here?

 

what do I do nxt PT?

[hallowitch]

Thank you very much for this useful piece of information I will now file a regulation 46 complaint at county court against Bailiff Mr xxxxxxxxxxxx

 

 

1 work in Birmingham city centre i use my car for work(colleagues /CCTV)will confirm on the evening in question i left my place of employment at (employment records will confirm this)

the the travelling distance between my place of employment is (miles) this journey takes approx (time) therefore i would have to have been travelling in excess of 150/200 mph for my full journey home that evening for my car to be at my property on 5/1/11 at (time)

 

I am also advised that The council tax administration and enforcement regulations 1992 amend

regulation 45 schedule 5 charges connected with distress

do not allow for a van fee to be charged the same day as levy fee

 

 

IF it wasn't so serious it would be laughable

A bailiff has put his name to document that could lose him his certificate he did not follow the regulations

posh that up and send something like off to Equita &BCC

 

pot it up when you posh it and someone will tweek it for you

[Wisingup]

Hi HW, thanks for the advice, that is exactly what I am going to do this evening, although one thing here concerns me - should there be a time that the bailff supposedly allowed visitied the property? what time are they allowed to call just so that when I put my letter together they cant come back and say that he is allowed to visit at 9pm at night?!!

 

In response to PT post of earlier today - no i have not seen this note before, he did not leave this at our home, and the reason he didnt was because he did not attend when he claims he did, because he called at 6.50am on the morning of 6th Jan because we saw him.....tut tut....we saw you.......

 

also I have looked up the regs you mentioned and have pasted it below - is that the reg u meant?

 

45 (5) The person levying distress on behalf of an authority shall carry with him the written authorisation of the authority, which he shall show to the debtor if so requested; and he shall hand to the debtor or leave at the premises where the distress is levied a copy of this regulation and Schedule 5 and a memorandum setting out the appropriate amount, and shall hand to the debtor a copy of any close or walking possession agreement entered into.

[ploddertom]

 

 

A bailiff has put his name to document that could lose him his certificate he did not follow the regulations - wonder how many other things he has falsified to his employers & their clients not to mention the monies he has skimmed from those he has visited

posh that up and send something like off to Equita &BCC

 

 

PT

[Wisingup]

Hi there I have a few questions?

 

1. what can you tell me about bailiffs working hours?

2. what can you tell me about what should be legally completed on a notice form?

3. can someone explain why a levy and a van fee cannot be claimed on the same day?

4. should the form say what time they called and served notice?

 

Sorry if it seems that i am a bit blonde but want to put together a comprehensive letter to bcc & equita.

 

thanks

 

wu

[Wisingup]

hi there - can anyone steer me on the questions above then I can set to writing my letter!

[jimbo45]

Hi there

Ist and 2nd Visit fees are legitimate -- even if they didn't actually do the visits unless you can categorically PROVE they didn't attend -- and that's not so easy as it sounds.

 

Now provided you haven't let these ****bags in to your property and they haven't levied anything all other charges ARE ILLEGAL --VAN FEES, WAITING TIME etc etc etc.

 

If they DID levy a vehicle there would have to be at least a notice on the vehicle --these days it would either have been removed or have a wheel clamp fitted.

 

Only pay the 2 visit fees --around 42 GBP in total -- that's ALL you have to pay by law.

 

It's about time the Councils saw the real pointlessness of using Bailiff's for Council Tax enforcement -- a typical property probably wouldn't have enoough saleable goods to cover typical debts these days anyway apart from Vehicles and jewellery .

 

Note that these Bailiff's have ABSOLUTELY ZERO RIGHT to enter your property without invitation AT ANY TIME and I'm sure you won't let them in yourself. If they come to yout door just politely tell them to Foxtrot Oscar.

 

Incidentally seeing off the Bailiff doesn't stop you from having to pay the Council tax but at least if everybody told these thugs to Foxtrot Oscar the Council might consider better methods of collection --especially these days where most families budgets are under SEVERE Pressure.

 

Cheers

jimbo

Edited February 9, 2011 by jimbo45

[Wisingup]

thanks for your post Jimbo, but we have moved on a bit now thanks to the advice I have has from the great CAGGers on here, I just need to get a few answers to my questions in post 84 and I will be away!

[hallowitch]

Hi there I have a few questions?

 

1. what can you tell me about bailiffs working hours?

6am till 9pm

http://www.dca.gov.uk/enforcement/agents02.htm

2. what can you tell me about what should be legally completed on a notice form?

 

for a car make model reg levy fee charge it should not have total amount it should be broken as

outstanding council tax

levy fee £xxxx

walking possession fee £xxxx

3. can someone explain why a levy and a van fee cannot be claimed on the same day?

 

until the bailiff gains a levy he is NOT there to remove goods he is there to Levy distress

 

 

4. should the form say what time they called and served notice?

 

yes and as in your posts the notice of seizure should be left by the bailiff at the time of the levy not sent when you make complain about fees charged

 

Sorry if it seems that i am a bit blonde but want to put together a comprehensive letter to bcc & equita.

 

thanks

 

wu

 

hope this info helps

[Wisingup]

Brilliant - I will be back!

Edited February 9, 2011 by Wisingup

[wonkeydonkey]

1 Between 6am and 9pm

 

2. write in the first instance to

The Chief Clerk

Anytown Magistrates Court

Address

 

 

3. A debtor must be allowed to satisfy the order following the 1st visit often a 2nd visit takes place and the bailiff carries out a levy and asks the debtor to sign the WP the debtor still has an agreed period of time to pay the debt and it is ONLY after this the bailiff can attend to remove the goods levied on and then they can charge a "van fee"

 

4. You would be able to attach a statement of truth to your letter which gives all the facts /reasons why you have requested a "summons" be issued etc.

[hallowitch]

can you explain this to me please

 

when did you pay the council/baillif how much of this did you pay before the levy date

outstanding £806 73

bailiffs costs £199.50

total if paid today £306.23

[Wisingup]

Hi HW

 

I hope the below answers your questions, dont forget that the £199.50 includes VAT (I still dont know what makes up the £199?!)

 

Bill for 01.04.2009 - 31.03.2010 =£962.73 outstanding

£98 payment made = £864.73 outstanding

£57 court costs added (June 2009) = £921.73 outstanding

£115 payment made = £806.73 outstanding as of 02.09.2009

 

November 2010 account passed to Equita - the following happens:

£42.50 costs added between Nov 2009 and Jan 2010 (actual date unknown as there is no correspondence) = £849.23 outstanding.

 

Hubby calls and makes arrangement to pay £70 each month with Equita this has been strictly adhered to and payments commenced in Feb 2010 with final payment due Jan 2011 of £79.23.

 

The total amount outstanding as at 1 January 2011 was £149.23p which is the amount that he came knocking for, his levy and van charges were £157.00, so all that added together equates to £306.23

 

 

The rest you know.

Edited February 9, 2011 by Wisingup

[hallowitch]

I hope the below answers your questions, dont forget that the £199.50 includes VAT (I still dont know what makes up the £199?!)

 

There is no VAT charged on bailiff fees when collecting council tax

[Wisingup]

on the form that I added to one of my posts it states

 

Bailiffs Charges (inc VAT) £199.50??????????????

 

now if the vehicle charge was £130.00 was could £69.50 possibly be attained to?

[Wisingup]

Surely the amount claimed to owed by us to Equita should be £149.23 and not £806.23 as signed in the Form?

 

as it states:

 

Amount owing Penalty Notice Council Tax domestic Rates £806.23

Bailiff Charges (inc VAT) £199.50

total Amount if paid today £306.23

 

I dont get this, is it me or has this form been completed incorrectly? or should the form state was the liability was at the time that BCC transferred it to Equita?

 

i think i am going crazy here?

 

 

aaaaaaaaaaagggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhh

Edited February 9, 2011 by Wisingup

[hallowitch]

The total amount outstanding as at 1 January 2011 was £149.23p

final payment due Jan 2011 of £79.23.

there can be no increase in this outstanding balance all bailiff fees have been added (1st/2nd visit) the next fee wound be the levy fee(levy fee being £24.50)

 

 

 

[Wisingup]

I think there is some confusion here, so I gonna try and clear it up. There were 2 payments to go one for Dec of £70 and the last payment due at the end of Jan for £79.23. So total amount outstanding at 1 Jan would have been £149.23. As we didnt get to make the payment before Equita closed for Christmas we wanted to clear the full balance and not just the December payment at the soonest opportunity, when we called Equita's offices on 4 Jan it was too late as it had been passed to Mr Bailff for collection. On 4 Jan we were told by Equita to call Mr Bailff which we did and he told us that he did not have our case notes and to call him on 5th Jan after 4pm (which we did) It was at that point that he added his charges (levy and van on the same date) and told us that if we wanted him off our backs it was going to cost us £306.23, so we paid up.

[Wisingup]

you could say that we were almost out of the woods with this bill and it was nearly paid off, and as we had a little spare money decided that we wanted to go into the new year not having this hanging around our necks, little did we know that he was going to have the little spare that we had and all of what we didnt. It was tough going for the rest of the month, walking to work and spending what we had with extreme caution. Mr Bailff made our lives a bloody misery, it was the toughest January of our married lives. the idiot he is.

[hallowitch]

I think there is some confusion here, so I gonna try and clear it up. There were 2 payments to go one for Dec of £70 and the last payment due at the end of Jan for £79.23. So total amount outstanding at 1 Jan would have been As we didnt get to make the payment before Equita closed for Christmas we wanted to clear the full balance and not just the December payment at the soonest opportunity, when we called Equita's offices on 4 Jan it was too late as it had been passed to Mr Bailff for collection. On 4 Jan we were told by Equita to call Mr Bailff which we did and he told us that he did not have our case notes and to call him on 5th Jan after 4pm (which we did) It was at that point that he added his charges (levy and van on the same date) and told us that if we wanted him off our backs it was going to cost us £306.23, so we paid up.

£149.23.

levy fee £27 (if lawful)

outstanding balance £173.23

[Wisingup]

I understand that what you are saying that if you add a levy fee of £27 to what we had outstanding at 1 Jan 2011 it would equal £173.23, the point is that he did not attend therefore would not have been able to levy and took a payment of £306.23 on 5 Jan.

 

I dont see what you are driving at HW, am I confused? I not understand what you are saying to me? sorry can you explain?