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    • If anybody has any advice here, it would be greatly appreciated, I already suffer with pre-existing disabilities & have struggled with this so far. 
    • so return of goods order etc etc read upload  scan pages to jpg, redact in mspaint. the convert to and merge to one mass PDF  read upload and use the online listed sites for all 3 stages. do you want to keep the car? i will guess this was a manual paper claimform direct from the co.court or was it org sent from salford bulk processing and has just got reaq ssigned?      
    • Speaking of the reformatory boys, here they are with all of their supporters, some of whom traveled with them from miles away, all carefully crammed together and photographed to look like there were more than about 80 .. rather like Farages last rally with even fewer people crammed around what looked like an ice cream van or mobile tea bar ... Although a number in the crowd apparently thought they were at a vintage car rally as they appeared to be chanting 'crank-her'. A vintage Bentley must be out of view.   Is this all there is? Its less than the Tory candidate. - shut up and smile while they get a camera angle that looks better
    • in order for us to help you we require the following information:- Which Court have you received the claim from ? Canterbury Name of the Claimant ? Moneybarn No 1   How many defendant's  joint or self ? One Date of issue –  29/05/24 Acknowledged by 14/06/24  Defence by 29/06/24  Particulars of Claim PARTICULARS OF CLAIM 1.  By a Conditional Sale Agreement in writing made on 25th August 2022. Between the Claimant and Defendant, the Claimant let to the Defendant on Conditional Sale. A Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi (200 P S) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200cc (Sep.2015) Registration No, ******* Chassis number ***************** (“The Vehicle”).  A copy of the agreement is attached  2.  The price of the goods was £15,995.00. The Initial Rental was £8500.00.  The total charge for credit was £3575.;17 And the balance of £11,070.17 was payable by 59 equal consecutive monthly instalments of £187 63. payable on the 25th of each month. 3.  The following were expressed conditions of the set agreement, Clause 8: Our Right to End this Agreement  8.1   Subject to sending you the notice as required by law, any of the following events will entitle us to end this Agreement: 8.1.2  You fail to pay the advance payment (if any) or any of the payments as specified on the front page of this agreement or any other sum payable under this Agreement. 8.1.3 If any of the information you have given us before entering into this Agreement or during the term of this Agreement was false 8.1.4 We consider, acting reasonably, that the goods may be in jeopardy or that our rights in the goods may otherwise be prejudiced. 8.1.5 If you die 8.1.6 If a bankruptcy petition is presented against you; if you petition for your own bankruptcy, or make a live arrangement with your creditors or call a meeting of them. 8. 1.7 If in Scotland, you become insolvent or sequestration or a receiver, judicial factor or trustee to be appointed over any of your estate, or effects or suffer an arrestment, charge attachment or other diligence to be issued or levied on any of your estate or effects or suffer any exercise, or threatened exercise of landlords hype hypothec 8.1.8 If you are a partnership, you are dissolved 8.1.9 If the goods are destroyed, lost, stolen and/or treated by the insurer as a total loss in response to an insurance claim. 8.1.10 If we reasonably believe any payment made to us in respect of this Agreement is a proceed of crime. 8.1.11 If steps are taken by us to terminate any other agreement which you have entered into with us. Clause 9.  Effect of Us Terminating Agreement 9.1 If this Agreement terminates under clause 8 the following will apply 9.1.1 Subject to the rights given to you by law, you will no longer be entitled to possession of the goods and must return them to us to an address as we may reasonably specify, (removing or commencing the removal of any cherished plates) together with a V5 registration certificate, both sets of keys and a service record book. If you are unable or unwilling to return the goods to us then we shall collect the goods and we'll charge you in accordance with clause 10.3 9.1.2 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you for all payments and all other sums do under this agreement at the date of termination 9.1.3 We will sell the goods or public sale at the earliest opportunity once the goods are in a reasonable condition which includes a return of the items listed in clause 7.1.4 9.1.4 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you of the rest of the Total Amount Payable under this agreement less: ( a) A rebate for early settlement ias required by law which will be calculated and notified to you at the time of payment (b) The proceeds of sale of the goods (if any) after deduction of all costs associated with finding you and/or the goods, recovery, refurbishment and repair. Insurance, storage, sale, agents fees, cherished plate removal, replacement keys, costs associated with obtaining service history for the goods and in relation to obtaining a duplicate V5 registration certificate 4, The following are particulars required by Civil Procedure Rules. Rule 7.9 as set out in 7.1 and 7.2 of the associated Practice Direction entitled Hire Purchase Claims:- a)     The agreement is dated 25 August 2022. And is between Moneybarn No1 Limited  and xxxxxxxxx under agreement  number xxxxxx. b)    The claimant was one of the original parties to the agreement. c)    The agreement is regulated under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. d)    The goods claimed Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi ( 200 PS) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200 cc (Sep2015} Registration No ^^^^^^^ Chassis number ***************** e)     The total price of the goods £19570 f)     The paid up sum £1206 5 g)    The unpaid balance of the total price £7505 (to include charges) h)    A default notice was sent to the defendant on 20th February 2024 by First class post i)      The date when the right to demand delivery of the goods accrued 14 March 2024 j)      The amount if any claimed as an alternative to delivery of the goods 7505 22 include charges 5.  At the date of service of the notice the instalments were £562.89 in arrears. 6. By reason of the Termination of the Agreement by the notice, defendant became liable to pay the sum of £7502 7. The date of maturity the agreement is 24th August 2027. 8. Further or alternative by reasons of  the Defendant breaches of the agreement by failing to pay the said instalments, the Defendant evinced an intention no longer to be bound by the Agreement and repudiated it by the said Notice the claimant accepted that repudiation 9. By reason of such repudiation the claimant has suffered loss and damage. Total amount payable £19570 Less sum paid or in arrears by the date of repudiation £12064 97 Balance £7505 (to include charges.) ( The claimant will give credit if necessary for the value of the vehicle if recovered.)  The claimant therefore claims 1.    An order for delivery up of the vehicle 2.    The MoneyClaim to be adjourned generally with liberty to restore,  Upon restoration of the MoneyClaim following return or loss of the vehicle. the Claimant will ensure the pre action protocol for debt claims is followed. 3.    Pursuant to s 90 (1)  of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. An order that the Claimant and/or its agents may enter any premises in which the vehicle is situated in order to recover the vehicle should it not be returned by the Defendant 4.    further or alternatively damages 5.    costs Statement of truth The Claimant believes that the facts stated in these Particulars of Claim are true. The Claimant understands that the proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes or causes to be made a false statement in the document for verified by statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. I am duly Authorised by the Claimant to sign these Particulars of Claim signed Dated 17th of April 2024  What is the total value of the claim? 7502   Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? No   Never heard of this   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? n/a Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? No   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? After  Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? In a garage  Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes  Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Original Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? n/a   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? They said sent but nor received   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? None seen   Why did you cease payments? Still Paying,   What was the date of your last payment? Yesterday  31st May 2024   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? Yes on 12 Feb 2024   What you need to do now.   Can't scan, will do via another means as you cant have jpg  
    • Now that is an interesting article which adds afew perspective that I hadn't thought significant - but on reflection of the perspectives offered ... Now Starmer is no Blair, however 'blairite he may be perceived, but the Tories aren't tories and aren't even remotely liberal   The fast 'unannounced and unexpected election call from sunack may well be explained by the opinion linked that he hoped reform would be unprepared and effectively call a chunk of Farages largely empty bluster - making him look even more of a prat, leave scope for attacks on shabby reform candidates and mimimise core vote losses to reform - while throwing the 'middle ground' (relative) tories TO THE DOGS - and with the added bonus of likely pacifying his missu' desire to jogg off to sunny cal tout suite somewhat   thumb in the air - I expect about 140ish tory seats, but can hope for under a hundred Reform - got to admit the outside possibility of 1, maybe 2 seats with about 8% of the vote - but unlikely. I think projections of over 10% of the vote for reform is nudged and paid for speculation - but possible with the expected massive drives from Russian, Chinese and far right social media bot and troll prods targeting the gullible.
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

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Advent Computer Training (Barclays Partner Finance)


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Thanks to everyone for your compliments and I'm sorry we haven't had something more solid and immediate. :sad:

 

Personally, I don't know an awful lot to be honest about small claims (or county court if the amount is over £5,000) or what happens if you lose a case, but I'm not throwing in the towel yet and intend to look into it. I just got a copy of the book CAG recommends 'Small Claims Procedure; A Practical Guide' by Patricia Pearl (2nd hand on Amazon) so will keep posting if I come up with anything useful.

 

Reading the open letter again I think we all still have a good argument with mis-selling and the fact Barclays and Computeach were so pathetic and took 7 months to finalise and agree the 'bespoke courses' that they forced many people out of a chance of a qualification due to their Advent agreements running out (by the time I'd heard about it my end date was only a few weeks away to complete 3 exams). The FAQ on CT website only went up on 7th Oct, confirming they would honour agreements and allow free re-sits/vouchers to take exams locally. I intend using that as my main argument, that I'd had no chance to finish the course even if I'd wanted to as my agreement ended Dec 2010.

 

I won't write this off just yet but it's understandable if people want o throw in the towel now. Remember some people have won via FOS and apparently the Access and PPI students in the same boat have had more luck with FOS as their courses were nowhere near like for like. Due to CT being co-erced by Barclays to match the Advent conditions that's unfortunately taken the wind out of our sails on that one, but I think we still have some running in the mis-selling.

 

To add...

http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/infoabout/claims/index.htm

Edited by Fuzzbutt
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If BPS's legal team are lying over that - they could be lying about other such things.

The question is....would they be prepared to lie in court?

 

They would certainly have to provide the evidence in a court, I understand, if challenged. To counter loads of individual claims in court will cost them lots of money and a solicitor each time anyhow and a judge would certainly not just accept their word as FOS has.

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I'm a bit disappointed that Haus's didn't feel that there was a case to mount. I suspect that this means that they actually agree with FOS and Barclays and aren't willing to risk their own cash on a challenge. Personally, I think that alot of people do have a claim, and that these claims are almost identical, but that the remedy won't be a full refund, it will be to be put back in the situation they should have been in had the breach of contract not happened. This might be a replacement course, the cost of a replacement course with an identical supplier, and or some compensation on top.

 

As for the small claims stuff, some claims might fall into the small claims track limits, I suspect many won't. The importance of this is that if the claim is fast track then the loser risks having costs awarded against them.

 

What was the OFT's view? I've seen the extract posted above, but what else did they say? Or did they say nothing else? Did they comment at all on the merits of the case? The extract gives me the impression that they seemed positive?

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Hi guys its bad news as to what has happened, however as Fuzzbutt has said if we all individually write to various newspapers, OFT and possibly even arrange demonstrations outside main Barclays bank branches I believe it will force their hands either way .i.e they either take us all to court or agree to a settlement. I personnally favour the second option as bad publicity is what these banks try to avoid.

 

Thnaks again Fuzzbutt for all your work.

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You're welcome everyone - just sorry we didn't get a result via this route.

 

On a positive note, Hitachi has refunded part/most of loans it gave for Advent courses apparently - customers have put good arguments forward and convinced them. Why can't Barclays do the same?

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Indeed, that fact still has me stumped. How can one finance company agree that section 75 can be upheld yet one completley ignores the fact it exists at all.

 

Maybe it is worth digging around the hitachi threads for titbits of information to go back to Barclays with.

 

Just read through the Hausfeld letter, interesting to see what the Advent directors are upto, especially since the law firm they have is my previous employer!!!

Edited by Savarok
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Its a difficult one. I feel so cheated by not only barclays themselves but the salesmen who initially sold me the course, but what can we realistically look to do now? No Hausfield, FOS seem no good either. Its a shame that barclays seem as though they'l get away with it despite it being clear they have one thing on their mind, getting their money regardless of our situations

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Fuzzbutt,

Thanks again for all your hard work and time you've put into this.

I really thought hausfield would take this all the way but i guess there is too much risk for them. Back to square one then.

Watched Fight club the other day, can anyone remember what they did at the end? Its an option : )

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I called Barclays parntner finance other day to see how much it was i owed now. They said that it was****** and i need to call apex to pay it back now? I thought they needed a Deed of assignement or something along thoese lines to demand this money? I could see myself paying apex this money then barclays partner finance denying knowledge of this and wanting more money.

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I called Barclays parntner finance other day to see how much it was i owed now. They said that it was****** and i need to call apex to pay it back now? I thought they needed a Deed of assignement or something along thoese lines to demand this money? I could see myself paying apex this money then barclays partner finance denying knowledge of this and wanting more money.

 

Yes I agree with you.. it reminds me of what happened to some people when we had last recession in early 90's.

 

many people had rushed out and brought houses in the previous year or so.. and then when the interest rates shot up found they could no longer afford to pay.. so some thought ok lets give the keys to the loan company and we can call it quits.

 

The loan company did indeed accept their keys and houses and sold them on for what ever money they could get usually at below market value, and the original borrowers thought that would be the end of of it..

 

but some years later the loan companies came back to them and said you still owe us money.. your debt is not wiped off.

The loan companies encouraged these same people who had not been able to pay their original loans (but had managed to get back on their feet years later) to borrow money from wherever to pay as much of their loans back even if it was not 100% of what was owed.

 

So I am assuming that debt collectors had been used in those days just as they have been with us.. and I would not be surprised if the borowers had done deals with the debt collectors.. and then years later the loan companies came to take money off them also.. learn from history even when it seems like it cant happen

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I'm taking forward a demand for refund via the Small Claims court now (just sending my notice before action letter to BPF as required in case they decide to make me an offer before it takes affect).

Just to remind folk here, even if it's a larger amount you're claiming back (over £5,000 it goes to a County Court) it's worth asking your local CAB if you qualify for legal aid or help with costs/free legal representation by a court appointed solicitor.

Small claims has a 'no costs' rule which ensures, even if you lose, you are not liable to pay the other sides legal costs. County Court slightly different but CAB can advise individual cases.

Don't forget to pull out all the legal points and arguments from Hausfeld's letters to base your case on, plus the fact that BPF have been forced to refund min 60% of the loan to 'no end date' people, Hitachi have already made settlements with their customers, and the directors of Advent are also suing BPF for breach of contract.

I'm confident I'll win my case but obviously (quite understandably!) some people may feel daunted in taking it further (due to fear of being slapped with costs) at County level.

Don't forget too the lack of timely information on the arrangement of the ‘bespoke courses’ from BPF and CT combined to ensure many of us would be unable to complete the course before our agreement ran out. Worth raising.

 

I don't intend giving up without a last shot!!:-x

Have contacted Daily Mirror again (Penman and Sommerlad investigates) who have supported our case in the past. Please everyone try and give them your story (see Mirror's website for contact).

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Good luck Fuzzbutt.

It seems the legal reply from BPF to Ingrid is very useful to the students......

 

 

 

 

 

 

In more ways than they realize....:wink:

Edited by lowdown
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Good luck Fuzzbutt.

It seems the legal reply from BPF to Ingrid is very useful to the students......

 

In more ways than they realize....:wink:

 

Certainly! I've been going through it with a toothpick and found a couple of contradictions.

Another point we can use is we were not ALLOWED to see any details of the courses unless we 'verified' our details on the CT website, so that was unfair under the Contracts Act. The 'bespoke' offer was not made public on CT website until 7 Oct 2010, 10 months after Advent's collapse!

 

BPF really are full of bullsh** and are desperately trying to claw their way out of this now.

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Best of luck Fuzzbutt, and thanks for yer grit and hard work.

 

I've just sent a brief overview of the Access/Advent/BPF situation to WHICH? magazine, seeing as they've had success with the mis-selling of PPI for loans by the major banks, and the banks felt the sting. I've flagged it as a 2 pronged complaint, one is obviously the behaviour of BPF, the other is the regulation of the private training firms.

 

Can I encourage more to do the same as they might see by numbers that there is a campaign to get behind.

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