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    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
    • Thanks for all the suggestions so far I will amend original WS and send again for review.  While looking at my post at very beginning when I submitted photos of signs around the car park I noticed that it says 5 hours maximum stay while the signage sent by solicitor shows 4 hours maximum stay but mine is related to electric bay abuse not sure if this can be of any use in WS.
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Advent Computer Training (Barclays Partner Finance)


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Yes they can offer a replacement course, and indeed have.

The problem is that it was not really offered on a 'Like for Like' basis, although BPF have tried to amend this.

But it seems that Computeach [new provider] are or have been finding it hard to keep their end of the deal without trying to add on extra rather expensive course extension costs.

IE - take the computeach course and sign into the extra cost. The course with Advent was supplied as open ended [ or thats what the sales reps indicated]

And in some cases no start and end dates or signatures provided on the enrolment forms/agreements. This is what the fos are looking into with some of the students.

 

It also seems [reading through posts] that DCA's [and sometimes two at a time] have been contacting students seeking to reclaim the loans on behalf of BPF, but BPF have not written to the students and informed them that the debt had been passed over for collection.

Hence other governing bodies other than the fos being contacted.

 

 

But i am sure you are aware of all this, and thanks for your input.

 

Thats correct barclays made no effort to find like for like.

barclays think replacement training companies are easy to find.. just look in yellow pages and find the first company that trains in IT.. simples!!

so why are there so many different bank accounts being offered from the same bank (barclays) if any training provider will do.. why not the first bank account you find?? maybe its not the bank account people dont want.. maybe people do not want to be barclays customers.. what can barclays say about that??

 

Barclays made no effort with computeach.. I would bet good money that it was computeach that aproached barclays and not the other way around.. the way the whole company "computeach" works and trains is not like for like!!

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Can I ask why would any of us need to apply for a DOA?

 

my earlier post was about a Debt Collecting Agency needing a DOA to have the orignal debt assigned to them without it they are just vultures hoping for easy prey.

 

Sorry, I misunderstood, above someone said that "I sent them the challange letter from student site asking for DOA..."

 

DCAs don't need to have a debt legally assigned to them to collect, so they don't need a DOA.

 

I'll look into the 'like for like thing' as everything seems dead at the moment. the 'no end date' thing seems to be worth some further investigation. I'll continue to look in on the threat in the hope that the legal action actually starts soon. If you can win on the not like for like thing it might give some hope.

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I had an interesting letter from moorcroft recently, with it ending "I believe therefore that the most sensible course of action would be for the company to return the account to our client and to cease any further activity with regard to it"

 

So im assuming moorcroft have returned the debt to barclays partner finance, because i recieved a arrears notice the other day from BPF! Confused!!:|

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I had an interesting letter from moorcroft recently, with it ending "I believe therefore that the most sensible course of action would be for the company to return the account to our client and to cease any further activity with regard to it"

 

So im assuming moorcroft have returned the debt to barclays partner finance, because i recieved a arrears notice the other day from BPF! Confused!!:|

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It's all been going on a while – when is the law firm going to issue? The longer it takes the worse it will be, surely? What is the delay? Why not just test it all in court? The situation can't be any worse surely? Unless they pull out I suppose.

 

The reason it won't be 'tested in court' yet (for your information and anyone else wondering why no case date has been set yet) is to jump the gun would be foolhardy on Hausfeld's part. If they did not have a cast-iron case they risk losing and then would be liable for all costs, which will be massive. They are collecting up evidence by paperwork, such as FOS decision letters from the signed up group, in order to build a case.

 

THAT is the reason this has not yet gone to court! If you make the effort to read the law firm's letters on my student website (I'm the organiser) you will perhaps grasp why this is such a long process as the case is not black and white, and has so many variables/issues that need to be addressed point by point.

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The reason it won't be 'tested in court' yet (for your information and anyone else wondering why no case date has been set yet) is to jump the gun would be foolhardy on Hausfeld's part. If they did not have a cast-iron case they risk losing and then would be liable for all costs, which will be massive. They are collecting up evidence by paperwork, such as FOS decision letters from the signed up group, in order to build a case.

 

THAT is the reason this has not yet gone to court! If you make the effort to read the law firm's letters on my student website (I'm the organiser) you will perhaps grasp why this is such a long process as the case is not black and white, and has so many variables/issues that need to be addressed point by point.

 

 

Spot on Fuzzbutt - You don't go to court to test things, thats legal Suicide.Time is not an issue, its an advantage, you should use the time to do your homework and groundwork.

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Spot on Fuzzbutt - You don't go to court to test things, thats legal Suicide.Time is not an issue, its an advantage, you should use the time to do your homework and groundwork.

 

Exactly Lowdown - this is a complex case, I understand from Ingrid, which need to have specific points argued out and will need to stand up against BPF's no doubt highly paid law team who will use every trick to dodge around arguments.

We have good grounds on some issues but others could be legally argued. Work is going on behind the scenes, and I had a message from Ingrid yesterday, to reassure everyone.

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Exactly Lowdown - this is a complex case, I understand from Ingrid, which need to have specific points argued out and will need to stand up against BPF's no doubt highly paid law team who will use every trick to dodge around arguments.

We have good grounds on some issues but others could be legally argued. Work is going on behind the scenes, and I had a message from Ingrid yesterday, to reassure everyone.

 

I agree that we need to have much info to counter BPF , one thing I thought of sometime back is that with all the letters BPF have sent to each of us they are doing the same.. collecting information.. checking out our arguments, so they will have answers for when it all does go to court.

This is the reason why BPF have not taken any of us to court yet, at the moment all they have done is hit us with a stick and set their dogs on us to try to scare us into paying up.. yes payup! because BPF do not want to do the honourable thing and ask their own customers what would we want? .. and how can they help their customers?.

(Moorcroft even asked me in a letter what actions I intended to take against their clients BPF.. as if I was going to tell them anything).

 

If I had been offered a choice of training providers, I for one would have concidered that reasonable, and I would have looked and hopefully been able to choose a company I thought would be suited to my needs and would have carried on paying for my training.

But now over a year later and after have had no training at all, I am also still out of work (and out of pocket by over £800) and having lost the chance to have work.. Advent had on site job section ... (not someone who shows you how to fill in a CV like Computeach have) Advent had a job placement(agency) section.

 

And we lost all this because of BPF business decisions that did not take into account their customers needs.. which includes "The Advent computer training company"... we all got screwed!!.

 

I do not want BPF to help me now, I want them to write off my loan and repair the damage they have done to my credit rating (something they was doing even while they was looking into my complaints).

But most of all I want compensation (including a refund of my payments and deposit) for all the trouble they have caused us with their greedy business decisions.

 

And dont talk to me about their shareholders.. I have barclays shares, I got paid princely sum of £1.10 on my shares in total.. balance that up to the £62m bonus the boss of BPF got on top of his wage last year.. where does all that money go??

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Ive also had an arrears letter from barclays this morning. I rung them up to ask who was actually dealing with all this to which the customer service assistant replied its all being dealt with by apex. in regards to the arrears letter they are sent out every 6 month apparently by a computer. I ended the phone call at that

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hi wicko here not been on for awhile been waiting for final decision from FOS. surprise surprise they have come down on BPF side. i am a guarantor for my son as i thought until we moved and i found his advent enrolment forms in a box after we unpacked. i looked thru it and found to my surprise he had not sent it off and there was three papers, blue copy- student, white copy- office, and pink copy- adviser.not a signature in sight from advent no start date no end date never got to advent. i photo copied them and sent it off to the FOS with all the other data i had but they said this does not proof your son was not enrolled in the course, i am at a lost to understand how they come to this conclusion. they also say that under the credit act they can not find a debtor- creditor- supplier relationship.so there is not a valid claim against barclays for a breach of contract or misrepresentation in this case. where is the money i signed for,i did not get it so who got it? you fight and fight but its like hitting your head against a brick wall. what the hell do i do how. wait for barclays to take me to court and hope the judge sees it how i see it. any ideas. losing my mind.

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Hi all. On the adventstudents website I read: "(...) if you were a former student who paid in full just before the collapse of Advent and had no course end date on your Advent enrolment form (the one you signed with the rep - green/blue copy for most people) you may well, based upon recent experience, get at least a 60% refund from the FOS".

Well, I haven't paid the loan back in full before Advent's collapse, but there's also no end date on my enrolment form, nor on any other paper work I've been receiving from either Advent, Claysdale or Barclays. Is anyone in a similar situation?

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I want them to write off my loan and repair the damage they have done to my credit rating (something they was doing even while they was looking into my complaints).

But most of all I want compensation (including a refund of my payments and deposit) for all the trouble they have caused us with their greedy business decisions.

 

This is exactly what I'm hoping for. Poor credit rating will destroy us all, disable us from geting a stupid loan, a car on finance and a mortgage, so we and our families could live our lives normally!

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Had a response from the FOS, basically not willing to review the final decision on my complaint due to mis-selling (I have no start/end dates or specified timeframe) because section 75 does not apply (I'm the debtor, but not the student), even though I was told by the Advent rep that I would be covered by section 75 and therefore signed the agreement under false pretenses.

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Had a response from the FOS, basically not willing to review the final decision on my complaint due to mis-selling (I have no start/end dates or specified timeframe) because section 75 does not apply (I'm the debtor, but not the student), even though I was told by the Advent rep that I would be covered by section 75 and therefore signed the agreement under false pretenses.

 

That's appalling, Juicy! FOS didn't even take account of mis-selling, despite the rep having given you wrong advice! I think these FOS adjudicators need to take some basic exams in common sense and fair play. They certainly aren't dishing it out to many Advent students! :sad:

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Got a letter from Midas Legal Services, apparently the *ahem* legal arm of Moorcroft, threatening legal action. I am tired of this crap.

 

If a solicitor signs a letter - it would be followed by his/her Qualifications and legal standing.

IE....

A.N. Other

Diploma in B.U.L.L.sh*te

 

Its the same people/same address.

 

Midas Legal Services Ltd.: Moorcroft Group

Financial Services. Business services

City: Stockport

Address: Moorcroft House , 2 Spring Gardens , Stockport , Cheshire, SK1 4AN

Phone:0161-480-4966

Fax:0161-477-3864

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If a solicitor signs a letter - it would be followed by his/her Qualifications and legal standing.

IE....

A.N. Other

Diploma in B.U.L.L.sh*te

 

Its the same people/same address.

 

Midas Legal Services Ltd.: Moorcroft Group

Financial Services. Business services

City: Stockport

Address: Moorcroft House , 2 Spring Gardens , Stockport , Cheshire, SK1 4AN

Phone:0161-480-4966

Fax:0161-477-3864

 

From the Office of Fair Trading guidelines on unfair debt collection practices - examples of unfair practice which Trading Standards can prosecute if complaints are raised with a local TO office...

 

False representation of authority and/or legal position

2.3 Those contacting debtors must not be deceitful by misrepresenting their authority

and/or the correct legal position.

2.4 Examples of unfair practices are as follows:

a. falsely implying or claiming authority, for example, claiming to work on

instructions from the courts, claiming to be bailiffs or, in Scotland,

sheriff officers or messenger-at-arms

b. falsely implying or stating that action can or will be taken when it legally

cannot, for example, referring to bankruptcy or sequestration proceedings

when the balance is too low to qualify for such proceedings or claiming a

right of entry when no court order to this effect has been granted

falsely implying or stating that action has been taken when it has not, for

example, that civil action has been taken or that a court judgment has

already been obtained

e. falsely implying or stating that failure to pay a debt is a criminal

offence or that criminal proceedings will be brought

f. pursuing third parties for payment when they are not liable

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No they can't.

 

 

Er, yes they can I believe! At least the OFT can if a complaint to Trading Standards offices is passed to them and they receive enough complaints against a company they decide to look into it (I should clarify that in case it was misunderstood). Of course if I'm wrong I'll happily hold my hands up! From OFT's website.......

 

http://www.oft.gov.uk/news-and-updates/press/2011/32-11

Quote -

"The Consumer Credit Act 1974 (the Act) places a duty on the OFT to ensure that licences are only given to and retained by those who are fit to hold them."

http://www.oft.gov.uk/OFTwork/credit-licensing/

Quote "Under the Consumer Credit Act, businesses that offer goods or services on credit or lend money or are involved in activities relating to credit or hire must be licensed by the OFT. The OFT has a duty to protect the interests of consumers by monitoring the fitness of those holding or applying for licences."

 

The DirectGov website advises on harassment by debt collectors...(quote)

" Debt collectors aren't court officials and don't have the same powers as bailiffs. They can't enter your home or seize your possessions. They can only write, phone, or visit your home to talk to you about the debt and how to pay it back.

Creditors and debt collectors must follow OFT (Office of Fair Trading) debt collection guidance. New consumer protection rules came into effect in May 2008. They are designed to stop traders acting unfairly, including the use of what the rules call ‘aggressive commercial practices’.

These rules may help you tackle harassment by your creditors, because the OFT and trading standards now have the power to take enforcement action against creditors. This can lead to fines or even imprisonment if the creditor is found guilty of an offence.

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that's not what was said though, was it? It was said that trading standards can prosecute. they can't. Nor can the OFT prosecute for a breach of its guidance. Rather than complaining to trading standards and hope that they pass on to the OFT, why not just complain to the OFT? And as noted, the OFT won't prosecute, they can only consider the conduct of the company when deciding whether to give it a consumer credit licence.

 

The prosecution stuff you have quoted above refers to the consumer protection from unfair trading regulations, not the OFT guidance referred to a few posts past. Different rules, different sanctions. It is worth getting it right and being sure why you are complaining and making sure you are complaining to the right people.

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Creditors and debt collectors must follow OFT (Office of Fair Trading) debt collection guidance. New consumer protection rules came into effect in May 2008. They are designed to stop traders acting unfairly, including the use of what the rules call ‘aggressive commercial practices’.

Does this include the reducing of a debtors credit score during the period of dispute that not only effects the ability to obtain credit but also secure employment. Yes lots of recruitment agencies refer to credit records for applicants. So we're kinder screwed don't go with Computeach their stop you getting a job until you start paying for BPF's crap. Time for a judical review on how this is being handled people are having their lives ruined while the FOS and the lawyers pontificate of course their lives aren't ruined. :?:Lawyers :-DCustomers:-(FOS:scared:

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