Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • He was one of four former top executives from Sam Bankman-Fried's firms to plead guilty to charges.View the full article
    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

Yes Sofa (ELS?)


jennyt
style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 4524 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

good for you renton, i would contact your credit card as the sofa now belongs to them so if yes sofa wants it back its too late. The credit card company usually asks you to despose of it as you wish!!!

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Replies 56
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Hi All

 

have stumbled across this and a little worried now.

I recently (5 weeks ago) put a deposit of 500 down on a sofa and chair from the birmingham shop. Chair looked well built but now im worried it wont be when i receive mine. i paid by creditcard and was advised that when i come to pay off the balance i should use debit or incur charge.

At the bottom of my receipt it says "This receipt forms a legal contract. Cancellations cannot be accepted and deposits cannot be refunded"

 

Where do i stand. is it best to wait for the full 6-8week delivery time and hope for the best. I will def pay the remainder on cc now just for that extra level of protection but can i pull out now?

Has anyone got any good sofas from this place?? mind you if you have you wouldnt be here!

 

Chris:lol:

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

 

I too, am a little bit worried now. I ordered a sofa today from Yes Sofa Specialists in Birmingham and was told it would be 14 - 16 weeks for delivery and that it was made in Italy. I paid a 30% deposit on my credit card and was told the remainder would have to be paid before delivery either by credit card which would incur a 4% charge or debit card which they recommended. At this point i thought everything was ok, until tonight when i decided to search the company on the internet (should have done that before!) and found several forums discussing the bad reputation of this company. I gather this is definitely the same company as all of the other names mentioned on this thread. I have also noticed the invoice states 'THIS RECEIPT FORMS A LEGAL CONTRACT, CANCELLATIONS CANNOT BE ACCEPTED AND DEPOSITS CANNOT BE REFUNDED'. However, the credit card slip has the name LEATHER WORLD on it. I take it this is yet another alias of theirs. I am going to try and cancel tomorrow, but i doubt i won't have much look with a refund. I was wondering though, that because the contract is with Yes Sofa Specialists and the payment was made to LEATHER WORLD would it be possible to claim back via my Credit Card company. I will give it a go, if the first option fails. I fully sympathise will all you other posters that have been conned out of there hard earned money. People like this, should never be able to go back into business EVER!

Link to post
Share on other sites

You should be ok some of these people successfully got credit card refunds and those that purchased from the droitwich branch had 'els' on their credit receipts (another alias which went into administration last year) . Unfortuntly I paid by debit card so as u have probably read our house insurers are taking them to court for our refund. I hope u don't have the same bother as the rest of us !

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi all, dont panic you have done the best thing by payind the deposit on your credit card, this means that even if you pay the balance off using cash or debit card you will be covered for the whole amount under section 75. i think by cancelling your order now you may not get your deposit back but look on the consumer dircet web site as that tells you all the steps you need to know, ( i phoned them to see what options i had as my sofa had been delivered) also read up on section 75 so you know your rights before your sofa comes. Be ready for a fight with this company as you can see on here many people are not happy with their service. Record all contact with this company from days times of phone calls, and take names of staff you are dealing with (i found that the same person rang me but gave 3 different names!!) and send all letters recorded deliver. Let your credit card company know as soon as poss and they will also inform you what letter to send. i am just gobbed smaked that this company is still trading like this and i can not understand why the banks have not taking the card machine off them. best of luck and there is hope at the end of the tunnel, i am a lucky one who paid there deposit on a credit card and got it all back.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Contacted the store today and they said i could cancel but they would only give me a credit note and not a refund. So i then spoke to my credit card company and explained about my order and there past history etc. They said they can't do anything at the moment unless they fail to deliver the sofa. They advised me at this moment to carry on with the purchase and pay the balance on the credit card. If they fail to deliver within the specified time period or there is a problem with the sofa, then i am to raise a dispute over the the deposit and final payment with my credit card company. Firstly though, i must try and resolve any issues should there be any with the company itself keeping records of conversations, emails. letters etc.

Link to post
Share on other sites

You can write to Linda McCoy Fair Trading Officer at Worcestershire. Her Phone Number is 01905765371 .She is awaiting 3-4 more complaints before she can take strict action against them. Hope this is helpful.

vijay

 

 

Hi

I have had problems with the same sofa company, when i asked Jerome where is my sofa he started to raised his voice and was very abusive towards me. I am going to complain to trading standards as the sofa delivered is not the one we ordered. I live in Birmingham can i contact the same lady from the Fair Trading office.

 

Thanks

Anyone one thinking of buying from them, DO NOT.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

ive known this firm for over 20yrs ! many ppl are more than happy with there products and ive seen how ppl react if nothings going ther way ! these ppl are salesmen not wizards and sometimes things do go wrong ? keep the faith and dont lose hope and defo dont go screaming at them

Link to post
Share on other sites

ive known this firm for over 20yrs ! many ppl are more than happy with there products and ive seen how ppl react if nothings going ther way ! these ppl are salesmen not wizards and sometimes things do go wrong ? keep the faith and dont lose hope and defo dont go screaming at them

 

It is amazing how there isn't an opposite for Slander. Like when someone makes some stuff up to promote something and you get to sue them for making completely false statements about a person or company.

 

To call these people salespeople is disingenuous at best. Sales People have customers who receive the goods that they ordered, more often than not shortly after ordering them.

 

These people have victims who hand over cash and if they are lucky enough to receive goods get faulty or very poor imitation goods.

 

To correct you, you cannot have done business with this firm for over 20 years, it was only incorporated recently or are you referring to the many other firms that these people have setup and closed down under the guise of going bankrupt? The earliest example I can find is for Lords Department Store company number 02039026 that was dissolved in 1994, but there have been dozens of ELS, Leather Lords, and many many others since then.

 

I think the technical term for it is Phoenix fraud.

Link to post
Share on other sites

To correct you, you cannot have done business with this firm for over 20 years, it was only incorporated recently.....

 

Which business are you referring to here, have you got a company number?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just thought i'd let you all know that my chair did arrive last week, it only took 9 months and a lot of hard work. Glad we got a result in the end but I will NEVER use this company ever again. Best of luck to all you other people having problems

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Johno,

 

I have done some checking and looking, all the information is available from Companies house for free so there should be no harm in posting this information.

 

Below are a sample of some of the companies I have found via companies house and Equifax. The oldest is Lords Departmental Stores LTD that was dissolved in 1994. It can be really confusing trying to trace histories, for these companies as they switch names and directors very often. They even overlap names so if you are trying to trace a company be sure to use the Company number as the referral point. Otherwise you might find that you have switched and are following a completely separate legal entity albeit with the same name and probably same director and same address.

 

It's fun, I have given up now, these people will probably go on for as long as they want to, they seem to have a perfect business plan for what they do.

 

Company name: ELS (HULL) LIMITED

Company Number: 07315607

 

Company name: ELS (LUTON) LIMITED

Company Number: 07286409

 

Company name: INSPIRATIONS QUALITY FURNISHERS LIMITED

Company Number: 02672296

 

Company name: LORDS DEPARTMENTAL STORES LTD

Company Number: 02039026

Link to post
Share on other sites

Link sent via PM

 

If you follow the link above you see an active complaint from the current store.

 

THere is a scan of an order form and PDQ counterfoil. The company on the PDQ counterfoil is ELS.

 

They are also opening up at the same locations that ELS used to operate out of and Leather Lords before that.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Link sent via PM

 

If you follow the link above you see an active complaint from the current store.

 

THere is a scan of an order form and PDQ counterfoil. The company on the PDQ counterfoil is ELS.

 

They are also opening up at the same locations that ELS used to operate out of and Leather Lords before that.

 

From the Exclusive Leather Sofa's thread:-

 

My understanding is that the business in Droitwich to which you are referring, now called 'Yes the Sofa Specialists' previously traded as 'Exclusive Lounge Sofas' hence ELS. A quick check using your preferred search engine will confirm this. No doubt the name was changed because of the very poor reputation of Exclusive Leather Sofas Ltd (ELS) and confusion between the businesses.

 

It does however raise the question why the proprietor of 'Yes the Sofa Specialists' thought it was a good idea to open a new shop in Birmingham at premises previously occupied by ELS Ltd?

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

I purchased a suit in february cost 2k paid £700 deposit with an approx delivery of 12 weeks

20 weeks later i am still waiting

 

i have had no confimation of delivery date yet from them

 

i have telephone calls weekley the excuses range from

 

1)problems with the leather

 

2)not enough furniture to put in container ( why container supposed to be british)

 

3)because of all the bank holidays we had in april (if its made anywhere other than uk then the only bank holiday would have been easter)

 

how many more excuses before i get my suit (if it ever comes)

 

like other people on here when you telephone you get abusive sales people answering

 

 

i tried to cancel but the said i would loose my deposit

 

 

please be aware of small print about ,

 

1)cancellations

 

2)delivery times

 

3)deposits

 

4)compensation

 

or better still dont buy

 

:mad2:

Link to post
Share on other sites

as you will see on other treads you are not the only one having trouble, best advice i can give you is if you have not paid the deposit on your credit card pay off the remaining balance on it, this seems the only way you will get your money back, this company will charge you a bit extra for using your credit card but it is well worth it. read up on section 75 and contact consumer direct who will tell you all the steps you need to take.

best of luck

Link to post
Share on other sites

If u paid by debit card like I did you will find it hard to get your money back, it is worth checking your house insurance documents to see if u have legal assistance. Without direct line I prob wouldn't have seen my chair so I would def recommend checking. It still wasn't easy and took months to sort out but I got there in the end, good luck!

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

we ordered our sofa in march 10/12 weeks delivery ended up 16/17 lots of phone calls everytime theres an excuse bank holidays blah blah blah we have currently been wating nearly 4 weeks for an engineer to fix the sofa as the recliners dont work properly on closer inspection some of the mechcanism is bent from transit but i think we are lucky by the sound of things we got our sofa my advice give these clowns a miss pay the extra and go to scs or dfs wish i had done more research

Link to post
Share on other sites

style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 4524 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...