HSBC- Newmans/Arrow Global

[payback68]

Hello all long time no speak! been a terrible year as we have lost four family members including a father and sister:(.

 

Anyway getting to the point, i have an account with HSBC going back to the early 1990's which was passed to Newman & Co (they neglected to send me a NOA back then).I had been making payments to Newmans each and every month, however, they asked for a payment review back in April this year, so i sent them a letter asking to see the Agreement, to which i received no reply (letter wasn't sent recorded but i have proof of postage).

 

Today i received a NOA from Arrow Global saying obviously that they own the debt and all future payments should be sent to them! and apparently they have been receiving payments on the account since 30th June via Newmans.

I have done some research about this company of idiots and my question is, should i just send them a copy of the letter i sent Newmans for the copy of the agreement?. i really think they have bought a lemon here and if so tough duggy for them.

 

Any comments welcomed.

 

Regards PB68.

[dx100uk]

cca them

 

dx

[spamheed]

This isn't uncommon, not at all right, but not uncommon.

 

When you said you "sent them a letter asking to see the Agreement" did you send a s78 CCA request and did you include the £1 fee?

[payback68]

This isn't uncommon, not at all right, but not uncommon.

 

When you said you "sent them a letter asking to see the Agreement" did you send a s78 CCA request and did you include the £1 fee?

 

Thanks guys for the replies.

Yes the proper CCA request was sent and the £1 fee included, they just ignored it basically as it wasn't sent recorded, however they never pursued the ammended payment plan and have obviously soon after sold the debt, which speak volumes to me.

 

Regards PB68

[spamheed]

send them the account in dispute letter, the original CCA request still hasn't been fulfilled, until it is, then you have no way of knowing whether the people writing to you have any right to be doing so

[payback68]

The most comical thing about this, is their letter is dated 5/11/2010 but i only received it today hmmmee are the postal service that bad?.

Also they have provided a "PO Box" return address which i would assume that i do not have to send recorded delivery or signed for?.

Think i may enjoy this battle

Regards PB68.

[42man]

It seems Newmans have passed on/sold the debt whilst in a clear dispute. Firstly report both of them to the Office Of Fair Trading, secondly send this letter to Arrow, this is just another demonstration of how poor communication is between these companies....although it would seem that Arrow probably only paid £5 to purchase your debt !! - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/content.php?426-A-letter-when-the-account-has-been-passed-to-another-debt-collection-agency

[payback68]

It seems Newmans have passed on/sold the debt whilst in a clear dispute. Firstly report both of them to the Office Of Fair Trading, secondly send this letter to Arrow, this is just another demonstration of how poor communication is between these companies....although it would seem that Arrow probably only paid £5 to purchase your debt !! - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/content.php?426-A-letter-when-the-account-has-been-passed-to-another-debt-collection-agency

 

Hi guys, that's a fantastic letter 42 man, thank you very much for providing it. I will send that off today!.

 

When i originally sent the CCA request off to Newman's ( which they ignored) i never followed up with the Account in Dispute letter and just continued paying them what they were getting each month, does this have any bearing on the situation?.

 

Best regards & many thanks,

 

PB68.

[dx100uk]

nope

only other than you might have been able to stop paying them

 

but you didn't know that then.

 

you do now!

 

dx

[42man]

You may be interested to read this and bear in mind that although this applies to Aktiv, every DCA should have a compliance officer that complies with exactly what is being said here - http://www.oft.gov.uk/news-and-updates/press/today?prid=755221

[payback68]

Hi guys, thanks for the info and apologies for not being online sooner!.

 

I have compiled a detailed email to send to the OFT regarding this scenario, with copies of all letters as attachments, however, i have been trying to locate their " Dca complaints email address". Are they still using this specific email address or is it just Enquiries?. I am of the opinion that if Arrow have now bought the debt and have been receiving payments for a few months without informing me, surely they should have sent the NOA as soon as they accepted payments from Newmans?.

 

Personally i think i have enough written proof here to kick up a stink, and being me and all the crap i have put up with from these DCA's it would be rude of me not to

 

Regards PB68.

[payback68]

Hi Folks, just a quick update here athough nothing of real importance, however, i thought i would update the thread!

 

Heard nothing off either of the two DCA's involved after sending the last letter (42 man), although i have had a reply off the OFT with their usual attached Word file for a formal complaint for me to sign and send off to them giving them my consent. The complaint which i have signed refers to Newmans, Arrow Global and NCO Europe!.

 

I am chomping at the bit here and to be honest fed up of waiting for the Postman to turn up as to see what their response is, however i will be sending a follow up letter soon and also informing them that as per my request last year i want the Agreement, bearing in mind "Signed" Agreement's are required prior to April 2007 to enforce an Agreement in a court of law!.

 

If there are any caggers who are following this thread or similar, with valid complaints against these DCA's in question, may i ask that YOU send in your complaints too as we will get nowhere if there isn't an abundance of people complaining, it's all about numbers and quantity of complaints.

 

Sticky here:- http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?195265-Complaining-to-the-OFT

 

OFT Complaints Email Address:- [email protected]

 

Will update the thread when i have more info.

 

Regards

PB68.

[42man]

Well done for reporting this...what is interesting is that they have asked you to print off and sign a formal complaint....as opposed to just thanking you and keeping it 'on file'...

[payback68]

Yes 42, i agree, i am waiting with baited breath for an announcement from the OFT as i subscribe to their emails, for similar sanctions being imposed on Newman's as i mentioned Aktiv in my original email to the OFT and my situation is similar!.

 

Anyway thought I would update the thread again, still heard nothing from either DCA, however it’s only what I’ve come to expect with this dispute and the severe lack of general education of these DCA’s.

 

Today I was all set to write another couple of letters to each DCA in question, but then I thought no, why I should I waste my ink and paper to be ignored again! So I phoned FOS and spent 20 minutes on the phone discussing the predicament I am in and furthermore being totally ignored by these two companies.

 

The bloke I spoke to was very informative as FOS normally are, asked me if I had their Consumer Credit License Numbers to which I replied “ Yes” thanks to the OFT.

Newman’s:- 324024

Arrow Global:- 578436

NCO Europe (which is apparently owned by Arrow) :-407530

 

Anyway during the discussion he asked what I wanted as a resolution regarding this dispute?. To which I replied “Firstly I want a letter off Newman’s in response to my legal request for a “True Signed copy” of the Agreement (which I have paid for) or if they don’t have one, a letter stating this!.” Also an explanation of why they have violated the Data Protection Act by sharing my information with a company who has NO legal right to have it, as Arrow has stated in no uncertain terms they WILL ruin my Credit File if I don’t pay them.”

 

Secondly,” I want a reply off Arrow Global stating what legal right they have to purchase a disputed debt and an explanation as to why they have been receiving payments from Newman’s since June 2010 but never sent a NOA until November 2010.”

FOS noted all this info and informed me that they will write to them within the next 3-5 working days and as they normally say, if I am not happy with the response I get, fill in the complaint form with copies of all letters received and sent including copies of Proof Of Postage as they have 8 weeks to give a valid and acceptable explanation.

 

To be honest I am loving this as I think I now have these two reprobate DCA’s by the short and curlies which they will know about soon enough and furthermore I haven’t involved Consumer Direct or TS yet, WHICH I WILL if need be!.

 

I will update the thread when I have more info.

 

Regards PB68.

 

PS Merry Xmas to one and all and a very prosperous new year to all fellow caggers

[payback68]

Hi Folks,

 

Atlast a response from Arrow, isn't it funny that they ignore what i send but adhere to the letter FOS sent them.

 

" Dear Mr xxxxxx

 

We thank you for your contact and note the content. We regret that you feel you have cause to complain.

 

We will confirm the result of our investigation, in writing, as soon as possible and in any event within 8 weeks.

 

This account is currently being operated on our behalf by Transcom Leeds. We will deal with this complaint only and all other enquiries should be directed to them.

 

We confirm that all collection activity will be suspended until we have issued our final response.

 

Sincerely

 

Limpet on society."

 

Personally i can't wait to see their final response! i am hoping it's something on the lines of " we have purchased a lemon"!.

 

Furthermore i think i will refuse whatever they say in their response and inform FOS that their reply is not satisfactory.

 

I have also had a discussion with the ICO and the fact that Newmans have shared my personal data with Arrow and have violated s10 of the data protection act, which they agreed with and have invited me to make a formal complaint via their complaints form on their website enclosing copies of all letters, however i have to send Arrow a notice informing them to cease processing my details first.

 

PB68

[payback68]

Hi Folks,

 

Been doing some research here into "Transcom" and what part they play in this dispute!

 

Apparently they have alot to do with Newman's and Arrow Global are one of their customers!.

 

So as far as i can assume HSBC sold the Debt To Newman's, i then requested a CCA off Newman's and now they have sold the debt to Arrow who are are a client Of Transcom which Newmans are involved with.Plus according to their paperwork the NOA states the debt was assigned by FV1, which i assume is internal garbage.

 

Looks like i am battling against 3 idiots here.

 

Any comments are welcomed guys.

 

Link to Transcom :- http://www.transcom.com/Country-Profiles/Transcom-in-the-UK/

 

Regards

 

PB68.

[dx100uk]

i do hope you have ofcourse stopped all payments?

 

what was the orignal debt type?

 

dx

[payback68]

Hi DX thanks for your reply!

 

Not 100% certain what the actual debt was as its so old and i have received no statements at all just periodic demands for payment, although it is either a CC or Bank Loan.

 

All payments were ceased upon receipt of the NOA from Arrow.

 

I think i may have to phone FOS on Monday and update them, also i may have a chat with Consumer Direct as this is a typical example of how stupid and pathetic these people are!. I will obviously have to keep my eye on my Credit File now i think as after so many years i have just managed to repair it and there is no way on this planet these idiots are going to ruin it again through illegal activity.

 

Regards

PB68.

[ScarletPimpernel]

Transcom is Arrow's agent and Newman is owned by Transcom and is the DCA 'front' for their UK operation.

 

Newman are well known here for their clumsy efforts in Amex cases. It is unusual to get any sort of sensible correspondence from them; they rely on templates.

[payback68]

Hi SP, i appreciate your input!

 

So it looks like i will have to inform FOS tomorrow that i need to update my complaint and involve Transcom also.

Think i will leave Consumer Direct for the moment as it could get even more confusing (if possible) if i involve them at this stage.

 

I have drafted a letter to send to Arrow which i will copy to Newmans with a covering letter. Would any of you guys be prepared to have a look through it just to ensure i have covered all the points necessary?. obviously i would send this via P.M.

 

Cheers

PB68.

[payback68]

Hi folks thought i would update the thread although nothing of importance has developed as yet, however, i have been looking into the so called company whom have assigned this debt to Arrow Global which is FV-1. They seem to be very elusive and the only viable comments i can find are going back to 2007 on CAG.The threads i have posted below are very conflicting opinions as you will see, however, as these " finger in the till" dca's are all trying to get their grubby mitts on my cash ( which is minimal) i would like any of your opinions as i want to sort this properly and have as much info when i reply to FOS as i feel i may be able to open a whole can of worms here!.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?75413-FV1-Inc-Debt-Collection-Who-are-they

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?68333

 

Regards

 

PB68.

[dx100uk]

so where are you on this

 

you stopped payments after finding out they were using you as a cash cow and.....

 

do you need to do anything?

 

dx

[payback68]

so where are you on this

 

you stopped payments after finding out they were using you as a cash cow and.....

 

do you need to do anything?

 

dx

 

Hi dx, well to be honest i am non the wiser although i have spoken to FOS about FV-1 and they had no info on their database regarding this company, so i phoned the OFT and alls they did was confirm they hold a CCL as thats all the info they had.

Newmans lead me to believe they owned the debt and offered me a reduced full & final on numerous ocassions, however it seems that FV-1 are possibly in cahoots with HSBC as they have assigned the debt to Arrow. The situation is a joke to say the least, 6 companies are now involved.

Anyway their 8 weeks is almost up, so i'll wait for their final responses and then take it from there. I'll keep the thread updated.

 

Regards

 

PB68.

[payback68]

Well guys, received Final Response today and it looks like i am up sh*t creek without the proverbial paddle, it's an overdraft going back to the 1990's which was defaulted in 2001!.

 

I have hunted out old First Direct bank statements as i assume this must be the account. Anyway looking at the statements on average they were charging me £70/month in fees. Can these be reclaimed to reduce the debt and if so how should i handle this?.

 

Below is a copy of their Final Response for you to have a look at.

 

Regards

 

PB68.

 

Arrow10001.pdf

Arrow20001.pdf

[payback68]

Hi all. it seems i was slightly overzealous with the above post as yesterday afternoon i went through a carrier bag full of letters and found various correspondence regarding this First Direct account including 2 default notices (s.87 (1) CCA1974) with identical dates but different amounts owing on a £3000 loan which is inclusive of £359 PPI! which were issued on12 Sept 2000.

 

It seems that i was correct as it baffled me somewhat as to how they are stating i racked up a £2100 overdraft. Given the evidence i have which also includes a statement from First Direct that my Bank Account was in credit, however the Loan Account had defaulted, it seems that they have merged the two together thus wacking the full amount owed onto an overdraft.

 

My question is, should i inform Arrow about this and give them a second chance to explain this situation, or should i just accept their final response and forward all copies of paperwork to FOS?.

 

I am sure that most of you will agree that their actions IMO are slightly below the belt by merging the loan into an overdraft and furthermore this also means that it's not under the legalities of CCA1974 so therefore i can't dispute it.

 

Any comments welcomed as always.

 

Regards

 

PB68.