Minicredit -advice please

[Readybrek]

I cannot remember what the interest was and their website says 250, I have copied some of the agreement for you too look at as the credit agreement does not actually say.

 

CREDIT AGREEMENT REGULATED BY THE CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974

This Agreement is made on the terms and conditions set out below

The Parties to this agreement are the Creditor:

MICROCREDIT LIMITED ('us'), of 30 Borough High Street, London SE1 1XU, or contact us at

http://www.minicredit.co.uk/contact.

and the Customer ('you') named below.

Full name:

 

KEY FINANCIAL INFORMATION

Credit Limit: £1500.00

Each time you borrow from us, you must make one repayment, which is to be made 1 to 42 days

after the day on which you receive the loan from us. The amount of your repayment depends upon

the amount you borrow from us.

If you make your required repayment, there will be no other repayments you will need to make. We

may vary the amount of your repayment and your repayment date, on written notice, to reflect any

extension of the due date for repayment.

*APR: 4144% pa

*APR is the total cost of the credit to you including all interest, fees and charges, expressed as an

annual percentage of the amount of credit granted.

OTHER FINANCIAL INFORMATION

Total Charge for Credit: The 'Total Charge' for Credit depends upon the amount you b

[renegadeimp]

Could you repost the full terms and conditions minus any personal info? I think the site admins would like to take a copy for reference.

[Readybrek]

Here goes this is the contract they sent to me by email and what appears on the account on their website. I have took my personal details out, I honestly think it is illegal but I am sure somebody will tell me. On the website it tells me I borrowed 250 but not a separate amount for the interest or an overall total.

 

CREDIT AGREEMENT REGULATED BY THE CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974

This Agreement is made on the terms and conditions set out below

The Parties to this agreement are the Creditor:

MICROCREDIT LIMITED ('us'), of 30 Borough High Street, London SE1 1XU, or contact us at

http://www.minicredit.co.uk/contact.

and the Customer ('you') named below.

Full name:

Address:

Email:

KEY FINANCIAL INFORMATION

Credit Limit: £1500.00

Each time you borrow from us, you must make one repayment, which is to be made 1 to 42 days

after the day on which you receive the loan from us. The amount of your repayment depends upon

the amount you borrow from us.

If you make your required repayment, there will be no other repayments you will need to make. We

may vary the amount of your repayment and your repayment date, on written notice, to reflect any

extension of the due date for repayment.

*APR: 4144% pa

*APR is the total cost of the credit to you including all interest, fees and charges, expressed as an

annual percentage of the amount of credit granted.

OTHER FINANCIAL INFORMATION

Total Charge for Credit: The 'Total Charge' for Credit depends upon the amount you borrow from us.

The following shows the total Charge for Credit you will pay for the different amounts that you can

borrow what depends of loan amounts:

1) Interest charges: 1% per day of loan amount.

2) Fast Advance Transmission Fee £19.50, repayable in advance (optional).

3) Loan request charge £1 if made by text message, online request is free.

4) Subsequent repeated online requests maybe chargeable if previous one declined.

Advance payments: £0.01 (being an initial

registration fee which is

payable once only)

The 'Total Charge' for the Credit shown above is the only charge and there are no other charges for

the Credit under this Agreement.

The 'Total Charge' for the Credit

is made up of the following parts: Interest charges 1% per day

depending on how much you

borrow; and

Loan request fee of £1.00

(payable each time you

borrow an amount from us

under this Agreement by text

message, first online request is free)

and

Fast Advance Transmission

Fee £19.50, repayable

in advance (optional).

Fast Advance Transmission fee is applicable to all loan applications if not notified in written form at

least three days before sending loan application. If your bank account you have provided does not

support faster payments scheme we may still charge £19.50 Fast Advance Transmission and

handling Fee £19.50.

Rate of interest on the Credit to be provided

under this Agreement: 365%

The rate of interest on the Credit to be provided under this Agreement is fixed.

Interest charges have been pre-computed at the commencement of this Agreement. Interest charges

are applied and calculated under this Agreement on the date which repayment falls due, being 1 to

42 days after the day on which you receive each amount borrowed under this Agreement.

KEY INFORMATION

If you break this Agreement, we will charge you if we unsuccessfully attempt to obtain repayment on

the due date for repayment. A fee of £25 will be charged on the day that your missed payment was

due. If we unsuccessfully attempt to obtain repayment on the due date, we will attempt to obtain

repayment a second time 2 days later, and if we unsuccessfully attempt to obtain repayment on this

second occasion we will charge you a further amount of £55. If we unsuccessfully attempt to obtain

repayment we may charge up to £5. If we unsuccessfully attempt to obtain repayment 30 (thirty) days

after the due date we may charge further £100 manual debt collection recovery fee.

Interest on any sum in arrears will be charged at the contractual rate, both before and after judgment,

until payment. Also, you must pay us all other reasonable costs and expenses we incur (including

any legal costs on a full indemnity basis) in tracing you, or enforcing, or attempting to enforce, our

rights under this Agreement.

MISSING PAYMENTS

Missing payments could have severe consequences and make obtaining credit more difficult.

IMPORTANT - YOU SHOULD READ THIS CAREFULLY ABOUT YOUR RIGHTS

The Consumer Credit Act 1974 lays down certain requirements for your protection which should have

been completed when the agreement was made. If they were not, we cannot enforce the agreement

without getting a court order.

The Act also gives you a number of rights. You can settle this Agreement at any time by giving notice

in writing and paying off the amount you owe under this Agreement.

If you would like to know more about your rights under the Act, contact either your local Trading

Standards Department or your nearest Citizens' Advice Bureau.

This is a Credit Agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974. Sign it only if you

want to be legally bound by its terms.

This Credit Agreement can only be signed by you electronically. Once you have done so, we

will send a pdf copy of the agreement to the e-mail address you have nominated and agreed

we can use to send documents to you under this Agreement.

IMPORTANT - USE OF YOUR INFORMATION

You have a right to know how we will use your personal information. It is important that you should

read clause 14 overleaf entitled 'Use of Your Information' before you sign.

We may send you information about products of ours and others which may be of interest to you. We

may pass your details to other selected businesses to send you information about their products. You

have a right at any time to stop us from contacting you or giving your details to others for these

purposes. You may write to us at 30 Borough High Street, London SE1 1XU, or contact us at

http://www.minicredit.co.uk/contact if you wish us to stop.

LOAN CONDITIONS

Application of these Loan Conditions

1. These Loan Conditions will apply to the Credit Agreement entered into by you and us ('the

Agreement').

Warranty

2. You warrant that you are at least 18 years old and that the information provided by you to us prior

to entering into this Agreement is correct and you authorise us to undertake such investigation or

enquiry about you that we may wish to make. Also you warrant that the bank account and the card

details you provided during the registration process are registered on your name and address.

Registration and PIN

3. When you register and apply with us ('Registration'), we will, at our discretion, provide you with a

unique Personal Identification Number ('PIN') which is personal to you and which will enable you to

make a request to us to borrow the sum from £30.00 to £1500.00 from us ('Request').

4. Registration costs the sum of £0.01. This sum shall be paid by debit card. This sum reflects the

administrative costs we incur in processing your Registration. As such, this Registration cost is nonrefundable,

regardless of whether you make a Request subsequent to Registration. However if you

cancel this Agreement in accordance with the Financial Services (Distance Marketing) Regulations

2004 (see paragraphs 13 to 15 below), we will refund this Registration cost.

Request

5. Upon receiving a Request from you, we will, at our discretion, loan you the sum you have

requested by crediting your bank account, using the bank account details you provided to us during

Registration. To make a Request you need to send us a text message from the mobile phone

number you provided to us during Registration and in accordance with the Request instructions

published on our website, http://www.minicredit.co.uk ('our website') from time to time. Alternative request

can be done online during registration and from secure client account by logging in at our website. If

we decline first request then subsequent request may incur charge up to £2.50. All other service

charges are published on our website and/or secure client account.

One Loan at a Time Only

6. We will only loan you one amount, of up to £1500.00, at any one time. Once you repay a loan in

full (together with payment in full of any other amounts you owe under this Agreement), you can

make another Request and we will, at our discretion, loan you a further amount of up to £1500.00 on

the same terms.

Loan extensions

7. Repayment of each loan and interest at the contractual rate is due 1 to 42 days after the day you

receive the loan in your account. At our discretion you can extend any given due date for repayment

by making an extension request ('Extension Request'). An Extension Request must be:

(i) in accordance with the Extension Request instructions and fees published on our website from

time to time; and

(ii) received by us no later than one day prior to the relevant due date for repayment.

Repayment, Default and Recovery

8. You agree to make all payments to us under this Agreement at the proper time. We will collect

payments by debiting your bank account using the debit card details you have registered with us up

to three times per day. You authorise us to debit your bank account to collect payments due under

this Agreement. If we are unsuccessful in collecting payment, we may try to debit your bank account

again at a later stage until we have successfully collected payment. If you have provided us with

details of a second debit card and we are unsuccessful in collecting payment from the first debit card,

you authorise us to seek payment via the second debit card in the same way as you authorise us to

seek payment via the first debit card. You must give us new valid debit card details when you cancel,

lose or your debit card(s) registered with us become(s) invalid when you have unpaid loan with us. If

you cancel your debit card registered with us and do not provide alternative debit card in 14 days we

may add all the default charges described in the Key Information and potential attempt fees regularly

charged until default date what is 120 days after the due date to your loan balance and refer your

account immediately to our debt recovery partner.

9. If you fail to make any payment by the due date, we may, after serving any default notice required

by law and after the period for remedying any default has passed, end this Agreement. In such

cases, you must pay any balance of the amount you owe us under this Agreement.

10. Interest on any sum in arrears will be charged at the contractual rate, both before and after

judgment, until payment. Also, you must pay us all other reasonable costs and expenses we incur

(including any legal costs on a full indemnity basis) in tracing you, or enforcing, or attempting to

enforce, our rights under this Agreement.

Cancellation

11. You have the right to cancel this Agreement under the Financial Services (Distance Marketing)

Regulations 2004 ('the Distance Regulations'). You will have 14 days from the date this Agreement

is made to cancel the Agreement 'the Cancellation Period'). The Cancellation Period commences

on the day that you receive an electronic copy of this Agreement at the e-mail address provided by

you, which you agree we may deliver this Agreement to in electronic pdf form. If you wish to cancel

this Agreement, please write to [email protected] and tell us that you wish to cancel. You

may also give us notice of cancellation by: http://www.minicredit.co.uk/contact

(i) leaving a written cancellation notice, addressed to us, at our address;

(ii) posting a written cancellation notice, addressed to us, to our address; or

(iii) sending a written cancellation notice to us by facsimile on 020 7138 2919.

12. If you cancel this Agreement, this Agreement will be terminated at the time which your

cancellation notice is given, however you will have to repay any money lent to you as soon as

possible and in any event not later than 30 calendar days of giving us notice of cancellation. Where

you have borrowed money from us and you cancel this Agreement, we may charge you £1.00 per

day for every £100.00 you have borrowed from us, with such charge commencing on the day that

you receive the relevant £100.00 from us and ending on the day your cancellation notice is given.

13. Apart from your right to cancel the Agreement under the Distance Regulations, described above,

there is no other right of cancellation. If you do not exercise your right to cancel under the Distance

Regulations, you will be bound by the terms of the Agreement.

Use of Your Information

14. In considering your application we will search your record at credit reference agencies. They will

add to your record details of our search and your application and this will be seen by other

organisations that make searches. Information held about you by the credit reference agencies may

already be linked to records relating to one or more of your partners. For the purposes of this

application you may be treated as financially linked and your application will be assessed with

reference to any 'associated' records.

We will use a credit scoring or other automated decision making system when assessing your

application.

We will also add to your record with the credit reference agencies details of your agreement with us

any default or failure to keep to its terms and any change of address you fail to tell us about where a

payment is overdue. It is important that you give us accurate information. We will check your details

with fraud prevention agencies and if you give us false or inaccurate information and we suspect

fraud, we will record this.

These records will be shared with other organisations and used by us and them to:

· Help make decisions about credit and credit related services such as insurance for you and

members of your household;

· Race debtors, recover debt, prevent money laundering and fraud, and to manage your accounts.

For these purposes we or they make further searches. Although these searches will be added to your

record, they will not be shared with others.

We may also use information about you to carry out market research.

Fraud prevention agency records will also be shared with other organisations to help make decisions

on motor, household, credit, life and other insurance proposals and insurance claims, for you and

members of your household.

Please contact us at (http://www.minicredit.co.uk/contact) if you want to have details of those credit

reference and fraud prevention agencies from whom we obtain and to whom we pass information

about you. You have a legal right to these details.

You have a right to receive a copy of the information we hold about you if you apply in writing. A fee

will be payable.

General

15. No relaxation or indulgence granted by us shall affect our rights under this Agreement.

16. You will notify us if you change address.

17. We may assign our rights and obligations under this Agreement.

18. You may not assign your rights and obligations under this Agreement without our prior written

consent.

19. We are a Data Controller for the purposes of the Data Protection Act 1998. We draw your

attention to our Privacy Policy which explains how we use any information you provide to us during

your use of our website.

20. Any notices given to you in relation to this Agreement shall be sent via by e-mail to the e-mail

address you have provided to us during Registration ('your e-mail address'). You agree that we may

send a copy of this Agreement in pdf form, as well as any notices given to you in relation to this

Agreement, to your e-mail address. At our discretion, we may also serve any notice or demand on

you personally, or leave it or send it by prepaid envelope addressed to you at your last known

address. You may serve any written notices on us by first class post to our registered address or

contact us at http://www.minicredit.co.uk/contact

21. Any waiver by either party of a breach of any provision of these Loan Conditions and/or this

Agreement shall not be considered to be a waiver of any subsequent breach of the same, or any

other, provision.

22. A person who is not a party to this Agreement has no right to benefit under or to enforce any term

of this Agreement.

23. This Agreement is governed by English Law.

[Space2001]

omg £19.50 for faster payment (which is free for them) but if your bank does no accept faster payments you have to pay double ie £39 If your bank account you have provided does not support faster payments scheme we may still charge £19.50 Fast Advance Transmission and handling Fee £19.50.

[sillygirl1]

This bit is completely iffy - they CANNOT associate you with other people for a single application... this should raise some eyebrows amongst the legal bods on the site team.

 

14. In considering your application we will search your record at credit reference agencies. They will add to your record details of our search and your application and this will be seen by otherorganisations that make searches. Information held about you by the credit reference agencies may already be linked to records relating to one or more of your partners. For the purposes of this application you may be treated as financially linked and your application will be assessed with reference to any 'associated' records.

 

Apart from the obvious breach of data protection this is a single application and should have no effect whatsoever on any 'financially related' persons on your credit file.

 

In fact doesn't Minicredit state that they don't credit check people?

[sequenci]

Nothing iffy about that at all. If there is a joint financial connection then the connected person's finances credit file could be implicated.

[sillygirl1]

Oh dear, they have given themselves a 'shot in the foot' with this clause,

 

12. If you cancel this Agreement, this Agreement will be terminated at the time which your cancellation notice is given, however you will have to repay any money lent to you as soon as possible and in any event not later than 30 calendar days of giving us notice of cancellation. Where

you have borrowed money from us and you cancel this Agreement, we may charge you £1.00 per day for every £100.00 you have borrowed from us, with such charge commencing on the day that you receive the relevant £100.00 from us and ending on the day your cancellation notice is given.

 

As they lend more than £100 it should read 'the loan amount' rather than £100, if you are in trouble (my interpretation) you should pay them £100 plus the £1.00 a day from the start of the contract and then the agreement is cancelled!!!

 

What a mangled contract this is (I am reading it backwards as I already know a lot of the faults in the beginning parts.

[sillygirl1]

Sequenci, this is a single application, states so at the beginning, they are lending to a single person, not a group or a couple....

 

It also implies in the beginning part that if you do not repay them it could have 'severe financial consequences' on people associated with you....

 

Again, this is not what is stated in the CCA Act, this is a gross misuse of information, data protection and law

 

For example, because I have made financial donations to a website I am 'financially linked' with them by the CRA's and therefore if I have financial problems they can apply to any 'financially linked' people for 'repatriation of funds' (that is my phrase for 'going into your partners bank account unannounced).

 

For me this would mean they may go into my landlord's bank account for any money owed as I am 'financially linked' with him on a regular basis...

Edited June 12, 2012 by sillygirl1

[sequenci]

A financial connection is created where you might have a joint financial agreement with another such as a joint loan or bank account. The relationship you have with your landlord wouldn't create such a relationship.

 

The credit file would only be used to consider the credit worthiness of the person taken out the loan. Anyone with a joint financial connection wouldn't be held liable for the debt unless they were a joint signatory to the credit agreement or if they were a guarantor.

 

I hope that makes sense.

 

Again, this is not what is stated in the CCA Act, this is a gross misuse of information, data protection and law

Not true.

[sillygirl1]

We will have to agree to differ on that point.

 

A lot of these clauses, especially their Clause 14, which if it is THAT important should be after the key financial information as Clause 1, seem to be designed to confuse and mislead the consumer as to their actual 'powers' should they default.

[Readybrek]

I thought the agreement should state how mh I actually borrowed and actual interest payable as well as a total amount.

[MostUncivilised]

The credit check linking is unproblematic as far as I can see.

 

However, the general nature of the contract and seeming failure to spell out the most basic, core contract terms such as the amount of the principal and the repayment date could lead to some to conclude that it is an improperly executed agreement and thus unenforceable (though not voidable). Some might conclude that; of course, I have no opinion on the matter. Certainly something to ponder.

 

This is not legal advice; it is for educational purposes only and I accept no liability for its accuracy. Always seek advice from a legal professional with a practicing certificate etc etc

[sillygirl1]

We already have discussed the contract issues and they are the least of the problems with this lender.

 

It is the lenders overall lack of communication, help and general aggressive emails that are the main worry, the emails alone point to bad business practice and the OFT are aware of the company.

 

We know about the credit linking and it is perfectly acceptable.

 

What we don't like on this forum is people using the terms and conditions to get out of repaying the principal sum borrowed, this is wrong, both legally and morally.

[sequenci]

What we don't like on this forum is people using the terms and conditions to get out of repaying the principal sum borrowed, this is wrong, both legally and morally.

 

That may be your opinion, but it isn't necessarily the view of CAG.

[sillygirl1]

Sequenci, I am talking about these payday loans, not other loans.

[sequenci]

Sequenci, I am talking about these payday loans, not other loans.

 

I think challenging agreements on a technicality for any post 6th April '07 agreement is going to be very tricky. Not impossible but very difficult (in direct comparison to pre 6th April agreements anyway). Unfair relationships is the way to go for PDL's for sure. (IMHO of course )

[sillygirl1]

Deffo, unfair relationships is a much better way to tackle them, they clearly state they are meant to be a short term solution, not a long term commitment, then start slapping on stupid charges and fees taking the debt beyond the realms of resonability and the chance of an early settlement.

 

There is also the arguement that they seem to prefer court as a means of debt collecting.

[MostUncivilised]

We already have discussed the contract issues and they are the least of the problems with this lender.

 

I'm curious what expertise you bring to the table to be able to conclude this?

 

We know about the credit linking and it is perfectly acceptable.

 

And yet you were claiming that in fact they were breaching data protection?

 

What we don't like on this forum is people using the terms and conditions to get out of repaying the principal sum borrowed, this is wrong, both legally and morally.

 

Immoral is creating an entire industry out of loan-sharking rates that would embarass the mafia. If the PDL industry is too cheap and scummy to bother even to ensure that their contracts are properly drafted legally, then they deserve to suffer the consequences.

 

This is exactly the same as evidence being non-admissible in criminal trials when it has been obtained by torture, illegal wiretapping, or baseless hearsay. This is a way to judicially regulate bad behaviour on the part of prosecutors and the police (some would call this "getting off on a technicality"; perhaps you would, it seems so)

 

What is not immoral is using every argument, technicality and circumstantial advantage to assist someone on here; I have no sympathy whatsoever for these human misery merchants in the PDL industry and I don't shrink for a bit from trying to help people to get the best possible outcome they can.

 

I find your attitude quite extraordinary and rather curious in terms of why you're so eager that people not do whatever they need to in order to obtain the best outcome, and your claim that it is "legally" wrong for someone to obtain a good outcome where a PDL company has messed up with their T&Cs is utterly inexplicable and factually incorrect.

Edited June 21, 2012 by MostUncivilised

[sillygirl1]

The answer to your argument is EXPERIENCE - both personal experience of having once been heavily in debt due to NOT knowing my rights and experience gained from dealing long term with PDL companies on this forum.

 

The more complicated you make your case the more hassle you will get.

 

I am a great believer in keeping things simple, straightforward and keeping legal terminology out of letters - this gives them very little room to counter argue - could you counter argue Carey v HSBC, the various Rankine cases if they were presented in a courtroom - particularly if they were used to completely mislead the judge as to the validity of the particulars of claim.

 

I'm interested in why you have so much knowledge and want to try an untested route - for example Mucky Hall are so easily dealt with a short letter would have done.

[sequenci]

Sadly, there has been a significant amount of misinformation being 'advised' within the payday loan forums, and some of it could have a significantly detrimental effect to those that a really struggling with their payday loans. A few people have been asked to quantify their postings by demonstrating authority via statute or case law to back up their theories. It speaks volumes that they've not been able to do this. Luckily it is possible to seek learned opinion elsewhere and we should hope to be able to get the PDL forums moving in the right direction shortly.

 

What part of Rankine would you say is important in relation to Payday loans, Sillygirl?

[postggj]

statute law, is what it states , law brought onto the statute books by parliament

 

case law is normally brought in through appeals through the lower courts

 

a county court where these cases are heard do not set case law, only a court of appeal does that to set a precedance

[MostUncivilised]

could you counter argue Carey v HSBC

 

What do you mean could I "counter argue" Carey? What aspect of Carey would they be raising, and in response to what?

[MostUncivilised]

Sadly, there has been a significant amount of misinformation being 'advised' within the payday loan forums, and some of it could have a significantly detrimental effect to those that a really struggling with their payday loans. A few people have been asked to quantify their postings by demonstrating authority via statute or case law to back up their theories. It speaks volumes that they've not been able to do this. Luckily it is possible to seek learned opinion elsewhere and we should hope to be able to get the PDL forums moving in the right direction shortly.

 

Well said. I fear that some individuals on these boards who benefit psychologically from feeling like the expert, when in fact they could be leading people down the garden path. Concerning in the extreme.

[postggj]

i am going to start the ball rolling on this one reference the legalities of payday loan contracts most, if not all of these payday loan agreements are done over the internet

 

the agreement being an agreement under the cca 1974 would need cancelation terms in the agreement (perscribed term)

 

so as the agreement was done over the internet with a tick the box acceptance, then it would be covered under

 

Consumer Protection (Distance Selling) Regulations 2002

 

most payday loan agreements do not have cancelation rights

 

a debtor has 5 days from after they receive the second copy of the agreement or a seperate copy of cancelation rights in which to cancel

 

 

Credit agreements which cannot be cancelled:

• Bank overdrafts;
  
• Loans secured on land, for example, mortgages;
  
• Small loans of £50 or less unless they are hire purchase or conditional sales;
  
• Small loans of £35 or less where the agreement was made away from trade premises in the presence of the trader;
  
• Loans to pay death duties.
  

what about the borrower having to receive a copy of the signed agreement executed by the creditor

 

i am no expert but i can read the cca 1974 and would love to get all the comments back on this to nail these agreements once and for all

Edited June 22, 2012 by squaddie

[citizenB]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?357427-catrine-v-minicredit-advice-please

 

catrine has their own thread now.