HELP!!! - County Court Claim Received for Debt Sold 10 years after Default**CASE NOW STAYED **

[pumpytums]

LBA adjust to suit

 

 

LETTER BEFORE ACTION

Section 7 – Data Protection Act 1998

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

In response to my Data Protection Act information request dated DATE

 

To date I have received no information what so ever in response to the above request. (adjust to suit)

 

Accordingly, I have to tell you that you have not yet complied with your obligations under the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

The time for compliance with my request has now expired. If you do not comply fully with my Subject Access Request within 7 days, I shall apply to the County Court for an order to enforce compliance, together with damages at the discretion of the court. I will also be reporting Santander to the Data Commissioners office for its breach of the data protection act. Due to your non-compliance I believe you will be fined.

 

I hope the above action will not be necessary and look forward to your complete compliance with my DSAR. I have attached an addition copy of my request.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

 

Pumpytums

[SF2010]

Thanks Pumpytums your an angel!

[pumpytums]

Just another thought SF2010,

have you checked your credit file? This should maybe show this debt up Sink have probably put a default on your CRF but it will be interesting to see the DN date. You can use equifax free just remember to cancel it before 30days. Otherwise it will cost you £7ish.

 

 

Pumpytums

[SF2010]

Hi Pumpytums

 

I have prepared the following and would just like your opinion on whether it is ok please:

 

Letter Before Action

Section 7 – Data Protection Act 1998[/font]

Dear Sir/Madam

In response to my Data Protection Act information request dated 21 June 2010 and sent by recorded delivery with a £10 postal order to cover your costs.

To date I have only received a letter dated 14th July 2010, enclosing a copy of an executed loan agreement and Terms and Conditions and I note the letter states ‘as requested’. Please be reminded that this was a SAR request, not a request for the specific account information supplied and this letter does not contain any reference to the SAR and make clear that this is the totality of information held. It also states that a statement of account has been sent to me in a separate letter. However, to date, this has not been received. I made a call to your office using the number supplied on the letter regarding sending all of the information held in relation to the SAR and was advised that there was no further information available. However, this has not been referred to me in your written response.

Accordingly, I have to tell you that you have not yet complied with your obligations under the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

The time for compliance with my request has now expired. If you do not comply fully with my Subject Access Request within 7 days, I shall apply to the county court for an order to enforce compliance, together with damages at the discretion of the court. I will also be reporting Santander to the Data Commissioners office for its breach of the data protection act. Due to your non-compliance I believe you will be fined.

 

I hope the above action will not be necessary and look forward to your complete compliance with my DSAR. I have attached an addition copy of my request.

 

Yours faithfully,

[Docman]

Hi SF

 

Just popping for support. I see that pumpytums drafted a great holding defence which you have filed. I suspect that is the reason why Sink have asked you to throw in the towel and accept a CCJ!!

The bottom line is that they have to prove three points before the court

1. that there was a credit agreement. Sink can't even make up their mind if there was one or more agreements.

2. that any such agreement was defaulted/terminated in accordance with the Act; and

3. when the claimant is not the original creditor, that the debt was legally assigned.

As far as I can see, they have come up with a credit agreement for a loan which may or may not be enforceable depending on the terms & conditions you signed. You mentioned also a credit card. Is that part of the claim?

There doesn't appear to be any evidence of a default/termination nor any assignment from the documents you have posted, so they are a bit stumped there.

I suspect that if you do not bow down to their bully boy tactics, their next step will be to apply for Summary Judgment, i.e. trying to get what they want without proving their claim. A lot of people don't want to go to court and so end up with a CCJ against them. Others file a short defence as you have and then lose out on the 'judge lottery' by getting a judge who is not sympathetic to litigants in person, especially where the defence has been 'cut & pasted' from the internet.

You can defend yourself but you have to be prepared for a fight and to go to court to argue your case. If you are up for it, this site can provide lots of help and support.

To start with, you could ask to see the original documents themselves. By referring to ‘an agreement and/or associated agreements’ and a ‘default notice’ in the Particulars of Claim, the claimants have ‘disclosed’ the documents to you and you may ‘inspect’ the document and take copies [CPR 31.14]. However, you have to give proper notice under CPR 31.15 of your wish to inspect the document which the claimants must provide WITHIN SEVEN DAYS . If you did make a request under CPR 31.15, I doubt Sink would comply but at least you can say to the court that you have tried to get hold of the documents.

The POCs state that the debt has been assigned to the claimant. You should have been sent a ‘Notice of Assignment’ at the time but it appears you haven’t had one and a copy hasn’t been exhibited with the claim. You could also ask for sight of the actual DEED of Assignment, which they will probably refuse but you can take your request further at a later stage.

As to the letter from Sink asking you to throw in the towel, I suggest you respond by saying you have been advised to only consider their request once they have fully substantiated their claim!

best of luck,

Doc

[pumpytums]

Letter looks ok SF,

 

Hiya Docman, great info.

 

Sink are trying their usual smoke and mirrors.

 

 

Pumpytums

[SF2010]

Docman

 

Thanks ever so much for your support !!! I am amazed at the help I am receiving and very grateful.

 

I dont have a credit card, so I may have entered misleading info, sorry. this is purely relating to an Abbey loan. I sent CPR 31.14 and CPR 18 but only a copy of the CCA has arrived and had the same from the OC in response to my SAR.

 

Im not sure what a CPR 31.15 looks like and would be grateful if someone could post this so that I can send this aswell.

 

I have to say it does get to me, but Im prepared to fight as I have struggled so much to get my head above water and this is just the final straw. I will also send a response to Link regarding substantiating their claim!

 

Thanks for giving me a reason to smile, even if just a little!

 

SF2010

Edited July 27, 2010 by SF2010

[pumpytums]

Hi SF,

what letter are you sending to link?

 

Pumpytums

[SF2010]

Hi Pumpytums

 

Doc advises sending them a letter stating that I they have not subtantiated their claim and produced the information requested. I am interested in just adding this to a 31.15 request he has mentioned. Have you ever seen one?

 

SF2010

[SF2010]

I have a copy of the terms and conditions from Santander, but not a signed copy, its probably going to be difficult to read, but is it worth posting it here? Its a faxed copy which appears to have been sent somewhere on 23 Feb 2003, it says page 1/2, but I only received page 1. It may or may not be relevant, but just thought I would add.

 

Also, so that advice is appropriate, I have found an old copy of a credit file which states that the account was defaulted 03/00 and interestingly the amount has grown by a few thousand pounds since then. So I definetly need clarity on how this amount has grown by over 50% since default.

 

I hope this helps.

 

Thanks again

 

SF2010

Edited July 27, 2010 by SF2010

[pumpytums]

I've never sent a CPR 31.15, I think it's something to do with inspection of docs have a search on CAG for it. I think they have to allow inspection with a set time period of certain docs.

 

Have Sink claimed s69 interest this is between the assignment date and judgement date? I would argue why the hell they waited 7 years to bring it to court.

 

 

Pumpytums

[Docman]

Sorry SF, I may have misled you slightly. CPR 31.14 gives you the right to inspect a document mentioned in the POCs but CPR 31.15 obliges you to make a request in writing. Such a written request is often referred to on the forum as a 31.14 letter.

 

I see from your earlier posts that you sent such a request but Sink haven't responded. I suggest that your response should remind them that they haven't complied properly with your request under CPR 31.14.

[SF2010]

Hi Pumpytums

 

Link say they acquired the debt in 07, which was after the defaulted account would have been removed from my credit file. I was however, paying token payments to another DCA Credit Security Ltd before then. They have tried to get S69 interest in their claim, but even then, looking back, the amount had grown by over £1,000 under Credit Security without any notifications of additional charges being made. I had even offered Credit Security a settlement amount back in 2006, but they preferred the token payment arrangement to continue. So the last time I paid was in 2007 to Credit Security.

 

The only payment made to Link was in response to their original letter in Aug 07 to which I provided advice that I didnt know the debt had been sold and I couldnt afford to pay in full and offered a £1 token payment.

 

I then got the LBA in 2010 which I responded to advising that they had ignored my previous correspondence and sending them a token payment and details of my income and expenditure. Clearly, they saw mortgage payments and ran hell for leather to court before responding to my reply which was well within the time given in their LBA asking for payment in full.

 

So there we have it! Just hoping for the best, so I can get on with my life.

 

SF2010

Edited July 27, 2010 by SF2010

[SF2010]

Hi

 

This CPR 31.15 seems almost a repeat of the 31.14, but I think there is some benefit in sending as it gives a shorter response time and it may be beneficial to show that I have responded to their communications, even though they havent responded to mine.

 

I have adapted it a little and intend to send this response to Link on Monday, along with the SAR LBA to Santander and kill 2 birds with one stone. Is the comment regarding signed T&Cs valid? Comments welcome!!! SF2010

 

Re: My request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 - CPR 31.15.

 

Thank you for your recent letter dated 21st July 2010, received 26 July 2010, the contents of which are noted. However, the reply to my request under the CPR 31.14, requested in writing on 14th June 2010, has not been fully complied with and does not substantiate your claim. You had until 01/07/2010 to provide me with the true copies of all of the documents I requested. You are now in default of my request.

 

The Act demands that I be supplied with a true copy of any properly executed credit agreement that exists in relation to the above account. It also asks for a number of additional documents detailed below. I may ask for this on demand providing that a fee of £1.00 is paid. This fee was sent with my original letter. All of the particulars within the CPR 31.14 request made have not been supplied by you, therefore, you remain non-compliant. The items you sent in your reply, does not substantiate the claim that you have made. It neither confirms that I am liable for any alleged debt to you, nor gives me any chance to evaluate whether any original agreement was ‘properly executed’.

 

You did not provide the following:

The deed of assignment;

the signed terms and conditions of the agreement; (Can I put this in?)

copies of the statement of account, showing all payments and charges applied and the date they were levied for the full duration of the agreement;

the default notice;

the termination notice.

 

Additionally, under my CPR 18 request made on June 14th 2010, you were obliged to send all other documents which you were reliant upon to substantiate your claim to Nottingham County Court under the Civil Procedure Rules, this has not been received. As you are no doubt aware, you should also be in possession of original copies of these documents. (Can I say that?) This includes transcripts of telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations.

 

Should you not have any deed of assignment or the additional documents requested and outlined above, please confirm this in writing to me within the statutory time limit. This request under CPR 31.15 must be complied with within SEVEN DAYS.

 

Further contact from you which does not address all of the requests made and does not fully comply with CPR rules will be deemed vexatious and a clear attempt to harass me without substantiating your claim and will be reported to the courts as an attempt to frustrate proceedings.

 

I will also report your actions to the Financial Ombudsman Service. (Is this a valid addition? Kind of sick of receiving threats, perhaps they need to feel a little threatened themselves. Of course I will follow through, as I think it is important)

 

I look forward to your reply.

 

Yours faithfully

Edited July 27, 2010 by SF2010

[SF2010]

Docman

 

No problem with CPR 31.14/ 31.15, all advice is welcome and I think I can put this to good use!

 

Thanks again

 

SF2010

[SF2010]

Hi All

 

Just to update. No response to SAR received from Santander by deadline of 31st. Sent Letter Before Action to Santander yesterday (2 Aug) and 31.15 to Link in response to their kind offer for me to save time and costs, accept judgment and withdraw my defence. I advised them in that letter that I would not respond to any further correspondence without compliance.

 

So, its another waiting game, but feel better having responded to the Link request to withdraw my defence. Im not going to be stressed out continually by the letters. Thanks to CAG I have learned that their actions are indeed smoke and mirrors, carefully worded letters which pray on fear and our lack of knowledge in understanding the legal requirements. Actually, litigation could be exactly what is needed to get rid of them once and for all.

 

I will be in touch to ask how to go about making a claim against Santander to enforce compliance. If anyone reads this post before next Tuesday, any advice you have would be gratefully received.

 

I will keep you posted if anything occurs.

 

SF2010

[SF2010]

Hi

 

The time period for a response from Link to the court has expired. They had 28 days from 6 Jul to respond or the claim would be stayed. Can anyone advise what happens next please. I have not had any reply from Santander yet either.

 

Important!!! I was turned down for a mortgage today due to adverse credit on my file. I have re-joined Experian today to see my file, but have to wait up to 48 hours for security to clear my report. The letter states I have to pay a £150 withdrawal fee in 7 days. I did have a broker who did a credit search and spoke to the lender prior to me making the application. How can this be?

 

Please advise if you can!!

[JonCris]

This is very important any payments made AFTER 6 years from default do not count & the debt would be still time barred. Any payments made BEFORE the end of 6 years will extend the debt by a further 6 years from that payment. So please put all you dates here so we can determine whether or not the debt is enforceable

[SF2010]

Hi I last made a £1 token payment in 2007, but dont know the exact date. From an old CRA report, I can see the account defaulted 03/00, so I guess im stumped. I think the £1 token payments started in 2005 to another DCA. I have remortgaged, changed banks and applied for a credit card within the last 3 years without any adverse credit problems at all.

[JonCris]

If this DCA have no record of any payments made between 3/00 & 3/06 then the debt is time barred Payments made after 3/06 are considered a mistake & DO NOT make the debt enforceable

[pumpytums]

Hi SF,

would it be possible for you to draw up a timelline

 

eg

 

1-1-2000 Loan took out

 

2-3-2004 Defaulted

 

3-10-2006 Letter from Link saying they own the debt

 

Be careful not to put correct dates this is a public forum, vary them slightly. It's unlikely that it would be used against you but if the dates are wrong it's no use to other interested parties.

 

They need to produce all the documents in Court, this means the agreement, DN and anything else they wish to rely upon.

 

Pumpytums

[SF2010]

Hi

 

1-7-1997 Loan took out

 

2-3-2000 Defaulted

 

3-7-2007 Letter from Link saying they own the debt advising they wrote to me previously enclosing a copy of a letter dated 06-2007 (never received) with copy of letter supposedly from Abbey to me stating the same on the same date.

 

 

Any advice would be welcomed! Thanks again!

[SF2010]

Hi, this is a payment plan for a default in 1997 with Halifax.

 

I have been paying them £1 per month and they have been sending me statements for the past, say 2 years, which I didnt understand why that had stared to happen. I have been paying the DCA regular £1 payments for years, but this can only recently have been placed on my credit file. I havent had any other problems with credit since they dropped off after the 6 years. I contacted the OC on Saturday and they said they hadnt placed anything on my file and I would need to contact the DCA about it. Should I start a new thread with this one? Or is it a cut and dry debt enforceable situation? They clearly havent written off the debt. Is it worth offering a F&F settlement figure as they would have to remove all of the information then. The debt stands at £3671, but I couldnt offer anywhere near that. If I cant get this off my file, I may lose my home as I am coming off a fixed rate in Oct at 5.99% and the bank base rate is a whopping 5.99% at the moment. I was just praying to get to that point and wouldnt have been concerned if the BR wasnt so high with them. Imagine getting a % increase with them?

 

Im sending a CPR 31.14 to Halifax today anyway as I dont know exactly what my payments have been or if there has been any gaps. Maybe, they dont have everything in order either, but it scares me that they havent written it off and started to send me statements themselves.

 

In relation to the mortgage withdrawal fee, I have found this statement from the woolwich on the net:

 

"People who apply for a mortgage with the Woolwich and then pull out part way through the process are to be charged a £150 fee."

The Woolwich added that only those who decide not to take out a mortgage with the group, despite having been accepted, and those who have an application rejected because they have given false information will have to pay the fee.

People who are rejected for a mortgage by the Woolwich due to affordability concerns will not be liable for the charge."

 

I am assuming they consider that I have given false information, I didnt give them anything false, they have discovered something which they do not like.

 

 

Should I start a new thread as this is a different situation all together?

[JonCris]

They cannot place a default on your file long after you defaulted. IMHO you should contact them & tell them that as a result of their unlawful actions you have been denied a mortgage & that you intend to seek legal recourse against them

 

& yes start your own thread & put a link here

[SF2010]

Thanks JonCris and Pumpytums

 

I have put the link to the other thread here. I have a way forward and will be taking action as advised in the thread. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?272583-URGENT!!!-Payment-Plan-with-DCA-for-defaulted-account-13-years-ago-means-declined-for-a-mortgage&p=3079950#post3079950

 

In addition, the broker has agreed to cover the cost of the mortgage application as it was pre-approved through them. This gives me a little time to get things sorted.

 

Thanks again! SF2010