Cabot Financial – Dealing with Cabot Financial

[PriorityOne]

Cabot are extremely nit-picky... I am having a lot of fun backing them into a corner over various issues right now. I think they work on the principle that if they stay calm in their correspondence, then people will get worked up. Unfortunately, this has worked in reverse lately... although they are still maintaining (in my case) that I need to contact the OC myself for the CCA..... despite them buying the account through an absolute assignment.

 

Even though I'm not obliged to, methinks they may need a CCA request of their very own as well then....

[MAGDA]

I think yo need to see what legal precedents the Judge used in arriving at his decision and then set about dealing with these using case law and precedents to dismantle his judgement.

 

***Notice to GUESTS Crapbot may have won the first round of this battle but they wont win the war***

 

 

Well said ODC. Sorry to hear your bad news Beau - hopefully you will be able to appeal this decision, it certainly doesn't seem right. Consumer Law is there for a reason, and even judges have to recognise that.

 

Keep your chin up, it's not over yet.

 

Magda

[hunni2006]

that's awful scary Beau.

 

I love this site & without it I would never have had either the guts or knowledge to challenge the summons I received from Cabot, but there does seem to be a bit of pot luck in the advice you get on here sometimes, & it can happen at a crucial time, often leaving you floundering and confused as to whether you have made the right decision.

 

To a complete novice like myself, the law is a confusing minefield, and being certain that I understand a point of law is hard enough, without the prospect of having to argue the point in court when faced with a judge who will then interpret the same Law in a different way.

 

With the consequences of a wrong decision being so costly to people, it is scary that things like this can happen, and I'm sure it will put a lot of people off from defending claims.

[BeauBrummie]

Cabot are extremely nit-picky... I am having a lot of fun backing them into a corner over various issues right now. I think they work on the principle that if they stay calm in their correspondence, then people will get worked up. Unfortunately, this has worked in reverse lately... although they are still maintaining (in my case) that I need to contact the OC myself for the CCA..... despite them buying the account through an absolute assignment.

 

Even though I'm not obliged to, methinks they may need a CCA request of their very own as well then....

 

Hi Priority One,

 

Your case is slightly different to what happened to me yesterday---It was the judge who took the lead and council for Cabot hardly had to say a word---this was not Cabot's doing!!! but I am damn sure they will jump on the bandwagon and seize the opportunity.

 

Absolute assignment or not, did not matter, I was told in no uncertain terms that this was not my argument and therefore I could not question the legality or enforceability of my so called "agreement"

 

Beau

[MAGDA]

that's awful scary Beau.

 

I love this site & without it I would never have had either the guts or knowledge to challenge the summons I received from Cabot, but there does seem to be a bit of pot luck in the advice you get on here sometimes, & it can happen at a crucial time, often leaving you floundering and confused as to whether you have made the right decision.

 

To a complete novice like myself, the law is a confusing minefield, and being certain that I understand a point of law is hard enough, without the prospect of having to argue the point in court when faced with a judge who will then interpret the same Law in a different way.

 

With the consequences of a wrong decision being so costly to people, it is scary that things like this can happen, and I'm sure it will put a lot of people off from defending claims.

 

 

It shouldn't put people off defending (although I know what you are saying Hunni) because in that case, the creditor will just get a judgement against you anyway and we are then back to the old days when getting a CCJ was a foregone conclusion.

 

As far as costs go, that is always the risk if you lose if it's been allocated to the fast or multi-track, but I think it is always worth giving it a shot, although I know from first hand experience how scary that can be at times.

 

Cabot really do need taking in hand, like a few other DCAs I could mention.

 

Magda

[PriorityOne]

Hi Priority One,

 

Your case is slightly different to what happened to me yesterday---It was the judge who took the lead and council for Cabot hardly had to say a word---this was not Cabot's doing!!! but I am damn sure they will jump on the bandwagon and seize the opportunity.

 

Absolute assignment or not, did not matter, I was told in no uncertain terms that this was not my argument and therefore I could not question the legality or enforceability of my so called "agreement"

 

Beau

 

It seems strange that the Judge opted to refer to that particular judgement and from what you've said, he seemed biased towards Cabot from the start anyway. It was indeed your argument, otherwise what's the point of a court system?

 

You're not the first to come up against a cack Judge and probably won't be the last... You have to remember that the relationships between courts, banks and the rest of the finance industry is extremely incestuous to say the least.

 

It's not right, but it's the way it seems to be.... which means it's left to us to battle on and show it for what it is.

[MAGDA]

Hi Priority One,

 

Your case is slightly different to what happened to me yesterday---It was the judge who took the lead and council for Cabot hardly had to say a word---this was not Cabot's doing!!! but I am damn sure they will jump on the bandwagon and seize the opportunity.

 

Absolute assignment or not, did not matter, I was told in no uncertain terms that this was not my argument and therefore I could not question the legality or enforceability of my so called "agreement"

 

Beau

 

The judge shouldn't be arguing Cabot's case for them anyway, that is why they have a barrister to do it for them.

 

And it most certainly was your argument, that is a ridiculous thing to say, especially as the Assignment is extremely important - it determines after all whether Cabot has the legal right to bring the Action in the first place..

 

If you do decide to appeal Beau (when you have gone over all of the facts and know what you want to do) you might find r&b's thread useful. It's for an overdraft, but the claimant obtained SJ, and r&b is now appealing it.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/192486-court-claim-o-draft.html

 

Magda

[ODC]

It angers me that just because you were a litigant in person you were not allowed to speak. Had you have gone to the expense of emplying a barrister to fight your case I doubt whether a judge would have spoken over him/her

[spartathisis]

looks like I'm heading towards the courts then:( poor micro fiche app form 60% added and on and on). Thank goodness for the support here on CAG.

 

Chin up Beau, thing will improve.

[diddydicky]

for those who have read the judgement in its entirety there is ample evidence from the judge himself that this case concerned only the enforceability question of several aspects and nowhere in the judgement does he seek to alter the pre existing status quo with regard to an unenforceable agreement or defective DN and he made it as plain as a pikestaff that this decision would not impact upon a case in which there was an unenforceable CCA

 

Clearly this is appealable did the other side pre warn you that they were using mcguffin as authority? if so then i respectfully suggest that perhaps on hindsight it might have been a bit more than you could chew if you were not fully ofay with what the discussion and outcome of that judges decisions were

 

I am sure that a lawyer would overturn that decision on an appeal as clearly the judge in your case had absolutely no right to use ANY part of the mcguffin case in relation to the arguments in your case

[angry cat]

Crapbot are clearly taking full advantage of the McGuffick judgement!

[diddydicky]

as a general rule IMO if you are a litigant in person and clearly "losing the battle" because you are being stiffled out of the proceedings you HAVE to make a fuss

 

politely but firmly you have to talk over the judge if necessary and register a protest (on the tape) that you consider that you are not being given an equal opportunity to put your case. after all - you are losing so what else have you got to lose!!

 

at the end you should (again politely) but firmly suggest that the judge makes a full account of the reasoning for his decisions for appeal purposes (IMO)

[angry cat]

Look at this:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/228950-cabot-having-tin-bath.html

 

They must be desperate!

[BeauBrummie]

for those who have read the judgement in its entirety there is ample evidence from the judge himself that this case concerned only the enforceability question of several aspects and nowhere in the judgement does he seek to alter the pre existing status quo with regard to an unenforceable agreement or defective DN and he made it as plain as a pikestaff that this decision would not impact upon a case in which there was an unenforceable CCA

 

Clearly this is appealable did the other side pre warn you that they were using mcguffin as authority? if so then i respectfully suggest that perhaps on hindsight it might have been a bit more than you could chew if you were not fully ofay with what the discussion and outcome of that judges decisions were

 

I am sure that a lawyer would overturn that decision on an appeal as clearly the judge in your case had absolutely no right to use ANY part of the mcguffin case in relation to the arguments in your case

 

Thanks for this support,

 

At the risk of hijacking this excellent thread in favour of mine, I believe any of appeal would have to be on the basis of my agreement being unenforceable--I would have to back this up with some case law??

which totally refutes the judge in my case's argument.

 

For the record I did register on the tape on several occasions the fact that I questioned the legallity of Cabots claim regarding the assignment and I also asked "are you going to allow me the question" regarding the assignement and at least twice I was told that my question was irrelevant.

 

Beau

[BeauBrummie]

Just a bit further to the above, I was not prewarned regarding the McGuffick case and Council for Cabot approached me before the hearing and stated "that is a very good defence" and "where did you get it"

 

Clearly not good enough in this instance.

 

Beau

[exasperated]

Hi Beau,

I think now that DD has made those comments you should definitely appeal. Being a relative newcomer I couln't be so bold to advise you to act on my thoughts on the earlier posting but now you have that by DD I think the path is clear for a succesful appeal.

Good Luck

Exasp

[Dibsthefrenchie]

Beau, I believe that your case is an excellent addition to this thread, it certainly adds to the thread title!

 

How much will an appeal cost? As SH suggested on page 4 of this thread, perhaps we can all work together, and make a donation towards the cost of an appeal? I am sure that CAG members with the relevant case knowledge would help out with the defence? Suggestions anybody?

 

Keep your chin up, Beau.

 

Dibs

[MAGDA]

it's £120 to submit the application to Appeal (N161, I believe)

[diddydicky]

Thanks for this support,

 

At the risk of hijacking this excellent thread in favour of mine, I believe any of appeal would have to be on the basis of my agreement being unenforceable--I would have to back this up with some case law??

which totally refutes the judge in my case's argument.

 

For the record I did register on the tape on several occasions the fact that I questioned the legallity of Cabots claim regarding the assignment and I also asked "are you going to allow me the question" regarding the assignement and at least twice I was told that my question was irrelevant.

 

Beau

 

quite how he would know your question was "irrelevant" if he did not allow you to ask it is a mystery!!

 

methinks the cost of a transcript of the tape would be money well spent

 

there is simply NOTHING in the McGuffic case that can be related to an unenforceable CCA and defective DN or assignment (IMO)

Edited October 29, 2009 by diddydicky

[diddydicky]

Just a bit further to the above, I was not prewarned regarding the McGuffick case and Council for Cabot approached me before the hearing and stated "that is a very good defence" and "where did you get it"

 

Clearly not good enough in this instance.

 

Beau

 

again i am not a legal expert but it is my understanding that the parties cannot refer to any legal authorities or cases stated unless they give you prior notice of what they intend to refer to

 

i am sure some of the legal bods will comment

 

if i am right then another flaw in the judges conduct of the case i think

[diddydicky]

Hi Beau,

I think now that DD has made those comments you should definitely appeal. Being a relative newcomer I couln't be so bold to advise you to act on my thoughts on the earlier posting but now you have that by DD I think the path is clear for a succesful appeal.

Good Luck

Exasp

 

thanks for that but DO take care to read the footnote on my posts!! i am no legal expert!

[Dibsthefrenchie]

I have had an alert on my credit file which shows that Cabot have made a search as an "unrecorded enquiry", so as a home owner, I am now expecting a letter from Morgans or the start of court proceedings for a disputed CCA. Will start a new thread if or more likely when this arrives!

Dibs.

[cymruambyth]

Cabot have changed their phone techiques. 08450702610 rings, pleasant ??? music, 'if you are xxxxx press 1'. 'Hello Cabot ' and phone goes down

[militantconsumer]

We have discovered that Cabot are chasing us for an old Next Directory Account from 2002. PT has kindly explained how such accounts are completely unenforceable (due to the total lack of signed credit agreements) in this thread:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/200443-tactics-dealing-next-directory.html

 

The above is well worth a read for anybody who has an old Next account and finds Cabot chasing after them.

 

Obviously any interest and default charges subsequently added by Cabot will also be unenforceable.

 

However, I am concerned that they are going to start destroying our credit file, which was due to become pretty clean by 2011. I am wondering how they could possibly have a right to do this.

 

I will start a separate thread for this if it gets interesting. In the meantime we will continue to correspond politely.

[stitchedup]

My hearing is late November, hopefully somebody can assist so as to not get the same unfortunate result an Beau