County Court claim - jaznh

[supasnooper]

Okay, that's fine

 

You'll need to refine your Letter Before Action, as it will need to go to Howard Cohens giving them 7 days to comply without any reference to CL Finance.

 

 

You may wish to consider writing to CL Finance to ask for a copy of the "concessionary arrangement" for completeness of your records.

[jaznh]

Thanks snoops - I really can't thank you enough. I am adding to your reputation every chance I get!

 

Today we received an allocation questionaire which has to be returned by the 20th Nov. So I'm starting to get worried. How does the online defence relate to the defence I'll need to include with the AQ?

 

In the online defence (obviously shorter), I had claimed that there could not rightfully be any proper termination or assignment, since the default notice had not allowed time for that.

 

So will my AQ defence mention this, & further to that, will I now ask for full disclosure of the CPR 31.14 documents in the AQ. Is there any point in continuing with a letter before action?

Many thanks & regards, JnH

[supasnooper]

Now you've got the AQ it would be futile to proceed with the Letter before Action.

 

The AQ will allow you to request disclosure of the documents you require.

 

Have a look at these links for info on AQ's (courtesy of 42man) -

 

Link Financial County Court Summons - N150

 

Directions for N150 or N149 Allocation questionnaire - Paul's guide to N149 & N150 AQ's

 

Allocation Questionnaire...Urgent help needed please!!! - N150

 

Court papers received- what now??!!**WON**CASE DISMISSED - N149 (with draft order for directions)

 

upto the eyeballs v CL Finance No CCA IN COURT ** Help ** - N150

 

The dreaded court claim came today... - N150

[jaznh]

Much appreciated - thankyou snoops

[jaznh]

& of course, 42man!

[jaznh]

Hi snoops, it's Jaznh, very grateful for all the brilliant help & assistance you & 42man have been giving me.

I paste a link to your post "Paul's guide to N149..."; because I was wondering if you think I might be able to use the basic format in our court case.

Directions for N150 or N149 Allocation questionnaire

 

I have to have the AQ in by this Friday (20th), & I have requested a number of documents according to CPR 31.14; but they've only satisfied part of the request - & I reckon the Default notice is dodgy - I'll also quote to you from my thread where I've mentioned my online defence; as I'm still unsure about what information to include:

Hello again - So I've mounted a defence online to the effect that the DN is dodgy; thus it should not be true that there has been any termination. I think I'm correct in saying that is the claimant's first problem.

 

So later, I will be in a position to ask for full disclosure of documents requested earlier in my CPR 31. I presume that this will all be included in the full defence; & that this would be filed in conjunction with the Allocation Q. Is that right?

 

Many thanks once again, JnH

 

Would I need to put a complete embarrassed defence in now; or is it just a matter of asking for full disclosure now? I would once again very much appreciate your help.

 

Regards, JnH

[supasnooper]

The Allocation Questionnaire is now the point you ask for the undisclosed documents mentioned in the Particulars of Claim. - in your case the Consumer Credit Agreement and the Default Notice.

 

You can also ask for permission to amend your defence once the documents are supplied.

 

It's all in pt's thread -

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/131499-directions-n150-n149-allocation.html

[jaznh]

Thank you very much, snoops - much appreciated

[jaznh]

Very Interesting! - Yesterday, I submitted our AQ to local County court, & today, we received a very interesting letter from 'LEWIS DEBT RECOVERY'; who say "as you are aware, act for CL Finance Ltd.' Actually, NO we're NOT AWARE of any such thing!

Then they say that "we are instructed by our client to offer you an incentive to settle... to bring this matter to a speedy conclusion we are permitted to offer you a 50% discount... This is a splendid opportunity for you to satisfy your liability to our client..."

They then encourage us to phone them "NOW"; or alternatively use an attached Giro or send a cheque, but saying if we choose either of these latter options, we should allow at least four days for payment to reach us. They give us till the 27th Nov. to pay with this offer. At the top of the letter typed in capitals they have "without prejudice".

 

I would very much appreciate your thoughts on this letter; (a few questions):

 

Why print WITHOUT PREJUDICE"?;

Why would 'LEWIS DEBT RECOVERY' be dealing with the account; if CL Finance have already issued court proceedings; & even though this letter tries to suggest that we knew Lewis were involved (we most certainly didn't), does them saying "you are aware" have any significance?

 

In advance, many thanks.

Regards, JnH

[42man]

You could possibly drop them a line stating that this alleged debt is the subject of legal proceedings.....and state that you are surprised that the client has not informed them of this...

[jaznh]

So no agreement to settle?

[supasnooper]

LDR are part of CL Finance, so it is highly likely they are aware of the legal action.

 

Why else would they mark the offer "Without Prejudice"

 

They're on a fishing trip to get you to make a payment and then state in Court that you have acknowledged the debt.

[jaznh]

Cheers snoops - get us to acknowledge; then try & chase us for the rest after these proceedings are done! If that is the case, is it worth using the letter with this case in any way?

 

PS - I'll post this on the thread as well - you have a great weekend too. Regards, JnH

[supasnooper]

Almost..... If you decided to accept LDR's very generous offer, CL Finance willl produce a Statement of Account in court showing that a payment was made to the account, therefore the defendant acknowledges the debt.

 

I don't see anything in LDR's offer to discontinue the proceedings if you accept the settlement.......remember, the letter is marked "Without prejudice" so it can't be used in court.

Now why have they headed the letter as such ?

[jaznh]

How stupid do they think we are? I'm just wondering if I could send them a 'WITHOUT PREJUDICE' letter?

[jaznh]

Today we received a letter from our local court saying that "Before District Judge.... Upon the courts own motion. The court has made this order of its own initiative without a hearing. If you object..., you must make a application to have it set aside, varied or stayed within 7 days.

IT IS ORDERED THAT

The Judge has considered your case is suitable for mediation & you are therefore invited to use the free Sm. claims Mediation Service. The case will be stayed for 28 days in order for mediation to be arranged..."

 

After this period, the letter says that 'the court will list the claim for final hearing so that your claim is not delayed'; while emphasizing that mediation would still be possible; which, if reached before any final hearing, will be cancelled. The last sentence tells us: 'continue to prepare for the final hearing as directed by the Judge.'

The letter has two dates in it - at the end, it says "Dated 20 November"; whereas in box at the top where it says "In the ............. County Court", one of its boxes uses the date 26 November. Does this have any significance? Should I perhaps phone the court to clarify?

 

I should probably also add that we have lodged pt's Draft Order for Directions & N149 / 150 **Allocation Questionnaire - Section G / H **- other information - here's a link to that: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/131499-directions-n150-n149-allocation.html; sending a registered copy to the Claimant's solicitors, which we have had no response to - & certainly no copy of the claimant's AQ or enclosed documents. The 14 days that they've had to react to the draft order runs out this Friday (4th Dec). I think that's everything I can think of at this stage. Any advice? In advance, once again, many thanks & respect. Regards, JnH

[42man]

You might find this interesting - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/151102-help-needed-very-tight-4.html#post1709659

[jaznh]

Thanks again 42man, a very interesting case indeed!

 

I'm not certain what the implications of that are - should I just phone the court to ask why I haven't received the other side's AQ or any enclosed documents? I did make a mistake filing our AQ, as I failed to mention that I had served copies to the Claimant. But the court let me correct that, by allowing me to submit a note saying that I had served the doc's to them. I saw the clerk stamp the note.

 

Would the Sm. claims mediation ordered by the court interfere in any way with the AQ documents, or the draft order for directions arising from mine?

[42man]

Definitely speak to the court....

[jaznh]

Sure thing. Thanks very much, 42man

[jaznh]

Right - rang the court on Thursday, to ask two things: i) Should the claimant have sent me a copy of thier AQ; & of course, any of its enclosed documents. The guy I spoke to said I shouldn't necessarily expect to have been sent any of this - he said they don't legally have to. I didn't really know how to respond. That was question 1, the other, ii) hat should I do if the draft order for directions that I filed with my AQ was ignored by the claimant? He told me that we should wait to see if it actually was ignored. As I post this today (Mon 7th), the claimant has not provided the documents demanded in the draft order I submitted with my AQ - here's a link to pt's thread: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/131499-directions-n150-n149-allocation.html - what should I do now? Advice would be much appreciated. Regards, JnH

[supasnooper]

The other side are not obliged to send you a copy of their Allocation Questionnaire.

 

The draft order that you completed is read by the Judge and he then makes a decision, not the other side.

 

I'm presuming you sent the other side a copy of your AQ as a courtesy but they are not required to act on it.

 

You'll get a letter shortly from the court telling you what will happen next.

[jaznh]

What if the judge ordered to move to mediation?

[jaznh]

And yes - I did send the claimant a copy of my AQ, & its enclosed documents. It appears as if the judge felt that a period should be set for mediation.

Should I contact the mediation service to tell them that the claimant will not satisfy my CPR request; & hasn't at any time responded to our requests to provide the CCA, a true default notice, (& hence a true notice of assignment, as well as a true termination notice.) Should I tell them (the mediation service) that I cannot properly defend a court claim without any of these?

[jaznh]

Updating:.....

As of now we still haven't been able to reach the mediation service - little bit frustrating, been trying for two weeks. The letter we received from the judge said that the stay (28 days)wouldn't continue for long so that the claim is not delayed. This was mentioned in a letter of 26th Nov at the very latest; & we still have heard nothing from the court!

 

Another thing: If we do speak with mediation, should I mention the draft order which the claimant has ignored; & perhaps all the other documents CL Finance haven't produced? Would very much appreciate a little advice. Many thanks in advance - Regards, JnH