Capricorn v Lloyds

[Guest]

capricorn

 

it still doesn't seem entirely legible! so cant really tell. tried it up to 150% but still couldn't read it properly! but note what cymruambyth says!

[cerberusalert]

Take a look and let me know what you think? does it contain the prescribed terms?

 

Very nice T&Cs but it's lacking the 'right to cancel' as required under CCCR 1983, see pages four & five.

3. Consumer Credit (Cancellation...cuments) Regulations 1983..pdf

[Guest]

how did you manage to read the tc's?

[cerberusalert]

I enlarged it x200 using Adobe Reader.

[Guest]

do you think this microfiche copy would be acceptable? given that it is only readable at 200% with a reader? (cancellation clause aside) Edited May 16, 2010 by Ford
typo

[cerberusalert]

They could produce what they like but whether a judge would accept it is anyones guess, besides it's possible they have an original copy, but as it does not link in anyway to a signed agreement it could belong to anything... besides it doesn't contain any of the OPs details such as name, address, sinature etc.

[cerberusalert]

I've just read through the thread and if the document in post #131 is the front and reverse of the same document I'm afraid it will be enforceable as all the prescribed terms are present.

[vint1954]

Take a look and let me know what you think? does it contain the prescribed terms?

You would need to look for a link between the 2 documents. Your application form has a print code on it of 9/98. I assume that that was when the account was opened. There appears to be no print code on the terms.

 

To be fair, the copy that they would have would be a bank copy, but that does not mean that they are the terms that you signed up to. You need to find a linkk between the 2, or not.

 

As it stands, if the 2 are linked, that would be enforcable with the ony problem being legibility.

[Capricorn1601]

the only reference I can see is in the second card section which refers to "conditions of use set out on reverse of this form". No other references are made to tie the two documents together.

 

so in your opinion are the t&c's containing all the prescribed terms?

[Capricorn1601]

, besides it's possible they have an original copy, .

 

They have said that they only have a microfiche version

[Capricorn1601]

Just a second thought. This is an application which was sent through the post for a replacement for a previous card. Would therefore the T&C's have been present on reverse in such a format. bearing in mind the bottom of the application form first page has a cut off section for DD details, if detatced would remove some of the T&C's surely if it was the correct reverse side this section would have been left blank?

[cerberusalert]

They have said that they only have a microfiche version

You could bring them to strict proof by asking for the original copy if it went to court, but it would be a case of the judge lottery as to whether a DJ would accept a microfilche copy or not.

This is an application which was sent through the post for a replacement for a previous card. Would therefore the T&C's have been present on reverse in such a format.

Well it does say 'Bank Copy' not Customer Copy.

[Capricorn1601]

:(Well it does say 'Bank Copy' not Customer Copy.

 

I would guess that there was only one copy therefore never a customer copy. Could this be right?

[Guest]

Unfortunately some DJs interperate barely legible as legible.

 

hi cymruambyth,

did they also send you a microfiche copy of an appn form with tc's allegedly on the 'reverse'? if so, were they headed with 'bank copy'?

thanks

[Capricorn1601]

Hi all

 

3 months have passed by and all has been quiet. Until today. Just got a letter from Robinsons Way demanding full payment within 10 days. I cant get to grips with the new site design and dont appear to be able to find anything out about this mob or how to handle it. Could anyone advise. I really cant afford to pay the money they are demanding nor am I in a position to offer anything. My husband has been unemployed now for 7 months, so money is tight.

[cymruambyth]

I've been playing letter ping pong for ages with LTSB, they send lots of work to Rob Way. After several months they farm it out to other DCAs.

 

My LTSB accounts have had no action but I've been taken to court by Rob Way and Cap1

[Guest]

Hi all

 

3 months have passed by and all has been quiet. Until today. Just got a letter from Robinsons Way demanding full payment within 10 days. I cant get to grips with the new site design and dont appear to be able to find anything out about this mob or how to handle it. Could anyone advise. I really cant afford to pay the money they are demanding nor am I in a position to offer anything. My husband has been unemployed now for 7 months, so money is tight.

 

hi capricorn

imo. assuming they are acting as agents to collect rather than being the new 'owner' - their initial letter is nothing to be worried about. they won't start legal action. you cld send them a 'dispute' letter including something similar to what you've said to loyds re agreement, or the standard 'dispute' letter to dca. in any case, include the 'trespass' bit and the 'communication in writing only'. mark it ftao the 'complaints & compliance manager'. this should stop any calls and any poss 'personal visit'. you'll prob get various template letters as it progresses through their 'automated' 'actions' system with them later offering a 'discount' to settle (maybe around 40% off). if no settlement or they give up, it will prob go back to loyds with their 'recommendation'. and then maybe to another dca for collection as cymruambyth says, or it may be sold, or they may start legal action!

Edited August 22, 2010 by Ford
typo

[Capricorn1601]

Thanks for that Ford. I will play it cool and send off the in dispute letter as you have recommended. I need to buy myself time to sort my financial mess out.

[Guest]

hi capricorn

imo. assuming they are acting as agents to collect rather than being the new 'owner' - their initial letter is usually a threat, they won't start legal action in 10 days. you could ignore it, or you could send them a 'dispute' letter similar to what you've done before, or the standard 'dispute' letter to dca. in any case, include the 'trespass'/no visit bit and the 'communication in writing only'. mark it ftao the 'complaints & compliance manager'. this should stop any calls and any poss 'personal visit'. you'll prob get the various template letters as it progresses through their 'automated' 'actions' system with them later prob offering a 'discount' to settle (maybe around 40% off). if no settlement with them or they give up, it will prob go back to loyds with their 'recommendation'. and then maybe to another dca for collection as cymruambyth says, or it may be sold, or they may start legal action!

 

edited

[Capricorn1601]

Hi all, in the end I sent them the prove it letter, I found it on someone elses thread.

 

All been quiet until today. Had a large envelope delivered with copies of some correspondance and statements and a letter basically saying "Further to your request for a copy statement in respect of the above account we now enclose that document for your immediate attention. We need to hear from you with your proposals for settlement of your account with is long overdue for

payment within 10 days.

 

How should I respond at this stage, if anything? Should I not respond or give them this account has been in dispute since May 2009 etc response? I want them to start negotiations, but dont want to admit anything upfront. I may soon be in a position to offer a F&F settlement but no more than 50% of the true debt ( this account did accumulate quite a bit of fees and interest whilst being in dispute for nearly a year and do not want to have to pay for that if you know what I mean). Please advise. Caps

[Guest]

hi

 

have they sent the template discount offer yet?

[Capricorn1601]

no, not yet, just a covering letter with the wording above, should I expect one shortly?

[Guest]

towards the 'end' of their 'activity' timeline, yes. imo.

[Capricorn1601]

Should I just sit tight then at this stage to see what their next move will be? Or remind them I put this account into dispute last year and have had not communication from LLoyds advising me of Robinsons capacity in this matter?

[Guest]

hi

 

if you sit tight and ignore, they'll prob continue with their automated 'collection activity' eg re template letters etc and it will hopefully end up with their template 'discount' offer.

if you send the 'dispute' letter they'll prob put things on 'hold' for a while, and maybe still/then carry on with their automated 'activity'.

but, they may decide to give up 'early' and pass it back to loyds with their recommendation as to next step.

re FandF offer, if you want to do this, you can do this at anytime. start low, and on your terms. make sure that it will be 'closed' once and for all so it is not pursued by anyone in the future.

IMO

Edited October 25, 2010 by Ford
typo