Invalid Default Notices

[frettful38]

You have to wait until they terminate. Do not mention it to them yet.

 

 

Thanks again vint1954, what if they have already terminated and I don''t have any knowledge of it. Maybe they sent me a termination letter and I cannot remember, and do not want to risk asking them for a copy.

 

So should I stay quiet about this?

[vint1954]

Thanks again vint1954, what if they have already terminated and I don''t have any knowledge of it. Maybe they sent me a termination letter and I cannot remember, and do not want to risk asking them for a copy.

 

So should I stay quiet about this?

Or an SAR

[vint1954]

DN Sept 08

 

TN Oct 08

 

No Payments since Feb 09

 

Well, one of the problems is that you behaved as though the agreement had endured, post termination, by continuing with payments. If it comes to it, and you are sure that you did not send the letter in Feb 09;-), you can argue that you received advice in Feb 09, regarding unlawful rescission, then stoped paying so proving your acceptance of the termination.

[diddydicky]

to make life easier caggers should note that a default notice that contains the following statement can NEVER be compliant, not even if it is hand delivered to the debtor

 

 

" The payment must reach your account within 14 days of the date of this notice"

 

or

 

Payment must be made within 14 days of the date of this notice

[frettful38]

to make life easier caggers should note that a default notice that contains the following statement can NEVER be compliant, not even if it is hand delivered to the debtor

 

 

" The payment must reach your account within 14 days of the date of this notice"

 

or

 

Payment must be made within 14 days of the date of this notice

 

Thanks diddydicky, if the DN is not compliant then one cannot be pursued for the debt?

[diddydicky]

Thanks diddydicky, if the DN is not compliant then one cannot be pursued for the debt?

 

if the DN is not effective then the creditor (theoretically - according to which numpty judge is involved) cannot claim entitlement to the benefits of s87 (termination or sums not yet due under the agreement being the two main benefits)

 

thus he has no cause of action.

 

what you need is for the creditor to terminate(or demand payment in full of the account balance) following the dodgy DN

 

THEN you have him by the short and curlies

[charlie*]

.... or even 17 days as with Tesco, Mint etcetera....

[diddydicky]

.... or even 17 days as with Tesco, Mint etcetera....

 

you cant guarantee that 17 days won't make it through the court

 

i take it you are referring to the fact that it is 17 days rather than a "date"?

 

in which case if this were the only issue it would not be something i would risk on a fast track

[avatari]

diddydicky, just so i understand...if you are CORRECTLY defaulted under s87, but the agreement not terminated despite there being no remedy within the time limit, can the creditor put a Default against you on the credit file, with an '8' number?

[frettful38]

if the DN is not effective then the creditor (theoretically - according to which numpty judge is involved) cannot claim entitlement to the benefits of s87 (termination or sums not yet due under the agreement being the two main benefits)

 

thus he has no cause of action.

 

what you need is for the creditor to terminate(or demand payment in full of the account balance) following the dodgy DN

 

THEN you have him by the short and curlies

 

 

Thanks diddydicky,

 

1. DN Dated 19th May 09 payment to be made by 2nd June 09

 

2. 30th June 09 Letter from HSBC demanding payment in full within 14 days.

 

3. 21st July 09 Letter from HSBC prepared to accept a reasonable offer and in return write off a proportion of debt.

 

4. 14th Sept 09 Letter from MCSL demanding payment in full within 7 days

 

5. 20th Nov 09 Letter from DG Solicitors demanding payment in full within 14 days.

 

I have searched high and low and cannot find any trace of a termination letter. I know HSBC have botched up my account big time. I will send a fresh SAR and demand to see what my account history is. There is something very very fishy going on here.

 

Is the above correct?

[vint1954]

Thanks diddydicky,

 

1. DN Dated 19th May 09 payment to be made by 2nd June 09

 

2. 30th June 09 Letter from HSBC demanding payment in full within 14 days.

 

3. 21st July 09 Letter from HSBC prepared to accept a reasonable offer and in return write off a proportion of debt.

 

4. 14th Sept 09 Letter from MCSL demanding payment in full within 7 days

 

5. 20th Nov 09 Letter from DG Solicitors demanding payment in full within 14 days.

 

I have searched high and low and cannot find any trace of a termination letter. I know HSBC have botched up my account big time. I will send a fresh SAR and demand to see what my account history is. There is something very very fishy going on here.

 

Is the above correct?

You need them to comply with your first SAR.

[diddydicky]

Thanks diddydicky,

 

1. DN Dated 19th May 09 payment to be made by 2nd June 09

 

2. 30th June 09 Letter from HSBC demanding payment in full within 14 days.

 

3. 21st July 09 Letter from HSBC prepared to accept a reasonable offer and in return write off a proportion of debt.

 

4. 14th Sept 09 Letter from MCSL demanding payment in full within 7 days

 

5. 20th Nov 09 Letter from DG Solicitors demanding payment in full within 14 days.

 

I have searched high and low and cannot find any trace of a termination letter. I know HSBC have botched up my account big time. I will send a fresh SAR and demand to see what my account history is. There is something very very fishy going on here.

 

Is the above correct?

 

the DN is effective as far as dates are concerned

 

the demand for payment in full on 30 june is an effective termination notice

[cosalt]

the DN is effective as far as dates are concerned

 

the demand for payment in full on 30 june is an effective termination notice

 

 

Are you sure that DN is correct ? 19 May - 2 June is only 14 days, no allowance for service.

 

Cosalt

[frettful38]

Are you sure that DN is correct ? 19 May - 2 June is only 14 days, no allowance for service.

 

Cosalt

 

Hi coalt, I don't think my DN is correct either, hope diddydicky could confirm that it is not effective as no time has been allowed for serving, don't you agree?

[cosalt]

Hi coalt, I don't think my DN is correct either, hope diddydicky could confirm that it is not effective as no time has been allowed for serving, don't you agree?

 

Agreed, they needed to leave 14 clear days after service.

[frettful38]

Agreed, they needed to leave 14 clear days after service.

 

Well we will see what diddydicky will say

[vint1954]

I think you will find that DD intended to say ineffective due to dates. They have allowed no time for service.

[frettful38]

I think you will find that DD intended to say ineffective due to dates. They have allowed no time for service.

 

 

Hopefully he should come along soon to clarify!

[Pinky69]

The DN is not effective as far as dates are concerned - far from it. If posted on 19 May second class, it would be deemed to have been received by you on 26th May as there is a weekend and Bank Holiday in between. Then is is 14 clear days to remedy the breach, which takes you to 9 June.

[frettful38]

The DN is not effective as far as dates are concerned - far from it. If posted on 19 May second class, it would be deemed to have been received by you on 26th May as there is a weekend and Bank Holiday in between. Then is is 14 clear days to remedy the breach, which takes you to 9 June.

 

 

Thanks pinky69 for clearing that up, something new I did not know about [bank holiday]. So is my DN invalid? If so should I inform the FOS as they are dealing with my complaint at present, should I bring this to their attention?

 

Thank you

[Pinky69]

Not unless it adds to whatever you have complained about. Unlawful rescission is of use if you want to argue that they can only claim any arrears on the terminated agreement or if you want to take get them to remove unlawful defaults made after the account was terminated.

[frettful38]

Not unless it adds to whatever you have complained about. Unlawful rescission is of use if you want to argue that they can only claim any arrears on the terminated agreement or if you want to take get them to remove unlawful defaults made after the account was terminated.

 

 

I think initially I complained that I had an unenforceable agreement as they did not send me a signed agreement to my cca request, but when they were contacted by the FOS they miraculously sent the FOS a copy of my signed cca agrreement, but my argument at present is that HSBC are stating that I opened up my cc account and current account on the same day......and I know for a fact that this is not true.

 

I believe HSBC have lifted my signature from my current account details and copied it on to my cc account form. The only way I can know 100% is if HSBC complied with my SAR request which was made over a year ago. I have sent another SAR with my sig and asked for them to comply within 14 days.

 

I need to know what date my cc account was open, the DN is just further ammunition against them in case I need in future.

 

I want to bring the whole picture infront of the FOS and inform them of how HSBC have been dealing with me and my requests, they have been beyond unreasonable and I am really am sick to mt teeth with all the unecessary paperwork and complaining backward and forward.

 

I am at a loss as to what steps to take next.

[diddydicky]

i humbly apologise with bum held in the air ready for a good kicking

 

dont know what the hell i was thinking about

 

 

ahh i know- i was just "testing" to see if you were looking

[diddydicky]

effective should of course have read defective and once the demand for full payment was made then that acts as a termination

 

(my grand daughter says i am an old duffer!!)

[Pinky69]

If they haven't responded to your SAR request from over a year ago, then it is the Information Commissioner you need to complain to. Send a copy of the letter showing when you made the request to the ICO and you will get their complaint form on their website - complaints have be made on that form.