Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • He was one of four former top executives from Sam Bankman-Fried's firms to plead guilty to charges.View the full article
    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

HBOS and OH's card debt


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 4103 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

Ok, so if I'm understanding this correctly, I could have a punt at claiming the lot as long as we weren't in court, and it may or may not work. If however it does go to court, anything above the 6 years would very likely be contested, but the charges within the last 6 years could at least go towards the balance (that is assuming the verdict didn't go in our favour).

 

But, if it went to court, did go in our favour, and the agreement was declared unenforceable, would that null any possibility of reclaiming afterwards?

 

What I really need to know though is should we even be considering claiming when we're going along the unenforceable route? I'm very confused with this whole area as there seems to be a different thought on it every time you look. Also, I've never made a charges claim before - it only occurred to me yesterday when I was flicking through OH's statements, so I have no idea what I'd be getting myself into if I did go ahead with charges!

 

As always, thanks for your help!

 

ps - cheers CB:)

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Replies 710
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Posted Images

hiya lexix hope you are okay still fighting this madness here

 

your post 69 has also struck a chord with me, ive been thinking the same actually, so interested to see others views

 

ive been following your threads with interest this week,

 

im off to update and start a few new ones req for cca's

 

catch up later take care and keep calm, remember the sign of a cluttered desk is the sign of a Genius!! lol

 

well thats what it says on my desk..hahahha

 

ciao for now to you and others you have been helping you MAZ

Im happy to help with support and my own thoughts, but if I offer any thoughts to your problems please take it as from my life experience only and not of any legal standing. Always take further advice from the legal experts in your final action.:)

 

my new motto is,,,",Taking back control of your life and home - such peace is priceless"

 

This is all due to truecall device , have a serious peek at this you will be thankful like I am x laters angel :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Lexis, my action plan would be.

 

Send X20's letter in post 58 and see what happens next.

 

I think your next step will be dictated by their response.

 

It wont do any harm to make up two spreadsheets one for charges for the life of the account to date and one for the 6 years. It will keep you out of mischief if nothing else:D

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Lexis,

The answer to your query in post no69 is whether you are defending by seeking to set off against the amount claimed a sum of money which is due to you, or whether you are counterclaiming for it. I won't go into the niceties of set offs right now, but it seems to me that a set off is available to you in this case since the charges and contra charges arise out of the one agreement.

 

Another way of looking at it is like this. Suppose a bloke I'd lent £100.00 to ten years ago sued me for £50.00 owing to him by me from three years back. I could theoretically defend the entire claim by saying the £50.00 I gained was in part satisfaction of the debt created ten years ago and I don't owe him a bean. On the other hand I could not counterclaim for £100.00 because my counterclaim would be met with a limitation defence.

 

Is the penny dropping?

 

In short, my suggestion is to employ all (ie from inception of the agreement) excessive charge arguments as a defence by way of set off. I wouldn't bother counterclaiming.

 

I hope this helps and is not getting overly complicated!

 

x20

Link to post
Share on other sites

Lexis,

The answer to your query in post no69 is whether you are defending by seeking to set off against the amount claimed a sum of money which is due to you, or whether you are counterclaiming for it. I won't go into the niceties of set offs right now, but it seems to me that a set off is available to you in this case since the charges and contra charges arise out of the one agreement. My brain hurts already!

Another way of looking at it is like this. Suppose a bloke I'd lent £100.00 to ten years ago sued me for £50.00 owing to him by me from three years back. I could theoretically defend the entire claim by saying the £50.00 I gained was in part satisfaction of the debt created ten years ago and I don't owe him a bean. On the other hand I could not counterclaim for £100.00 because my counterclaim would be met with a limitation defence. I think you're saying that if they took OH to court, we could say something along the lines of 'you've had 10 years of dodgy charges, we want them back, then you can consider going after the balance'. This would be used as a defence to put them off going ahead, or to limit the damage if they did??

If however we were to just dispute the charges as a normal claim, they'd be more able to dispute the earlier ones

Is the penny dropping? erm, you tell me - have I got it right this time?:):oops:

 

In short, my suggestion is to employ all (ie from inception of the agreement) excessive charge arguments as a defence by way of set off. I wouldn't bother counterclaiming. So don't bother going for charges unless they take OH to court and it's as a defence tactic?

 

I hope this helps and is not getting overly complicated! No no, if you whack me with information enough times it does eventually go in. Usually:D:D

 

x20

 

CB - I have done the OFT complaint letter - one regarding BOS and one for BlairOS (not sure if it should be just about one of them or both, seeing as they're both employing the same tactics and holding to the same lines). They're ready to go.

-I've sent off the form etc to the Information Commissioners Office about the state of the envelope and the visible contents.

-I've printed out yours/x20's letter and that's ready to go too.

 

Now I just need to do the FOS complaint about BOS since they've given their final response (that looks like an all nighter so I'm planning that for the weekend!), and the response to BOS so that they can't claim they didn't know what was going on.

 

I did the spreadsheets yesterday evening, that's what sparked my questions:D I wasn't in a letter drafting mood so I did a bit of brainless data input work instead;)

 

Now I need a cup of tea and a biccie - I made some shortbread yesterday and it's calling me...

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sounds like you have it all under control Lexis.. :D

 

The letter to the OFT, I think if you wanted to you could have incorporated the both in the one letter. I did. However, no problem doing one for each as they could also be 2 separate complaints. :D

 

Yes, the FOS letter will need time I think. If you follow RMW's format, I dont think you can go wrong.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ahh, well I didn't think of putting both in one letter did I:rolleyes:

 

I'll get that amended - at least it'll be one less postage cost to pay; that's fast becoming our major expense through the month. If I have to do another I/E form for anyone I think I'll include that on it:D

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ahh, well I didn't think of putting both in one letter did I:rolleyes:

 

I'll get that amended - at least it'll be one less postage cost to pay; that's fast becoming our major expense through the month. If I have to do another I/E form for anyone I think I'll include that on it:D

 

 

I do believe RMW included the costs of stationary, postage etc in her complaint to the FOS. Obviously you can only include those costs associated with the company you are complaining about. :D

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay

 

Quick update on this...

 

I sent the dispute letter in October, outlining the lack of prescribed terms, illegibility etc. They received this on the 10th Oct.

 

So far I've heard diddly squat from them - they haven't even updated the address, which they have been informed of twice now.

 

The thing is, so far OH has carried on with payments - should I get him to stop them to try and kick them up the bum a bit, or do I give them a chance and tell them if they don't reply, payments will be stopping on X date?

 

I think I should be making this a formal complaint to them now anyway as they haven't answered the account in dispute letter from a month ago, and haven't changed the address despite being told we do not live there any more.

 

Any ideas from anyone would be appreciated:)

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm a bit confused with my paperwork!

 

I sent a 'no cca received' letter to BlairOS on the 7th October stating all the usual bits about unenforceable unless one is produced etc.

 

On the 17th OH received the above form from BlairOS along with a compliments slip.

 

Around the 28th OH received a letter from Halifax stating they are 'sorry to learn of your dissatisfaction at our apparent failure to provide the documentation you requested under section 78 etc... Whilst we are in breach of your request we may not enforce the agreement, which means that we cannot take court action or force you to pay. We can continue actions that are not deemed as enforcement.' etc etc.

 

On the 30th I sent the above letter to BlairOS about the lack of t's and c's etc.

 

On the 7th November OH has another letter from Halifax saying they're still looking into the complaint, sorry it's taking so long, and we'll have an answer for you by the 4th December.

 

Any ideas what the hell is going on anyone?? I'm kind of getting the impression that it's a complete shambles in the Halifax/BOS court, and they have no idea what each other are doing. Is this likely to be the case, or can anyone read something else into the oddness of these timelines and responses?

 

Just to confuse them a little more I SAR'd them on the 6th, so that'll probably send them into some sort of meltdown:D

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello!

 

Still working on the FOS complaint - 'real' work and family stuff is getting in the way:(

 

I'm just being a bit cheeky too and posting a link to my BOS thread, and my Cap1 one, where I could do with a bit of advice....any takers?:)

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/halifax-bank-bank-scotland/160990-lexis200-bos-take-two.html

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/capital-one/164241-lexis200-capital-one-cca.html

 

Thanks:D

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just done a covering letter to BlairOS about the NIP - almost entirely ripped off from CB's earlier post, thanks:D (sent off the scary CPR one last week:eek:). Can anyone just give it a once-over before I print please?

 

Your letter dated 23rd October was received by me on the 30th October.

 

As both your company and the Bank of Scotland have failed to supply me with information requested under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, and have attempted to mislead me into believing it complies with your obligations under the Act, this has left me with no option but to make a formal complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

Your letter will be passed to the FOS to aid their investigation.

 

Please also find enclosed a copy of a letter I have today sent to the Office of Fair Trading regarding your conduct. The letter is self explanatory.

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

hiya lexis am following your threads and wow you have come such a long way

 

im on the fos cases myself this morning,

 

with this one of yours, i would make a formal complaint then you do have a paper trail as such, and also they Have to send you a final letter or refer you to fos, i would also request a copy of their Complaints proceedure too, within your letter - you then can see what they are obliged to do and timescales on the complaint being handled in line with the FSA rules,

 

** just another thought, perhaps a complaint to the information commissioner office too, as they are holding inaccurate data on you and this could lead to legal paperwork that may be sent not reaching you and this could cause you embarrasment or legal problems, as they still have not amended your address correctly***

 

hope that is of some assistance, sure other s more experienced will soon come along

 

will pm you later today ciao for now MAZ

Edited by maz1964
to add bit about info comm office
  • Haha 1

Im happy to help with support and my own thoughts, but if I offer any thoughts to your problems please take it as from my life experience only and not of any legal standing. Always take further advice from the legal experts in your final action.:)

 

my new motto is,,,",Taking back control of your life and home - such peace is priceless"

 

This is all due to truecall device , have a serious peek at this you will be thankful like I am x laters angel :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

I would have stopped paying the minute they sent the rubbish in your first post. However, this has to be your choice. I have noticed that stopping payment does tend to get them to focus their mind on the problem;)

 

Yes, definitely make a formal complaint. Head any correspondence to them ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE - FORMAL COMPLAINT. If you are going to stop payments, do it immediately and advise them in your letter that until the dispute and all the points you raise are sorted to YOUR satisfaction then no further payments will be made. Advising them you are going to stop payments at a future date is IMHO not a good idea.

 

PS. You can also request that if it is their intention not to investigate, fully, your complaints then would they advise their final response at the earliest opportunity in order for you to escalate your complaint to the FOS.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice one Lexis, good to go IMHO :-D

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Lovely, thanks CB.

 

I have another one for you now:D This is just to hbos as a general gripe - not for any response, but so it's in black and white what my issues are.

 

Then I really have to do some work!

 

Thank you for your letter dated 30th October, received by me on the 31st October.

 

I am responding to your letter only as a courtesy to let you know how I will be proceeding, as the response you have offered is far from satisfactory.

 

First, with regards to my details arriving in a poor condition. The envelope may have left your offices in reasonable condition, however, it could well be expected that if you send a standard paper envelope through the postal system, when it has been tightly packed with documents, that it will suffer due to that. Your company should employ a stronger container when you are sending personal and financial information. To assert that Post Office staff must sign the Official Secrets Act is nonsense, as my concern is not that they would talk about it to friends and family, but that it can be used to find out a significant amount of information about me. I am positive that you would not be happy to leave similar documents with your information on in full view in the Post Office, regardless of staff signing the Official Secrets Act or not.

 

This lack of security and your consequent disregard of my concerns have been passed on to the Information Commissioners Office.

 

Secondly, with regards to the ‘agreement’. You assert that an illegible document, with no visible prescribed terms on it, and with a set of current terms and conditions, complies with your requirements under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (the Act). This is simply not true, and your comment about this being ‘clearly explained’ in a previous letter is at best atrociously patronising, and at worst intended to mislead me into believing the document you have sent fulfils the remit set by the Act.

 

You also wrote that I have stated the copy was illegible, and you can send out another. This would obviously be a pointless exercise, as to date you have sent me three copies of the same illegible application form. I highly doubt sending it again will suddenly cause it to be legible and compliant.

 

The lack of a compliant agreement, your attempts to mislead me, and your handling of my concerns in general is being escalated into a complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

The third point I must raise regards my details held with Blair Oliver and Scott. The lack of a compliant agreement prohibits the passing of my details to any third party. Without a signed, legible agreement, complete with all prescribed terms and details of Data Protection, you do not have now, nor have you ever had my permission to pass on my details. I therefore reiterate that my details must be removed from their system. Is there any Act etc I can quote here?

 

You also state the account is not in dispute. The lack of a compliant credit agreement is a very clear dispute, and as such you may not enforce the debt, nor am I obliged to offer you any payment until the matter is resolved.

 

If this is not a clear enough dispute, then you will be aware that my complaint to the FOS also puts the account into dispute. Either way, you may not add charges or interest to the account, or place any markers regarding the account with any Credit Reference Agencies. Can I also put something along the lines of ‘similarly, any markers already placed should be removed, as you have not ever had the right to place them’?

 

I am aware your last response was the Bank of Scotland’s final decision, so I will reiterate that this letter is merely a courtesy.

 

I would though also like to make mention of the many grammatical and punctuation errors contained within your response. This in itself suggests a lack of interest in my case, as you do not appear to even take the time to proof-read your letters before sending them out. It also does not help at all with my current view of your company in general. As a professional company these sorts of mistakes should not occur.

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay, just told OH to stop the payments. And I'll consider my wrist slapped:)

 

The only reason I didn't was cold feet - I completely copped out:oops:

 

I'll get another complaint out to them and merge what the two of you have suggested in it, then I expect go down the same route as with the other one you've been helping on! At least I'll have some letters ready done for them:)

 

Cheers

 

Lexis:)

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Seeing as my cheekiness with my other posts worked so well, I thought I'd drop in my newest - my own personal bugbear, the co-op...

 

If you're not too busy, I'd be very glad of a more experienced opinion than mine from anyone:D

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/cooperative-bank/168075-lexis200-co-op-cca.html

 

Lexis:)

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Lovely, thanks CB.

 

I have another one for you now:D This is just to hbos as a general gripe - not for any response, but so it's in black and white what my issues are.

 

Then I really have to do some work!

 

Thank you for your letter dated 30th October, received by me on the 31st October.

 

I am responding to your letter only as a courtesy to let you know how I will be proceeding, as the response you have offered is far from satisfactory.

 

First, with regards to my details arriving in a poor condition. The envelope may have left your offices in reasonable condition, however, it could well be expected that if you send a standard paper envelope through the postal system, when it has been tightly packed with documents, that it will suffer due to that. Your company should employ a stronger container when you are sending personal and financial information. To assert that Post Office staff must sign the Official Secrets Act is nonsense, as my concern is not that they would talk about it to friends and family, but that it can be used to find out a significant amount of information about me. I am positive that you would not be happy to leave similar documents with your information on in full view in the Post Office, regardless of staff signing the Official Secrets Act or not.

 

This lack of security and your consequent disregard of my concerns have been passed on to the Information Commissioners Office.

 

Secondly, with regards to the ‘agreement’. You assert that an illegible document, with no visible prescribed terms on it, and with a set of current terms and conditions, complies with your requirements under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (the Act). This is simply not true, and your comment about this being ‘clearly explained’ in a previous letter is at best atrociously patronising, and at worst intended to mislead me into believing the document you have sent fulfils the remit set by the Act.

 

You also wrote that I have stated the copy was illegible, and you can send out another. This would obviously be a pointless exercise, as to date you have sent me three copies of the same illegible application form. I highly doubt sending it again will suddenly cause it to be legible and compliant.

 

The lack of a compliant agreement, your attempts to mislead me, and your handling of my concerns in general is being escalated into a complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

The third point I must raise regards my details held with Blair Oliver and Scott. The lack of a compliant agreement prohibits the passing of my details to any third party. Without a signed, legible agreement, complete with all prescribed terms and details of Data Protection, you do not have now, nor have you ever had my permission to pass on my details. I therefore reiterate that my details must be removed from their system. Is there any Act etc I can quote here? I think it is S10, Lexis. I will get the correct information and put it here later on.

 

You also state the account is not in dispute. The lack of a compliant credit agreement is a very clear dispute, and as such you may not enforce the debt, nor am I obliged to offer you any payment until the matter is resolved.

 

** If this is not a clear enough dispute, then you will be aware that my complaint to the FOS also puts the account into dispute. Either way, you may not add charges or interest to the account, or place any markers regarding the account with any Credit Reference Agencies. Can I also put something along the lines of ‘similarly, any markers already placed should be removed, as you have not ever had the right to place them’? ** I wonder if this would be better moved up a bit to where you mention Data Protection Act regarding Blair Oliver ?. It, is I think part of the same issue.

 

I am aware your last response was the Bank of Scotland’s final decision, so I will reiterate that this letter is merely a courtesy.

 

I would though also like to make mention of the many grammatical and punctuation errors contained within your response. This in itself suggests a lack of interest in my case, as you do not appear to even take the time to proof-read your letters before sending them out. It also does not help at all with my current view of your company in general. As a professional company these sorts of mistakes should not occur.

 

:grin: I love the last paragraph.. nice one BRB with the information re data protection.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Lexis, I hijacked this from another thread.. hope this helps. :D

Data Protection Act

 

You have previously been given notice under Section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect.

 

Would you kindly confirm that you have complied with my earlier request (letter dated 2 June 200:cool: to remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with the credit reference agencies and that the default notice you have placed on my credit file, together with the adverse markers, have been removed.

 

If you refuse to comply, then I will commence proceedings against you under ss13 and 14 of the Data Protection Act 1998. I shall also be claiming damages for adverse credit processing and defamation of character as the Co-operative Bank plc are in breach of the Fraud Act 2006.

 

Love and kisses

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

It is a difficult decision to make whether or not to stop payments, Lexis.. so you didnt cop out really. :)

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Okie dokie

 

Everything barring the FOS complaint is done and ready to go. Hopefully I'll have time to get it done this weekend, but the way things are shaping up at home it may have to wait a bit longer.

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

This is going out tomorrow (today actually!) if you lot give it the green light!

 

It's really just a covering letter as I'm copying them the one I sent last month, so I don't want to be bothered writing the same things out again.

 

Lexis

 

FORMAL COMPLAINT

ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE

 

I wrote to you on the 7th October, and my letter was signed for at your offices on the 10th October. To date I have not had the courtesy of a reply regarding the illegible document you sent as a response to my legal request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (the Act).

 

The document you sent does not in any way satisfy your requirements under section 78 of the Act, and as such you still remain in default of my request, and the account remains unenforceable. I have enclosed my previous letter for your convenience, as it explains fully my reasons for coming to this conclusion.

 

I also asked you to confirm your statement ‘Please note that the information we have provided you with is all the information we are able to provide you with Under Section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act’. Again, I ask that you confirm you do not hold a compliant signed agreement relating to this account.

 

I also informed you that the address you hold is incorrect, and you should now be using the one above. You are still sending statements to the old address. This is unacceptable.

 

I must advise you now that until this dispute is settled to my satisfaction, no further payments will be made to this account. I am within my rights to withhold payments whilst the account remains unenforceable and you remain in default of your duties under the Act.

 

I would ask that if it is not your intention to fully investigate my complaints, that you advise me of your final response at the earliest opportunity in order for me to escalate my complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

Also, please ensure you enclose a copy of your standard complaints procedure so that I am aware of the timescales afforded to you.

I look forward to your prompt reply.

 

:)

Edited by lexis200
forgot to paste letter:)

Time flies like an arrow...

Fruit flies like a banana.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...