Just been dismissed - what to do now???

[silver_griffin]

Hi everyone,

 

I have stumbled across this forum while researching employment law. I am hoping someone can give me a bit of advice.

 

I was dismissed from my job on Thursday during my probationary review (which took place 2 days after my three month probationary period had ended) I was told the reason for this was that I had not met my January targets and the manager said he did not think that I would be able to cope with the pressure of trying to meet my future targets if he extended my probation.

 

Due to the nature of my business it takes a three month period for things to get up and running and as discussed at my interview and at my review in December, I was not to worry about hitting targets for the first few months of my employment.

 

I have already met targets for March and April as he is well aware and I still have weeks to go til then so no doubt I would have exceeded my targets.

 

I have had no warning that there was any problem with any aspect of my work and at my review in December all was well, I scored 8/10 in the companys measurement.

 

I have since December had problems with this particular manager, in that he has made my life very difficult and I have had to seek advice from HR so I think this is the real reason for my dismissal.

 

Does anyone have any advice on where I stand and what I should do now?

 

 

 

Any advice greatly appreciated.

 

Kind regards,

 

Teresa

[Ell-enn]

Hi there, I'm sorry to hear you find yourself in this situation.

 

Unfortunately, as you have been employed for less than 12 months, you cannot claim unfair dismissal unless the following applies:

 

Even if you don't have 12 months service, it will be automatically unfair if they sack you because, for example, you:

• exercise your statutory rights, like the right to written particulars of your terms and conditions
  
• are pregnant
  
• take/ask to take statutory maternity, paternity or adoption leave
  
• are or intend to be a trade union member, or refuse to join a union
  
• exercise your rights under the National Minimum Wage Act
  
• complain about a health and safety problem
  
• report wrongdoing at work ('whistleblowing')
  
• exercise your rights in connection with a statutory grievance or disciplinary procedure
  
• take part in official industrial action that lasts less than 12 weeks
  
• take time off for jury service
  
• ask to work flexibly if you've a right to do so
  
• exercise your rights under the Working Time Regulations

 

If none of the above are relevant then the only avenue open to you would be wrongful dismissal but that is only if there has been a breach of contract i.e. if they have not complied with the notice period specified in your contract.

 

You could also write to the employer asking them to reconsider, but you need to think carefully if you really want to continue working for a company who treated you in this way. However, if they did reconsider at least it would give you breathing space to find alternative employment.

 

Please let us know if you need any further information.

 

Kind Regards

 

Ell-enn

[silver_griffin]

Thanks for your prompt reply Ell-enn it is very much appreciated.

 

I wonder if my reporting my manager to HR would be considered as whistleblowing?

 

Also, from info I have picked up from ACAS website, the three-step discipline and dismissal procedure was not followed by the company. Were they required to adhere to this?

 

Teresa

[Ell-enn]

The three step procedure applies only to employees with more than 12 months service I'm afraid.

 

With regards to reporting your manager - that would depend on what you were reporting them for. Whistleblowing is a serious matter and is usually known as malpractice within businesses.

 

The types of malpractice the law covers are:

• criminal offences
  
• failure to comply with a legal obligation
  
• miscarriages of justice
  
• threats to people's health and safety
  
• damage to the environment

 

The law also covers a deliberate attempt to cover up any of these.

 

Kind Regards

 

 

 

Ell-enn

[silver_griffin]

Once again, thanks you for your reply, it seems as if I dont have a leg to stand on. I have nearly £5000 commission owing to me that I will now not be paid for as the company rules state I must follow all of my sales right through to the end, however I am not going to be able to do this now through no choice of my own. Do you think there is anything I would be able to do regarding that?

 

Many thanks,

 

Teresa

[Ell-enn]

Hi Teresa, I'm really sorry to say I don't think there is anything at all you can do. It really pains me to give you such disappointing information. I wouldn't be surprised if that company make a habit of dismissing employees who have less than 12 months service to avoid paying their commission - a despicable practice, but not uncommon unfortunately.

 

As I said earlier the only thing you could think about is to write and ask them to reconsider their decision. By the way, did they give you the correct notice as per your contract?

 

I hope you soon find an employer who values you.

 

Kind Regards

 

El-enn

[silver_griffin]

Yes you are right El-enn, they have done it to eight employees in the past four months. They are even trying to do it to my friend who is 5 months pregnant. They will be well aware that they cannot dismiss a pregnant woman so they are making her life so difficult at work, probably trying to push her into resigning.

 

Anyway thanks for taking the time to offer me your advice.

 

Scales tipped!

 

Teresa x

[advisee]

Once again, thanks you for your reply, it seems as if I dont have a leg to stand on. I have nearly £5000 commission owing to me that I will now not be paid for as the company rules state I must follow all of my sales right through to the end, however I am not going to be able to do this now through no choice of my own. Do you think there is anything I would be able to do regarding that?

 

Many thanks,

 

Teresa

 

Maybe not.... depending on the exact wording of the commission clause, it may be that you can (in fact) show a contractual entitlement to this commission.

 

Have you been paid your notice (whatever is stipulated in your contract for someone having 3 (and a bit) months service) or do you expect to receive this in February?

[djgordyp]

Yes you are right El-enn, they have done it to eight employees in the past four months. They are even trying to do it to my friend who is 5 months pregnant. They will be well aware that they cannot dismiss a pregnant woman so they are making her life so difficult at work, probably trying to push her into resigning.

 

Anyway thanks for taking the time to offer me your advice.

 

Scales tipped!

 

Teresa x

I'm not 100% sure about this but, from what I've been reading on other threads, if your friend is pushed into resigning then this could be seen as constructive dismissal.

Hopefully someone will be able to confirm or deny this

 

Good luck.

[Ell-enn]

Maybe not.... depending on the exact wording of the commission clause, it may be that you can (in fact) show a contractual entitlement to this commission.

 

I have nearly £5000 commission owing to me that I will now not be paid for as the company rules state I must follow all of my sales right through to the end

 

The OP has stated the rules for qualifying.

[Weird Al Yankovic]

Hi everyone,

 

I have stumbled across this forum while researching employment law. I am hoping someone can give me a bit of advice.

 

I was dismissed from my job on Thursday during my probationary review (which took place 2 days after my three month probationary period had ended) I was told the reason for this was that I had not met my January targets and the manager said he did not think that I would be able to cope with the pressure of trying to meet my future targets if he extended my probation.

 

Due to the nature of my business it takes a three month period for things to get up and running and as discussed at my interview and at my review in December, I was not to worry about hitting targets for the first few months of my employment.

 

I have already met targets for March and April as he is well aware and I still have weeks to go til then so no doubt I would have exceeded my targets.

 

I have had no warning that there was any problem with any aspect of my work and at my review in December all was well, I scored 8/10 in the companys measurement.

 

I have since December had problems with this particular manager, in that he has made my life very difficult and I have had to seek advice from HR so I think this is the real reason for my dismissal.

 

Does anyone have any advice on where I stand and what I should do now?

 

 

 

Any advice greatly appreciated.

 

Kind regards,

 

Teresa

 

It appears you did not receive a weeks notice of dismissal.

 

Also, probationary periods mean nothing in UK employment law.

 

Your employers seemed to have been happy with your work up until December and you say you have already met targets for future months already. And you state that at interview & reviews you were told that hitting targets wasn't an absolute for the first few months.

 

Capability doesn't seem to have been an issue at any time, in fact, quite the opposite. Obviously no opportunity was given to put things right as nothing appears to have been wrong.

 

Can you please provide detail of any written contract you may have that mentions dismissal?

 

If you were not given a written contract can you please provide detail of what your Employment Terms state about dismissal?

 

Also, is it possible there may be an underlying reason for your dismissal as capability appears not to be the issue?

[Weird Al Yankovic]

Yes you are right El-enn, they have done it to eight employees in the past four months. They are even trying to do it to my friend who is 5 months pregnant. They will be well aware that they cannot dismiss a pregnant woman so they are making her life so difficult at work, probably trying to push her into resigning.

 

Anyway thanks for taking the time to offer me your advice.

 

Scales tipped!

 

Teresa x

 

Can you contact these 8 ex-employees?

 

You also say that they are trying to do it (dismiss) your friend who is pregnant. Can you explain a bit clearer please?

 

As in what are the employers doing to her for you to think/know this?

 

(Btw, a pregnant woman can be sacked. Depending on the reason of course.)

[Zamzara]

The OP has stated the rules for qualifying.

 

But she needs to check that the rules are actually in the contract, and have not just been made up retrospectively.

[advisee]

Plus the fact that she is being prevented from completing the sales...

 

It could well be worth a wrongful dismissal claim... look up the case of Takacs v Barclays, it may help you.

[Weird Al Yankovic]

Once again, thanks you for your reply, it seems as if I dont have a leg to stand on. I have nearly £5000 commission owing to me that I will now not be paid for as the company rules state I must follow all of my sales right through to the end, however I am not going to be able to do this now through no choice of my own. Do you think there is anything I would be able to do regarding that?

 

Many thanks,

 

Teresa

 

Hello again, I missed this point.

 

Did commission form part of your salary?

 

Can you please work out your effective hourly rate of pay with the reference period being your employment start and end date? (Obviously do not include this £5k)

 

Also, it is possible that 'unfair contract terms' apply to employment contracts and this appears to be the case. You have earnt money, you have been dismissed without notice and you will not be paid monies for no obvious fault of your own.

 

It's scandlous.

 

From what you have posted you do seem to have a case for wrongful dismissal & breach of contract, dismissal without notice and a possible award being increased by up to 50% due to your ex-employer's failure to follow statutory procedures.

 

Other complaints could well be made depending on what your replies will be to other questions posed.

 

Good luck.

[silver_griffin]

WOW! Thank you for all your replys, much appreciated! I havent been on here for a while as have been pre occupied with starting a new job. I wrote a letter to my ex employers last month stating a formal grievance regarding my dismissal and my commission. I have received a reply yesterday saying I have to choose whether to meet with them to discuss my grievance or to follow the modified procedure where they will just reply in writing. I am unsure what to do just now. I am going to look into some of the advice above and will update shortly.

 

Many thanks,

 

Teresa

[silver_griffin]

Maybe not.... depending on the exact wording of the commission clause, it may be that you can (in fact) show a contractual entitlement to this commission.

 

Have you been paid your notice (whatever is stipulated in your contract for someone having 3 (and a bit) months service) or do you expect to receive this in February?

 

I was paid £60 into my bank account at the end of February. I was due 1 weeks wage in lieu of notice, (yearly salary £15,000) also £200 commission (from Januarys sales) I have never recieved my wage slip so I dont know how they arrived at the £60 figure.

 

Teresa

[silver_griffin]

Maybe not.... depending on the exact wording of the commission clause, it may be that you can (in fact) show a contractual entitlement to this commission.

 

Have you been paid your notice (whatever is stipulated in your contract for someone having 3 (and a bit) months service) or do you expect to receive this in February?

 

 

From my Offer of Employment and Contract:

 

You are entitled to participate in relevant incentive, bonus and commission schemes applicable to your role. There is no guaranteed level of earnings from these schemes and the company reserves the right to amend the schemes from time to time. The company will give 30 days notice of any changes to the scheme. In the event of an absence over four weeks (except OML) the company reserves the right to withdraw ant bonus payment.

 

 

From my employee handbook - Terms and Conditions of Employment:

 

Bonus and Commission

 

In some departments, an Incentive, commision and bonus schemes may apply. Details of such schemes are sent to you along with your offer letter or can be obtained from your line manager. There is not a guaranteed level of earnings from these schemes and the company reserves the right to amend these schemes from time to time. The company will give 30 days notice of any changes to the scheme.

 

To qualify for commission, each sale must be completed, delivered to the customer and paid for.

 

The company reserves to with hold bonus payment or commission payment if there has been any absence during the month in which the bonus is being paid.

 

You should understand that to be entitled to bonus or commission for any period you must be employed by the company on the final day of that period . It is not group policy to pro rata such payments if any colleague is not employed by the company on the final working day of that period prior to the entitlement date.

[silver_griffin]

It appears you did not receive a weeks notice of dismissal.

 

Also, probationary periods mean nothing in UK employment law.

 

Your employers seemed to have been happy with your work up until December and you say you have already met targets for future months already. And you state that at interview & reviews you were told that hitting targets wasn't an absolute for the first few months.

 

Capability doesn't seem to have been an issue at any time, in fact, quite the opposite. Obviously no opportunity was given to put things right as nothing appears to have been wrong.

 

Can you please provide detail of any written contract you may have that mentions dismissal?

 

If you were not given a written contract can you please provide detail of what your Employment Terms state about dismissal?

 

Also, is it possible there may be an underlying reason for your dismissal as capability appears not to be the issue?

 

 

 

With reference to your last comment yes in my opinion there was an underlying reason for my dismissal, a combination of the fact that I was treated badly by my line manager (which was reported to HR director on two separate occassions) and also another very good, experienced salesman had handed in his notice and as the company wanted to keep him they asked what they could that would make him stay and he said my job! I dealt with specialised sales and therefor had fewer hours and higher earnings than the other sales people.

 

There doesnt seem to be anything specifically about dismissal in my contract, just disciplinary and grievance procedures.

 

However it does have a clause regarding the probationary period.

 

Teresa

[advisee]

From my Offer of Employment and Contract:

 

You are entitled to participate in relevant incentive, bonus and commission schemes applicable to your role. There is no guaranteed level of earnings from these schemes and the company reserves the right to amend the schemes from time to time. The company will give 30 days notice of any changes to the scheme. In the event of an absence over four weeks (except OML) the company reserves the right to withdraw ant bonus payment.

 

 

From my employee handbook - Terms and Conditions of Employment:

 

Bonus and Commission

 

In some departments, an Incentive, commision and bonus schemes may apply. Details of such schemes are sent to you along with your offer letter or can be obtained from your line manager. There is not a guaranteed level of earnings from these schemes and the company reserves the right to amend these schemes from time to time. The company will give 30 days notice of any changes to the scheme.

 

To qualify for commission, each sale must be completed, delivered to the customer and paid for.

 

The company reserves to with hold bonus payment or commission payment if there has been any absence during the month in which the bonus is being paid.

 

You should understand that to be entitled to bonus or commission for any period you must be employed by the company on the final day of that period . It is not group policy to pro rata such payments if any colleague is not employed by the company on the final working day of that period prior to the entitlement date.

 

My advice is to try and claim this amount. Hopefully they'll offer you part of it as a settlement.

 

I can't remember the reference, but I think there was a Court of Appeal case about bonuses.... anyone else?