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    • If anybody has any advice here, it would be greatly appreciated, I already suffer with pre-existing disabilities & have struggled with this so far. 
    • so return of goods order etc etc read upload  scan pages to jpg, redact in mspaint. the convert to and merge to one mass PDF  read upload and use the online listed sites for all 3 stages. do you want to keep the car? i will guess this was a manual paper claimform direct from the co.court or was it org sent from salford bulk processing and has just got reaq ssigned?      
    • Speaking of the reformatory boys, here they are with all of their supporters, some of whom traveled with them from miles away, all carefully crammed together and photographed to look like there were more than about 80 .. rather like Farages last rally with even fewer people crammed around what looked like an ice cream van or mobile tea bar ... Although a number in the crowd apparently thought they were at a vintage car rally as they appeared to be chanting 'crank-her'. A vintage Bentley must be out of view.   Is this all there is? Its less than the Tory candidate. - shut up and smile while they get a camera angle that looks better
    • in order for us to help you we require the following information:- Which Court have you received the claim from ? Canterbury Name of the Claimant ? Moneybarn No 1   How many defendant's  joint or self ? One Date of issue –  29/05/24 Acknowledged by 14/06/24  Defence by 29/06/24  Particulars of Claim PARTICULARS OF CLAIM 1.  By a Conditional Sale Agreement in writing made on 25th August 2022. Between the Claimant and Defendant, the Claimant let to the Defendant on Conditional Sale. A Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi (200 P S) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200cc (Sep.2015) Registration No, ******* Chassis number ***************** (“The Vehicle”).  A copy of the agreement is attached  2.  The price of the goods was £15,995.00. The Initial Rental was £8500.00.  The total charge for credit was £3575.;17 And the balance of £11,070.17 was payable by 59 equal consecutive monthly instalments of £187 63. payable on the 25th of each month. 3.  The following were expressed conditions of the set agreement, Clause 8: Our Right to End this Agreement  8.1   Subject to sending you the notice as required by law, any of the following events will entitle us to end this Agreement: 8.1.2  You fail to pay the advance payment (if any) or any of the payments as specified on the front page of this agreement or any other sum payable under this Agreement. 8.1.3 If any of the information you have given us before entering into this Agreement or during the term of this Agreement was false 8.1.4 We consider, acting reasonably, that the goods may be in jeopardy or that our rights in the goods may otherwise be prejudiced. 8.1.5 If you die 8.1.6 If a bankruptcy petition is presented against you; if you petition for your own bankruptcy, or make a live arrangement with your creditors or call a meeting of them. 8. 1.7 If in Scotland, you become insolvent or sequestration or a receiver, judicial factor or trustee to be appointed over any of your estate, or effects or suffer an arrestment, charge attachment or other diligence to be issued or levied on any of your estate or effects or suffer any exercise, or threatened exercise of landlords hype hypothec 8.1.8 If you are a partnership, you are dissolved 8.1.9 If the goods are destroyed, lost, stolen and/or treated by the insurer as a total loss in response to an insurance claim. 8.1.10 If we reasonably believe any payment made to us in respect of this Agreement is a proceed of crime. 8.1.11 If steps are taken by us to terminate any other agreement which you have entered into with us. Clause 9.  Effect of Us Terminating Agreement 9.1 If this Agreement terminates under clause 8 the following will apply 9.1.1 Subject to the rights given to you by law, you will no longer be entitled to possession of the goods and must return them to us to an address as we may reasonably specify, (removing or commencing the removal of any cherished plates) together with a V5 registration certificate, both sets of keys and a service record book. If you are unable or unwilling to return the goods to us then we shall collect the goods and we'll charge you in accordance with clause 10.3 9.1.2 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you for all payments and all other sums do under this agreement at the date of termination 9.1.3 We will sell the goods or public sale at the earliest opportunity once the goods are in a reasonable condition which includes a return of the items listed in clause 7.1.4 9.1.4 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you of the rest of the Total Amount Payable under this agreement less: ( a) A rebate for early settlement ias required by law which will be calculated and notified to you at the time of payment (b) The proceeds of sale of the goods (if any) after deduction of all costs associated with finding you and/or the goods, recovery, refurbishment and repair. Insurance, storage, sale, agents fees, cherished plate removal, replacement keys, costs associated with obtaining service history for the goods and in relation to obtaining a duplicate V5 registration certificate 4, The following are particulars required by Civil Procedure Rules. Rule 7.9 as set out in 7.1 and 7.2 of the associated Practice Direction entitled Hire Purchase Claims:- a)     The agreement is dated 25 August 2022. And is between Moneybarn No1 Limited  and xxxxxxxxx under agreement  number xxxxxx. b)    The claimant was one of the original parties to the agreement. c)    The agreement is regulated under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. d)    The goods claimed Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi ( 200 PS) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200 cc (Sep2015} Registration No ^^^^^^^ Chassis number ***************** e)     The total price of the goods £19570 f)     The paid up sum £1206 5 g)    The unpaid balance of the total price £7505 (to include charges) h)    A default notice was sent to the defendant on 20th February 2024 by First class post i)      The date when the right to demand delivery of the goods accrued 14 March 2024 j)      The amount if any claimed as an alternative to delivery of the goods 7505 22 include charges 5.  At the date of service of the notice the instalments were £562.89 in arrears. 6. By reason of the Termination of the Agreement by the notice, defendant became liable to pay the sum of £7502 7. The date of maturity the agreement is 24th August 2027. 8. Further or alternative by reasons of  the Defendant breaches of the agreement by failing to pay the said instalments, the Defendant evinced an intention no longer to be bound by the Agreement and repudiated it by the said Notice the claimant accepted that repudiation 9. By reason of such repudiation the claimant has suffered loss and damage. Total amount payable £19570 Less sum paid or in arrears by the date of repudiation £12064 97 Balance £7505 (to include charges.) ( The claimant will give credit if necessary for the value of the vehicle if recovered.)  The claimant therefore claims 1.    An order for delivery up of the vehicle 2.    The MoneyClaim to be adjourned generally with liberty to restore,  Upon restoration of the MoneyClaim following return or loss of the vehicle. the Claimant will ensure the pre action protocol for debt claims is followed. 3.    Pursuant to s 90 (1)  of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. An order that the Claimant and/or its agents may enter any premises in which the vehicle is situated in order to recover the vehicle should it not be returned by the Defendant 4.    further or alternatively damages 5.    costs Statement of truth The Claimant believes that the facts stated in these Particulars of Claim are true. The Claimant understands that the proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes or causes to be made a false statement in the document for verified by statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. I am duly Authorised by the Claimant to sign these Particulars of Claim signed Dated 17th of April 2024  What is the total value of the claim? 7502   Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? No   Never heard of this   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? n/a Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? No   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? After  Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? In a garage  Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes  Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Original Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? n/a   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? They said sent but nor received   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? None seen   Why did you cease payments? Still Paying,   What was the date of your last payment? Yesterday  31st May 2024   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? Yes on 12 Feb 2024   What you need to do now.   Can't scan, will do via another means as you cant have jpg  
    • Now that is an interesting article which adds afew perspective that I hadn't thought significant - but on reflection of the perspectives offered ... Now Starmer is no Blair, however 'blairite he may be perceived, but the Tories aren't tories and aren't even remotely liberal   The fast 'unannounced and unexpected election call from sunack may well be explained by the opinion linked that he hoped reform would be unprepared and effectively call a chunk of Farages largely empty bluster - making him look even more of a prat, leave scope for attacks on shabby reform candidates and mimimise core vote losses to reform - while throwing the 'middle ground' (relative) tories TO THE DOGS - and with the added bonus of likely pacifying his missu' desire to jogg off to sunny cal tout suite somewhat   thumb in the air - I expect about 140ish tory seats, but can hope for under a hundred Reform - got to admit the outside possibility of 1, maybe 2 seats with about 8% of the vote - but unlikely. I think projections of over 10% of the vote for reform is nudged and paid for speculation - but possible with the expected massive drives from Russian, Chinese and far right social media bot and troll prods targeting the gullible.
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      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Filled Defence - No stay......


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Carry on as normal, they might have halted the claims, they havent stopped the courts though..business as usual.

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Thanks :)

 

I had already sent the letter, but being stupid, forgot to include the £10 cheque!

 

They sent a letter back asking for it and I had to restart my claim.

 

I have been looking but it looks like the links have changed on the homepage, can anyone tell me the page which shows the letter to send plus the A + L address to send it to?

 

Thanks again, I have quite a lot in charges to get back.

 

John

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Hi,

 

I sent in my claim application was served on 2nd August and I have already received a notice of defence from Wragg and Co. I was expecting them to postpone the case until the test case has completed..... Is this to be expected?

 

Robbednomore

 

XX

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Just continue as normal. You'll be notified by your local court if there's to be stay. It does tend to vary according to your local court.

 

BTW, if your court does apply a "Stay", you can always apply for it to be removed (see the A-Z in my signature for templates).

 

Mimi

A-Z CAG links to all documents you'll need for

your claim

(Thanks to Michael Brown for all his efforts)

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/consumer-forums-website-questions/53182-cant-find-what-youre.html

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  • 2 weeks later...

I wrote to the FSA regarding their decision to grant a waiver for the banks refunding charges while the test case is being processed. This is their response.

 

Dear XXXXXX

 

I write further to the recent letter sent by my colleague of the Independent Complaints handling team within the Financial Services Authority (FSA) Company Secretariat office.

 

Firstly I would like to set out some background to our decision to waive temporarily our rules requiring firms to handle customer complaints within particular deadlines. The Financial Services Authority (FSA) made this decision in the best interests of all consumers so that all consumer complaints about such charges could be dealt with in a fair and consistent way going forward.

 

BACKGROUND

 

For some time some customers of banks and building societies have been complaining about the charges they have paid for going into unauthorised overdrafts. Some institutions have settled with their customers, without admitting liability, and a large number of further complaints are in the pipeline. However, the law in this area is not clear and the current situation provides neither certainty nor consistency for consumers or current account providers.

 

In these circumstances the Office of Fair Trading and some firms have decided to initiate a test case in the High Court to resolve legal uncertainties on the level, fairness and lawfulness of these charges. In order to facilitate this process the FSA has issued a waiver of its complaints-handling rules as they apply to complaints about unauthorised overdraft charges.

 

CURRENT SYSTEM OF DEALING WITH COMPLAINTS

 

The FSA has also monitored how banks and building societies have been handling complaints about unauthorised overdraft charges. Its aim was to find out whether firms were treating these complaints promptly, fairly and consistently, as required by FSA complaints-handling rules. The FSA saw significant shortcomings in some firms' handling of complaints about unauthorised overdraft charges, which is leading to inconsistent outcomes for complainants.

 

The FSA is clear that the way in which complaints have been handled in the recent past - against a background of uncertainty about what the legal position is on these charges - is unsatisfactory and not in the interest of all consumers. When the legal position on these charges has been clarified, firms will be required to deal with complaints within the normal timetable in a fair and consistent way. In the meantime, the FSA is requiring firms to acknowledge any further complaints they receive on this issue within five days, to keep records of such complaints, and to be prepared to deal with them once the FSA lifts the waiver.

 

To protect consumers' interests while the test case proceeds, the waiver contains a number of conditions that firms must adhere to. The FSA will review the waiver at the end of September to ensure, among other things, that firms are complying with its conditions. The FSA can revoke the waiver at any time if it considers that it is no longer appropriate because, for example, the test case is not progressing or if a delay in the resolution of the test case is likely to cause undue risk to consumers.

 

SPECIAL TREATMENT OF CASES OF FINANCIAL HARDSHIP

 

In making the decision on the waiver, the FSA has particularly considered consumers facing financial difficulty. The waiver makes clear that banks and building societies should identify consumers in difficult financial circumstances and should continue to deal with these cases throughout the waiver period. If these cases cannot be resolved, the Ombudsman will be able to consider them. All high street banks and building societies follow the Banking Code that covers how firms identify cases of hardship; the Ombudsmen also considers the Code when making its decisions.

 

 

TIME-BARRING

 

The FSA has also imposed a condition in the waiver to preserve consumers' rights so as to prevent complaints becoming time-barred. This means that the clock stopped on 27 July and will start again when the test case is resolved or when the waiver is removed. So, for example, if a consumer was applying to reclaim charges for the last six years and the Court case took one year, that year would not count. Similarly, the waiver will not cause you to become time-barred from taking your complaint to the Ombudsman.

 

I hope that this is helpful. If you would like more information, you can find answers to frequently asked questions on unauthorised overdraft charges on our website at http://www.moneymadeclear.fsa.gov.uk.

 

We hope that this is helpful.

 

Yours sincerely

 

 

 

D Taylor (Mr)

Manager

Consumer Contact Centre

Financial Services Authority

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Hi All,

 

Thank you very much for all of your responses. This really is a fantastic site and it's so reassuring that there is always someone willing to help.

 

I'm afraid I'm after some more advice! I have just received the N149 AQ and read in the notes on this site to add a statement asking for a request to the Judge to order a form of 'basic' disclosure from the bank. What is this?

 

Also, is there anything else I need to send in with this and should I send a copy of the AQ to Wragges also?

 

My claim is only for this year so all the charges were online (no paper statements) so I didn't need to request copy statements at the beginning of this process as all the charges were at my finger tips. I was going to print everything off from my online banking. Is this suitable? A&L charge £5 per statement so I'm going to avoid that if I can but if not then it can't be helped.

 

I'm a bit nervous about this going to court. As well as the charges I'm also really unhappy about the service A&L have provided. It's really hard to manage your money cos the banking isn't realtime (Balance say's one thing, statement says another etc), transaction don't show up until a few days later and it actually takes two days to switch cash between two accounts with the same sort code! I understand the case is about facts supporting the refund though so I shall keep my mouth shut.....for now ;o)

 

Thanks all......

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interesting about the time barring - as that is not what has been posted here elsewhere.

 

Also see my extract from the OFT agreement from my thread

 

Jan

Please note I am not an expert - I am not offering opinions or legal help - Please use all the information provided on the site in FAQ- step by step instructions and library- thanks Jansus:)

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/images/icons/icon1.gif

offer from A&L 24/8/07 - after case stayed

 

"What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well." - Antione de Saint Exupery

 

 

PROUD TO BE AN ORANGE

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Hi All,

 

Thank you very much for all of your responses. This really is a fantastic site and it's so reassuring that there is always someone willing to help.

 

I'm afraid I'm after some more advice! I have just received the N149 AQ and read in the notes on this site to add a statement asking for a request to the Judge to order a form of 'basic' disclosure from the bank. What is this?

 

Also, is there anything else I need to send in with this and should I send a copy of the AQ to Wragges also?

 

My claim is only for this year so all the charges were online (no paper statements) so I didn't need to request copy statements at the beginning of this process as all the charges were at my finger tips. I was going to print everything off from my online banking. Is this suitable? A&L charge £5 per statement so I'm going to avoid that if I can but if not then it can't be helped.

 

I'm a bit nervous about this going to court. As well as the charges I'm also really unhappy about the service A&L have provided. It's really hard to manage your money cos the banking isn't realtime (Balance say's one thing, statement says another etc), transaction don't show up until a few days later and it actually takes two days to switch cash between two accounts with the same sort code! I understand the case is about facts supporting the refund though so I shall keep my mouth shut.....for now ;o)

 

Thanks all......

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If you click on the link for 'Nat West Claimants' in my signature and scroll down to the section about AQ's, it explains exactly what to do with the N149 (including completion, attachments, etc.)

 

Best of luck :)

Can't find what you're looking for? Please have a look at Michael Browne's

A-Z Guide

*** PLEASE NOTE ***

I do not answer queries via PM. If you send me a PM, please include a link to your thread - any advice I am able to offer will be on your thread.

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5 threads merged and thread title changed

 

please keep to the one thread when asking questions or updating .This is in your own interest as you will get much more informed advice when people can see at a glance what you have done so far :-)

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Thanks Hedgey6......I'm afraid the Info in the Natwest link has confused me a bit more. Should I be asking to have the case struck out or continuing as normal? Also, I stil don't know what a form of 'basic' disclosure is? Can anyone help me please?

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As part of your AQ submission, you ask for the defence (not your claim) to be struck out as an abuse of process along with requesting draft orders for directions. Just follow the links as advised and you'll be able to put everything together that you need to submit the AQ. :)

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Can't find what you're looking for? Please have a look at Michael Browne's

A-Z Guide

*** PLEASE NOTE ***

I do not answer queries via PM. If you send me a PM, please include a link to your thread - any advice I am able to offer will be on your thread.

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In my alloaction Questionnaire pack I have been sent a Mediation scheme reply form asking if I'll try mediation. It also states that if I say no that I may face cost sanctions if the district judge finds the refusal unreasonable/ Do you think it's OK to say no as there has been ample opportunity?

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Have a look here http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/83044-mediation-bad-idea.html#post742517 with regards to the 'mediation'.

 

Not sure what you mean about the template though - all the info for the AQ is in the link previously mentioned (request to strike out defence as an abuse of process, attachments, draft order for directions). :)

Can't find what you're looking for? Please have a look at Michael Browne's

A-Z Guide

*** PLEASE NOTE ***

I do not answer queries via PM. If you send me a PM, please include a link to your thread - any advice I am able to offer will be on your thread.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi All,

 

After a few weeks with no news, after a requet to strike out the defence, I received a letter from the court stating that Judge Hayes has ordered that the claim be allocated to the Small Claims track and for a preliminary hearing of which if I agree to the directions, I don't have to attend. At the hearing the judge will consider that a) to stay the claim pending the decision of the test case or b) to give directions for the claim to be heard as a test case...... It also states that "Not less than 14 days before the preliminary hearing, the defendeant shall file with the court and serve upon the claimant details of any cases proceeding a test case, the decision in which will determine the issues in this claim. Alternatively, the defendant shal file with the court and serve upon the claimant draft directions for this case to proceed as a test case. What does this really mean and should I be worried? I'm not really sure of where to start either - please help!!

 

Thank you for your time XXX

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I have just had a worrying thought. I don't have original copies of all of my statements as the claim was for this year and they're all available online (I don't receive paper statements). I guess the online copies will not be acceptable for court? What should I do?

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Crickey - thats different - so they are asking the bank for details of any cases that they have won? that will be difficult;) Using you as a possible Test case? I would think if A&L dont apply for an official stay they might be in trouble.

 

Not sure about the statements - but would have thought that as you dont have paper copies the internet ones will be fine - just make sure they are clearly highlighted on each page - it would be up to A&L to show that they are not true charges ? Comments anyone else?

 

Which court is this by the way?

 

Do you think you will attend or just send in your bundles to court and Solicitor?

 

Jan

Please note I am not an expert - I am not offering opinions or legal help - Please use all the information provided on the site in FAQ- step by step instructions and library- thanks Jansus:)

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/images/icons/icon1.gif

offer from A&L 24/8/07 - after case stayed

 

"What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well." - Antione de Saint Exupery

 

 

PROUD TO BE AN ORANGE

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you may need a bit more advice on the directions - is that the full wording above?

 

jan

Please note I am not an expert - I am not offering opinions or legal help - Please use all the information provided on the site in FAQ- step by step instructions and library- thanks Jansus:)

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/images/icons/icon1.gif

offer from A&L 24/8/07 - after case stayed

 

"What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well." - Antione de Saint Exupery

 

 

PROUD TO BE AN ORANGE

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Hi Janus,

 

Thanks for your response. I did actually get a letter from Wragges a week before the one from the court stating their intention of aqpplying for a stay.

 

I have typed out the full wording of the letter below. I won't be attending as the letter states that I don't need to if I abide by the decision of the judge. I'll print off the online statements then as the bank doesn't provide paper copies. Fingers crossed that it's all ok!

 

Before District Judge Hayes sitting at Norwich County Court etc....

 

Upon review of the court file

 

It is ordered that:

 

1. The claim be allocated to the small claims track.

 

2. The claim be listed for further directions only at a preliminary hearing. (Time estimate 5 Mins)

 

3. At the hearing the court will consider either:

a) to stay the claim pending a decision in the test case involving the defendant, or

b) to give directions for this claim to be heard as a test case, and if necessary to reallocate the claim to the multitrack for that purpose.

 

4. Not less than 14 days before the preliminary hearing, the defendeant shall file with the court and serve upon the claimant details of any cases proceeding a test case, the decision in which will determine the issues in this claim. Alternatively, the defendant sha. file with the court and serve upon the claimant draft directions for this case to proceed as a test case.

 

5. The claimant may make any represenations to the court in writing provided these are received by the court and served on the defendant not less than 5 days before the preliminary hearing. If either party is prepared to abide by the decision of the judges as to the directions to be given, that the party is excused from attending the preliminary hearing.

 

I'm a bit concerned about the multitrack part as the claim is for less than 1k and only for charges incurred during 2007.

 

What does it all REALLY mean and what should I do?

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