HSBC, Cabot, Incorrect details etc....

[sacg]

Ok, this could be that start of a lengthy process. I’ve read a few threads on here and like the advice that’s been given. I’m going to be honest and upfront with you guys in return for your opinions and advice.

Last Year a had to unfortunately close down a business I owned. This was a Ltd company and I thought I was free of any liability. Around 2 months after closing the business, I received an incorrectly addressed letter from HSBC stating that a loan I had taken out for the business was personally guaranteed by me and they were seeking repayment of this 10k debt. They also stated that a copy of this debt would be entered onto my CRA file, something which has not been done to this day! Be it negligence or the fact I had a lot on, I do not recall signing a PG on this loan. In addition, the letters were sent to my address but to a different surname. Only the surname being incorrect, Could this have any impact? To be honest, I threw it in the bin. A couple more appeared, of which I did not open and sent back to HSBC stating “not known at this address”, Hoping the incorrect addressee would be the issue that dissolved/confused the matter. After a couple more (incorrectly addressed) letters, they stopped, until yesterday when another INCORRECTLY addressed letter arrived. I have not opened, but can identify that this is from Cabot! After researching, I would assume that this debt has been sold on to Cabot who are now seeking repayment.

What are my options here? Do I;

(i) Go through the same motions with HSBC, and state that the named person on the letter (incorrect surname) is “not known at this address”. Will this make things worse, incur charges, etc? Is it THEIR responsibility to get the details correct?

(ii) Open the letter and address the situation, thereby possibly highlighting the incorrect details they have, and opening myself up to direct attack and repayment?

(iii) Wait for the inevitable DCA to call at my door, again, requesting the incorrect name and say its not me?

(iv) Move? J

I appreciate that I may be living in cookoo land in believing the incorrect details may make this go away, but my thinking at this stage is that I don’t want to stand up and tell them they have it wrong, and here I am. This has now been going on for over a year. In addition, I don’t want the situation getting out of hand through doing nothing. Can they apply charges, get heavy etc, whilst they are not addressing the correspondence to the correctly named individual? And im not responding to these demands? Why has no default been applied to my CRA, is this down to the incorrect addressee?

[pmhcfc]

Ok, this could be that start of a lengthy process. I’ve read a few threads on here and like the advice that’s been given. I’m going to be honest and upfront with you guys in return for your opinions and advice.

 

Last Year a had to unfortunately close down a business I owned. This was a Ltd company and I thought I was free of any liability. Around 2 months after closing the business, I received an incorrectly addressed letter from HSBC stating that a loan I had taken out for the business was personally guaranteed by me and they were seeking repayment of this 10k debt. They also stated that a copy of this debt would be entered onto my CRA file, something which has not been done to this day! Be it negligence or the fact I had a lot on, I do not recall signing a PG on this loan. In addition, the letters were sent to my address but to a different surname. Only the surname being incorrect, Could this have any impact? To be honest, I threw it in the bin. A couple more appeared, of which I did not open and sent back to HSBC stating “not known at this address”, Hoping the incorrect addressee would be the issue that dissolved/confused the matter. After a couple more (incorrectly addressed) letters, they stopped, until yesterday when another INCORRECTLY addressed letter arrived. I have not opened, but can identify that this is from Cabot! After researching, I would assume that this debt has been sold on to Cabot who are now seeking repayment.

 

What are my options here? Do I;

(i) Go through the same motions with HSBC, and state that the named person on the letter (incorrect surname) is “not known at this address”. Will this make things worse, incur charges, etc? Is it THEIR responsibility to get the details correct?

(ii) Open the letter and address the situation, thereby possibly highlighting the incorrect details they have, and opening myself up to direct attack and repayment?

(iii) Wait for the inevitable DCA to call at my door, again, requesting the incorrect name and say its not me?

(iv) Move? J

 

I appreciate that I may be living in cookoo land in believing the incorrect details may make this go away, but my thinking at this stage is that I don’t want to stand up and tell them they have it wrong, and here I am. This has now been going on for over a year. In addition, I don’t want the situation getting out of hand through doing nothing. Can they apply charges, get heavy etc, whilst they are not addressing the correspondence to the correctly named individual? And im not responding to these demands? Why has no default been applied to my CRA, is this down to the incorrect addressee?

 

This needs to be moved to the Cabot forum.. us cfc members might have some fun with this one... I'll PM a Mod and ask it to be moved

[Seahorse]

Looks like it's been moved.

 

But as all this boils down to a case of mistaken identity, I can't see that there will be a problem. How "different" is the surname? Is it totally different, or just spelt incorrectly?

 

As someone else has obviously signed the paperwork, it will be easy to prove they are chasing the wrong person. I'd S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) HSBC, that will throw up all the paperwork they have on you, and Bingo! As this relates to a different person, there should be nothing there that relates to this debt in there. Although if there IS, then HSBC will have breached the Data Protection Act by supplying you with someone else's information.

 

You just send write to Cabot and say, sorry guvnor, but you've been sold a lemon. Again. And you can prove it. And suggest they go back to HSBC and start asking some questions.

 

I'd also keep any paperwork that might show any forgery or fraud has taken place, and get it reported to the police. As it's not your name that's been used, it's maybe not identity fraud. But it sounds like someone has been using the business details to obtain credit, and that someone needs to be in jail.

[sacg]

Looks like it's been moved.

Many thanks for the speedy response Seahorse. However, I shall explain more

 

But as all this boils down to a case of mistaken identity, I can't see that there will be a problem. How "different" is the surname? Is it totally different, or just spelt incorrectly?

The surname Is completely different. However, it is my middle name. Say Im called John Mark Jones (sorry if anyone on here is actually called that), the mail was addressed to Mr John Mark. I know im possibly trying to avoid this by a technicality (if i did sign a PG), however, I dont regard this as being dishonest. holding my hands up to the coporates and saying here I am, if i can play ignorant (if i did sign..) and maybe it will go away.

 

As someone else has obviously signed the paperwork, it will be easy to prove they are chasing the wrong person. I'd S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) HSBC, that will throw up all the paperwork they have on you, and Bingo! As this relates to a different person, there should be nothing there that relates to this debt in there. Although if there IS, then HSBC will have breached the Data Protection Act by supplying you with someone else's information.

Guys and Gals, forgive me, but Im not saying this debt is incorrect, i just dont know, and would rather avoid if possible. As losing the business left me in financial difficulty. I did get a loan for the business, through the company i thought, from HSBC, for the said amount, what im saying honestly is, i cant recall signing a PG for it. So you can imagine my shock when HSBC initially wrote me. AS I state, when the mail was incorrectly adressed (prob a computer glitch) i thought id play ignorant, and return mail not addressed to me. Its unlawful to open "private & confidential" mail not addreseed to you. Maybe niavley, i thought it may go away. MMmm So, contacting either HSBC or Cabot would rectify THEIR mistake, and if there is a PG, im done for. After all the CCA and SRA requests of course...

I was wondering where I stood as this is incorrectly mailed, and officially never opened and made aware of.

 

You just send write to Cabot and say, sorry guvnor, but you've been sold a lemon. Again. And you can prove it. And suggest they go back to HSBC and start asking some questions.

Is it not enforeable whilst the details are incorrect?

 

I'd also keep any paperwork that might show any forgery or fraud has taken place, and get it reported to the police. As it's not your name that's been used, it's maybe not identity fraud. But it sounds like someone has been using the business details to obtain credit, and that someone needs to be in jail.

Sincere apologies if i didt explain fully. Trust this makes a little more sense now.

[Seahorse]

Ah, OK. Well, as this is a business loan then, I'd imagine normal consumer laws do not apply. As in, you can't send a CCA request, as I don't think the loan would be regulated by the CCA 1974. We need someone with experience in business stuff to come and help.

 

But I don't think there IS an option of carrying on ignoring it. Eventually they will get fed up and start litigation, and theat's not the point that you want to find out if you can beat this on a technicality. You need to know soonest.

 

I still think the best bet is to SAR HSBC and see what comes back. I'd also write to Cabot and get the debt into dispute to prevent any other action being taken. Hopefully someone more knowledgable will pop in and offer more advice. In the meantime, I suggest you do what I'm going to do, and have a search for stuff relating to business loans.

 

I was getting bored anyway.

[sacg]

Ah, OK. Well, as this is a business loan then, I'd imagine normal consumer laws do not apply. As in, you can't send a CCA request, as I don't think the loan would be regulated by the CCA 1974. We need someone with experience in business stuff to come and help.

Thanks again SH. Yes, this was a business loan, but as Ive said, they say I PG'g this loan. If thats the case, it means it fast becomes a personal loan, under the same guidelines surely?

 

But I don't think there IS an option of carrying on ignoring it. Eventually they will get fed up and start litigation, and theat's not the point that you want to find out if you can beat this on a technicality. You need to know soonest.

Litigation against Who? John Jones? Until they identify me correctly, surely Im not obliged to respond to any correspondance? Or held accountable under a different name?

 

I still think the best bet is to S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) HSBC and see what comes back. I'd also write to Cabot and get the debt into dispute to prevent any other action being taken. Hopefully someone more knowledgable will pop in and offer more advice. In the meantime, I suggest you do what I'm going to do, and have a search for stuff relating to business loans.

 

I was getting bored anyway.

LOL, cheers mate.

[Seahorse]

I see what you are saying, but if it was me, I wouldn't like to stand in front of a judge and try to explain away my signature on a document with the only thing wrong with it being they've mixed up my middle and last names. Maybe you would get away with it, and maybe you wouldn't. I really don't know enough to advise you either way. I can only tell you what I would do.

 

I'm still looking though.

[louiboy]

As Mr Seahorse says do the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) and find out what cards HSBC and Carboot hold.

 

I'd want to see a copy of the doument that guaranteed the loan. If it exists.

[sacg]

As Mr Seahorse says do the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) and find out what cards HSBC and Carboot hold.

 

I'd want to see a copy of the doument that guaranteed the loan. If it exists.

 

 

Me too louiboy, however, as far as im concerned where getting ahead of the game here. I dont think im coming across correctly. What your'e all saying re: the CCA and SRA's is correct, and will happen should they be on my case. However, at this stage, they are not, and i dont want them to be! They are pursuing a different surnamed individual, as far as i am concerned. Albeit at my address, for a possible loan that MAY have been PG'd, (something i would not be aware of, not opening any of this incorrect mail). My questions at this stage are, Until they have the correct details, and address the mail correctly, and I recieve, then surely this is not moving forwards by any standard. In the eyes of any court, would / could I be held accountable for correspondace not directly addressed to me? How am I supposed to know the contents of these letters and demands when Im not legally entitled to open these letters in the first place? To be honest, i dont after the very first one.

[louiboy]

Fair point Mr John Mark is a different person from Mr Mark John. You've sent a few of Mr Marks letters back to HSBC. You could have the post office stop delivering the mail to Mr Mark. You've never opened the mail sit back and see what happens. Carboot are pursuing the wrong person at the wrong address. Not the first time they have done this.

 

Court papers need to be served on the correct person at the correct address.

If they are not served correctly there's no case to answer.

[tomterm8]

Me too louiboy, however, as far as im concerned where getting ahead of the game here. I dont think im coming across correctly. What your'e all saying re: the CCA and SRA's is correct, and will happen should they be on my case. However, at this stage, they are not, and i dont want them to be! They are pursuing a different surnamed individual, as far as i am concerned. Albeit at my address, for a possible loan that MAY have been PG'd, (something i would not be aware of, not opening any of this incorrect mail). My questions at this stage are, Until they have the correct details, and address the mail correctly, and I recieve, then surely this is not moving forwards by any standard. In the eyes of any court, would / could I be held accountable for correspondace not directly addressed to me? How am I supposed to know the contents of these letters and demands when Im not legally entitled to open these letters in the first place? To be honest, i dont after the very first one.

 

I would suggest to you that if you were to go down this route, it would be imperative to write "not known at this address" on the envelope and return it.

 

However, judges are not particularly stupid, and they will realize that, given this was adressed by the first and middle name, it was a mistake and they made a reasonable effort to contact you.

 

in the event of legal action, it would not prejudice their case.

 

i would normally suggest that, at the very least, you S.A.R. the original creditor, since at the least you would be able to reclaim any penalty charges, however since this was a business account, it is quite possible that the Data Protection Act 1998 simply won't apply.

 

It might be worthwhile sending a letter to the DCA asking whether they are trying to contact you. Open all the envelopes, and see what they have been saying. What we need to know is if they have threatened legal action, since in that case there are things we can do.

[sacg]

Again, many thanks for the advice. One question that keeps coming to my mind is "why has no-one registered this debt on my CRA file?" Surley they would have done this, if only to "incentivise" me to address the situation. they had threatened it.

[Seahorse]

Is there anything against just the address? Is the mysterious person listed as being connected to you at all?

[sacg]

Is there anything against just the address?

I have full membership to experian, and there is nothing against me personally or the address. they cant list against addresses now anyway, can they?

Is the mysterious person listed as being connected to you at all?

Dont understand your question. If you mean on the CRA file for me, no, no connections or aliases.

 

 

Keep them coming......

[Seahorse]

They can list financial connections. I checked my eqifax report a few months ago, and there were 3 people I'd never heard of using my address to try to get credit.

 

Unfortunately for the, and fortunately for me, the fraud thingy part of the CRA system picked it up and they didn't manage to get credit. But it's scary. Equifax were really quick to remove the entries too once I wrote to them.

[sacg]

My reports pretty clean. no links to anything untoward. Surely they would have done it if they could?

[Seahorse]

I'm sure you are right. So what are you planning on doing? Going to let lying dogs sleep, or try to find out what it's all about?

[sacg]

Im going to return as not known for now. let the B*****s work for their money, (if they are entitled). Until they address it correctly, I cant see how Im liable.

 

Will keep you updated.

[Seahorse]

I've no doubt that when/if they realise theri mistake, you'll find out soon enough.

[NitrousOxide]

Hi,

This apparently was covered by a personal guarantee so may well be covered by the CCA as it was only 10k.

Follow the advice of the others as the SAR will reveal all.

[sacg]

Jees, these guys dont hang about, Lol. Recieved another letter (unopened) from Cabot today. Only 5 days after the first. Returned the first yesterday, so have to wait and see. Probably a knock on the door next.

[pmhcfc]

Jees, these guys dont hang about, Lol. Recieved another letter (unopened) from Cabot today. Only 5 days after the first. Returned the first yesterday, so have to wait and see. Probably a knock on the door next.

 

They'll be no knock at the door - just expect various letters every 4 days or so- They'll just be different templates if you were to look.

[sacg]

But how the hell do they progress this without any correspondance. They have to call to at least verify whether this person lives at this address or not dont they? Especially when theyre gettting returned mail informing them that the person doesnt.

[pmhcfc]

But how the hell do they progress this without any correspondance. They have to call to at least verify whether this person lives at this address or not dont they? Especially when theyre gettting returned mail informing them that the person doesnt.

 

Whatr they should do and what they do do are two entirely different things lol. You obviously not fully aware at the way Cabot work

[louiboy]

Recipient says No! Cabot Computer says Yes!