Moorcroft/Help please

[pecky1]

Have a debt with Argos who then passed it to Moorcroft, have made regular payments but since finding this site, CCA them and sent it on the 19th of June, Have also sent SAR to Argos as I know they have added charges on the account, still waiting on that one.Today recieved a letter from Moorcroft saying I have defaulted, but have cashed the £1.00 cheque and taken that of what I owe! they also told me that if I dont send money by return post they will instruct solicitors to commence proceedings against me,( bully tatics i think) I sent the template saying that did not acknowledge any debt with them and requested the CCA. Do I know wait as the 12 days are nearly up or shall I reply and ask them where my CCA is that I requested, I am sure there are a lot of Moorcroft fans out there that can advise me.

[Curlyben]

Well there's a couple of things you can do.

1/ send them a Dispute notice against this account.

While in dispute with the original creditor thay can take no action.

2/ Tell them they are yet to comply with your CCA.

 

Now I'd go with 1/ as then the CCA is still running towards a criminal offence.

 

You can always put the two together.

[alibobsy]

There is also a couple of threads on this forum relating to moorcroft where people are looking into the fact that moorcroft may not even have a consumer credit licence which means they may have been illegally collecting payments perhaps for years. Worth watching out for.

ali x

[pecky1]

Thanks that would be very interesting, because then surely a load of claims would go in against them for causing lots of distress for harrassing people.

[alibobsy]

Yeah watching it very carefully, myself I'm sick of these so and so's writing and phoning.

Perhaps if this is true (here's hoping) we could organise a mass complaining campaign to the FOS and get em closed down, now that would be nice

ali x

[pecky1]

Yes Fingers crossed, Looking at those threads now:oops: Thanks Curlyben for your advice will compose letter for post tomorrow, Thank goodness for this site,

[pecky1]

Just update on moorcroft, sent letter informing that i am in dispute with this account, and yet to comply with my request of a CCA, recieved phone call yesterday saying that i owe a months money and i have defaulted (oh dear). And that they may have to send a collecter to my door, reminded him of the harrassement act and if someone did call my camara would be on hand to take a photo to hand to the police, ( didnt like that very much hung up on me) what a shame we were having such a good conversation up untill that point.

[Curlyben]

Always happens.

Take them off their prepared script and they don't know what to say.

Good on you.

[Worried37]

Too funny re the telephone call. I had a DCA calling, calling, calling. Read up loads from this site and at my last call I was told "please be aware that this call is being recorded". "Fantastic" I said, "Why" said DCA company person, "because it will save me havign to record and under the Data Protection Act I can write and ask for a transcript of this conversation". Surprisingly, that phone went dead as well.

Also, another good one is to ask their name, their age, anything really about them, as Curlyben said, take them off their thread and they haven't a clue. Am dealing with same company as you (as well as a few more) and the legal process is long, but at least we are abiding by the legal process which is something most DCA's don't do. All in all, get your files straight with all correspondence, all signed for Recorded Deliveries, all calls and conversations make point notes of and then when the time is right -----Kaaaapow, they don't have a leg to stand on and FOC can fine them 400 pounds just to start an investigation. Can't beat it xx

[pecky1]

Update on Moorcroft recieved letter today as no payment has been made they are passing me to thier collection people who may visit, Funny no CCA sent to me yet, posted on the 19th June to Moorcroft know they have recieved it as the £1.00 cheque has been taken out of my account, and in the letter they thanked me for the payment, 12 days are now up and counting to the month that they have to come up with my request, of course it was signed by Mr Martin. Wrote a lovelly letter today one of Curlybens that he did for me for another DCA that is ongoing.

Just reminded them that they havent complied with my request and I would now be contacting Trading Standards and if they call at my house I will call the police for trespassing.

Still waiting on CCA from Argos sent 4th July no response from them at all also requested SAR from them Expect they are a bit busy.

[pecky1]

UPDATE

Recieved SAR from Argos today came in the form of Screen Prints so will look to see what charges have been added, No CCA from them which I requested at the same time, Also no mention of Moorcroft taking over the debt although the payments that I made to Moorcroft prior to sending them a CCA request are on the Argos statements,

 

I would have thought that if Moorcroft had bought this debt then it would have been on the statements or a DOA included at this stage, If anyone has screen prints from Argos do you know what OTHER CR means has I have an amount for £1538 placed in one of the months under this heading.

[pecky1]

Recived today letter from Argos with my CCA request under s78 1974 they are obliged to send me the executed agreement and any other document referred to in it together with a statement,

In accordance with this we enclose the following

1 A copy of the executed agreement as repuired by s78(this is a copy of your agreement with the signature box and name and address omitted as provided by regulation 3)

 

2 A statement of the terms of the agreement as varied as required by Regulation 7.

 

In your letter you have also requested a copy of the deed of assignment. Your debt had not been assigned but MOORCROFT are only acting as agents in collecting the debt. Therefore there is no deed of assignment.

 

What they have sent me is my Application Form when i first opened the account, There are no terms and conditions on the form no APR just name address and bank details and signed by myself. But they have included a booklet with thier Terms and Conditions. So I presume they have complied with my request.;-)

 

BUT GOODNEWS MOORCROFT DO NOT OWN THIS DEBT SO THEY CAN NO GO AND GET SXXXXXD, think i will now have to contact Argos as there are £150 of charges on my account and arrange payment to them and not MOORCROFT.;-)

[N.P]

Hi pecky1,

 

So, they have complied with your request, but do you mean they have not actually sent you the Consumer Credit? Just a copy of your Application Form and a copy of the T`s & C`s?

 

If so, are you going to chase up the Charges on the Argos Account? Because if they don`t have the Consumer Credit then you should be safe, so you could just leave it at that.

 

Is there anything in the T`s & C`s or the Application Form you signed about sending your details to Third Parties? Aren`t Argos in breach of the Data Protections Act by giving Moorcroft your details?

 

I`ll watch with great interest as we are both in the same boat.

 

Regards

 

 

N.P.

[pecky1]

Hi NP

Just looked throught the Terms and Conditions in the booklet that they have sent, It states

Assignment

We may assign our rights under this agreement this means that we can pass on our rights to another financial services provider, such as a bank or other credit card provider who may take over the running of your account.

Probably means MOORCROFT then!

It also states in the Tand C that the late charge fee is £12.00 not he £17.50 they have charged me.

Next stage not sure it is only the Applicaton form for a Argos Card with signed by me.

I could see what happens next as now Moorcroft dont owen the debt they will probably hand it back to Argos, who will then i expect contact me,Or i may go back to Argos and claim back the charges and then come to an arrangement to pay them direct. It just goes to show the bully tatics of Moorcroft no wonder they never complied with the CCA request.

Will watch your thread see how you get on:p

[N.P]

Hi pecky1,

 

Thanks for the response on my own thread.

 

Could you possibly scan your form which is in doubt? If it is an application form then from what I understand from this site is that they can`t enforce the debt as they don`t have an actual agreement. Unless they pull one out, which they probably would have already.

 

If this is the case and just an application form then you should sit back and do nothing at all. They say, no agreement, no debt. Neither Moorcrap of Argos can claim it back.

 

I`m sure someone on here will correct me if I`m wrong or put it in plainer english.

 

Perhaps going after charges may stir things up for you.

 

How much is this debt? Is it more than your charges? If so, leave it and do nothing.

 

Hopefully someone with more knowledge will be along soon.

 

I`ll keep watching with great interest.

 

Regards

 

 

N.P.

[pecky1]

Hi NP,

Thanks for your reply i dont have a scanner but it is an Application form as it says this on the top for an Argos card there are no terms and conditions on the form,no APR The amount i owe is £1,200 the charges are approx £150, The booklet they sent with it is thier Terms and Conditions, Looking at it again i found in thier T&C saying that The Consumer Credit Act lays down certain requirements for your protection which should have been complied with when this agreement was mad. If not we cannot enforce this agreement without getting a court order.

I had the same form back from Cap One which was just my Application form for a Card no T&C sent with that one, have been advised on this site that is not a CCA request,just an application for a card. But because Argos have sent the T&C in the form of a Booklet this may be different and alter things,

I think you are right I will sit and wait to see if Argos now contact me because Moorcroft will have to pass it back as the debt is now Unenforceable by them. Think I will play a waiting game.

[alibobsy]

How long since your original CCA request? I would be tempted to write and thank them for the copy of your application form for your records but you still await their compliance with your CCA request. If they are in default you can point this out, even better if they are past the 12+month deadline you can report them to TS for not providing the agreement and the fact they tried to pass off the application as an agreement Mind you could just wait and see who gets back in touch with you next so you know who to hit with your next letter. As no good writing to moorcroft if they turn round and tell you they have passed it back to Argos.

Good luck

Ali x

[N.P]

Hi pecky1,

 

My Argos card is around £2600. I sent a CCA request to Moroncroft early in the week followed by a SAR to Argos a day or two later.

 

From what I understand, they may have sent you an Application Form and T`s & C`s with a load of waffle on but they still not have actually sent you a Consumer Credit Agreement.

 

If or when I reach your stage I would simply sit it out, say nothing and do nothing. Like alibobsy says, just wait and see who get`s back in touch with you first, then fire off another letter accordingly.

 

I`m not sure, but YES, you do have an application form, and YES, you have T`s & C`s, but NO, you don`t have a proper Consumer Agreement.

 

Do nothing and hang tight and let the clock tick. So far, it seems you have the status quo, so they say. It`s their move.

 

Hopefully someone with knowledge on this will come along soon.

 

I`m curious as to the legality of the application form and T`s & C`s.

 

I used to be the most honest person around, always paying my way. Now I say if you can get away without paying it back then good on you. No doubt you will have been ripped off with bank charges too, how do you feel about that con? Not very amused I bet, same thing here, only it`s the other way around now.

 

I`m getting stung off the CSA for £209 a month, simply because my girlfriend is registered disabled with arthritus and she is claiming off the state. The CSA have a policy if any mother claiming any benefit has a child, they automatically get involved. We both told them it`s none of their business but they insisted I play ball and let them know my income so they can take money off me each pay. Of course, I simply ignored them and now they are taking it from my wages. I`ve come to the conclusion you are better off not working. If you do, you get taxed on everything and get nothing back, and they think of other ways to take it from you.

 

My point here is, if Argos messed up with their agreements and their is a tiny loophole you can wriggle through, you should diet down and squeeze through. I know I would and so would they if it was them. You`re probably getting lashed with interest every month too, I know I was.

 

Anyway, time to go. When this is all over I might apply for another Argos card for a joke.

 

Catch you all later.

 

 

N.P

[pecky1]

CCA request sent on the 4th July, so over the 12days but withen the month, I dont dispute the fact that I owe Argos my complaint with them is that because of cut backs I lost my job had to take a lesser paid one,

So couldnt afford the £60. a month tried to negotiate with them even sent a budget sheet but they wouldnt take any less, so obviously passed to MOORCROFT,

 

Think I will sit tight as advised see what happens next, any hassle will then write and thank them for sending my Application form, see where that gets me, Totally agree about your theory NP waiting for the outcome of the OFT test case with banks before I proceed with my bank, As for the CSA been there with my son he pays £74 a week for one child, He doesnt mind paying for his son but £74!! A WEEK

 

Cant wait for you to get you requests back from Argos and MOORCROFT:p

[N.P]

Hi pecky,

 

Wow! £74 a week, that`s just stupid! Does your son`s partner / ex-partner actually get the money though? Mine isn`t, they say it`s in the system. She gets a child allowance but there are no entries on her bank statements from the CSA. They paid 12p into her account a few months back, for her son from her ex-husband. I was fuming at that, as I`m paying £209 a month. They are taking the mick out of both of us.

 

Do you also know, there are Debt Collection Agencies owned by Experian the Credit Check Agency and that their boss is also the Director of the CSA? What do you think of that. Seem`s like they use each other to track us and rip us off.

 

Anyway, yes, just sit tight and do nothing, it`s their move now. If they can`t produce a CCA, you have no worries, but that doesn`t mean they still won`t hassle you. But it does mean they can`t enforce the debt. So don`t even acknowledge that there is a debt. Always refer to the debt as the alleged debt in all correspondence.

 

I think the problem with the world today is that we are bombarded with loans and credit cards and are basically forced into more debt by lashing you with interest and charges when they know you are struggling.

 

Stay woth this site, it is an excellent weapon against parrasites. They say that money is power, which is true, but so is knowledge.

 

Right, time to stick a movie on.

 

All the best and keep fighting hard.

 

Regards

 

 

N.P.

[pecky1]

Hi NP,

Thanks for your reply, not sure if sons ex recieves all the money as there is no contact but with the current state of the CSA nothing you told me is a surprise, Looked through a few threads on Argos and found some one had scanned thier Application form it was the same as mine and also had a booklet of the T&c sent to them. Advice on that thread was the same as what you have said that is is not a properly CCA request.

So i will now sit tight for next move. This site is fantastic and which i had found it months ago, everyone is so helpfull, you dont feel you are on your own. Excuse any mistakes, it is 4.30 am and i am off to work at 5 earn some more money to keep the wolves at bay!

[N.P]

Hi pecky1,

 

If your going to work to keep Moroncroft happy, I wouldn`t have bothered and stayed in bed, at least untill they show up with a real CCA, ha ha. Just remember, everything is now on hold, DON`T offer to pay anything, not even 1p.

 

Here`s one for you. I`ve just checked an account I have with Cetelem - Halifax. It was for a Digital Camera I purchased on a buy now, pay never.

 

After the first year of interest free credit I said I wanted to pay the full amount with my credit card, but they said I could only pay cash with a cheque, so then it went onto the 3 year monthly payment [problem]. The interest almost doubled the amount I owed. The interest was £500+ on a £600 camera. Beware of these 3 years deals!

 

Anyway, a few months ago, I noticed their online account was out of date, and that mixed with paying bank charges and trying to get them back made me miss a payment, so they lashed me with a £20 late payment fee. They wrote to me and I blanked it, so they stuck another £20 on within a week.

 

Anyway, this has gone on for a while now, and I have never wrote or spoke to them, I was waiting for a solicitors letter or some sort of threating action from a muppet at the door who I would only have to kick in and throw out, ha ha.

 

The charges ran upto over £200 in just 2 months or so. About 6 weeks ago they wrote saying due to the continued non-payment of the account they are offering one more chance to settle and said if I pay up now I will get a 25% saving on the account. The charges doubled the amount I owed.

 

I also blanked that as well, I was getting my letter ready for some hot action at that point. Anyway, I just checked the account out of interest this morning and the arrears have been cleared, even the missed payment has gone, I just have another 6 payments to make which I worked out as correct.

 

In fact, I could pay the outstanding amount now which is £181 and clear it. That means the account is cleared and I wouldn`t have even paid the £31 missed payment, and their bull%*@! charges they tried to con out of me.

 

What do you think of that lark?

 

You hear of horror stories about other people`s debt and hassle with DCA`a etc but you just don`t beleive people can be that sneaky and evil. I think it`s quite sad that companies will try ANYTHING to get ANYTHING out of you.

 

Anyway, I hope you haven`t worked too hard this morning, I know I wouldn`t have.

 

Remember the money you don`t have to pay Argos can go on something else, at least untill they show up with a real CCA, which by the sounds of it, they don`t have. We can both have some fun with these imbeciles, ha ha.

 

Right, catch you later.

 

Regards

 

 

N.P.

[pecky1]

Hi Folks,

Update had a letter from MOORCROFT today responding to my CCA request not bad sent it 04/07 they have enclosed a copy of my application form that Argos sent me, nothing else. In the letter they tell me they have placed my account on hold for fourteen days to allow me to contact them to arrange a repayment plan. If not they will start further action against me. SCARED!

Feel a nice polite letter in response, informing them that they dont own the debt as Argos still do, and thanking them for my Application Form and as far as i am concerned this debt is now unenforcable by them as they have failed to comply with my request as they cant prove they own it.

[N.P]

Hi pecky1,

 

So you finnaly got your Application Form back then? LOL

 

I`m still waiting for something back from them. I`m also wait for some Printer Inks to land too, my printer has bombed out due to being empty. Damn!

 

Keep us posted!

 

Watching with great interest,

 

 

N.P.

[N.P]

Hi pecky1,

 

How`s your case with Morecrap coming along? We haven`t heard anything from you in a while.

 

I still haven`t heard anything myself for a while, not since my last post.

 

Anyway, I`ll keep watching and waiting.

 

Ciao for now

 

 

N.P.