Ali vs Black Horse PPI

[alibobsy]

Sorry long post!

In Jan 05 we went in to our local branch of Black Horse loans to ask for a small loan of £1500 to cover a large bill on our car (which hubby needed to work) and to help cover the costs of the repair to our water heater (again essential with an 18 month old and a 7 year old at that time). However they talked us into a larger 30k secured loan to consolidate all our debts together. At the end of the time we were there they brought out the agreement for £1500 which they said we could have that day to cover our immediate bills, this would be cleared as soon as the bigger loan was sorted out from the balance of the larger loan.

The only talk we had about PPI was in relation to the larger loan and we were told it had to be taken to get the loan. The signing of the smaller loan was definately a secondary rushed affair at the end, just before we left. We were told not to worry about "the figures" on this secondary agreement too much as it was going to be paid off.

A few days later I got a call from the person we arrange the loans with, the larger loan had been turned down (in hindsight thank god it was). We were told we had to pay the £1500 back straight away or accept the agreement and start the payments. Given that we had used the cash for our bills we had to accept the agreement. After reading through the agreement for the smaller loan I called back to complain about the high interest rate and the PPI which had been added without us asking for it on this loan, given that it was supposed to be a very short term loan the PPI would have been pointless at that stage anyway.

I was told by the "advisor" that they couldn't do anything about the int rate and that we wouldn't have got the loan without the PPI. I asked about cancelling and was told it was "too late" she waffled on about how because of deductions cancelling the PPI wouldn't make "any real difference" to the monthly payments we were making. I look back now and am angry I didn't stand up for myself more and have more idea of how these things work, but I was still at that stage when we trusted the banks etc (we've all been there I'm sure lol).

My loan was £1500 @ APR 35.9% the PPI was a lump sum of £565.36 @ an APR 35.9% over 3 years. The agreement was signed on 7/01/05 and I think our first payment was on 17th Feb 05.

Do I write and ask for the PPI "plus all interest from Jan 05 to date" and let them work it out or do I need to work it out myself first.

Thanks guys

ali x

[reidnet]

Hi,

As they stated that you would not get the loan without PPI you have been Mis-Sold the PPI policy.. PPI cannot be made a condition of obtaining Credit / Loan.

 

Have a look through this stick for more info on PPI etc,

If you need any help Just shout and I am sure someone will help sort things out for you.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/ppi/61081-ppi-some-notes-claimants.html

 

Good Luck

 

Ian

[alibobsy]

Thanks for that Ian off to compose my prelim from the notes

ali x

[too strong]

Thanks for that Ian off to compose my prelim from the notes

ali x

 

 

Hi,

 

how are you getting on with Black Horse.I am just about to start my case against them.

 

Have you had any joy?

[alibobsy]

Sadly not, a few letters have gone back and forth. They keep saying I have to "prove" I was miss sold the policy. I have now asked for there complaints policy so I can lodge an official complaint and then go to the FOS if no joy then will look at court action. Dealing with a few CCA requests at the mo and also 8 months pregnant with 3rd child so taking time to get there lol. Good luck.

ali x

[alibobsy]

I had written to Blackhorse to reclaim PPI on a current loan (due to end in Jan 08) as we were told twice in person and once over the phone that without the PPI we would not get the loan at all. But also they didn't look into the fact I was on Mat leave at the time, my pre exisiting med condition and the fact hubby and I both work for government dept so have alot of protection re sickness and redundancy anyway. Basically they keep writing back and denying everything and saying unless I have "proof" they won't refund anything. This has made me mad, they are basically calling myself and my husband liers. So now instead of just pursueing the one lot of PPI I have decided to look into previous loans we had with them which were settled and also had PPI(we were always told that you had to have the PPI to get the loan because of credit history problems). Like many people I am sure we were stupid enough to keep taking up their offers every few years to "refinance". The original loan we held with them was transferred form another company (have the name somewhere) and was bought out by Black horse. Just wondering will one SAR and one £10 get all the info for all of these loans or will I need the reference numbers for each loan and a separate SAR for each one?

Ali x

[hellhasnofury]

I had written to Blackhorse to reclaim PPI on a current loan (due to end in Jan 08) as we were told twice in person and once over the phone that without the PPI we would not get the loan at all. But also they didn't look into the fact I was on Mat leave at the time, my pre exisiting med condition and the fact hubby and I both work for government dept so have alot of protection re sickness and redundancy anyway. Basically they keep writing back and denying everything and saying unless I have "proof" they won't refund anything. This has made me mad, they are basically calling myself and my husband liers. So now instead of just pursueing the one lot of PPI I have decided to look into previous loans we had with them which were settled and also had PPI(we were always told that you had to have the PPI to get the loan because of credit history problems). Like many people I am sure we were stupid enough to keep taking up their offers every few years to "refinance". The original loan we held with them was transferred form another company (have the name somewhere) and was bought out by Black horse. Just wondering will one S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) and one £10 get all the info for all of these loans or will I need the reference numbers for each loan and a separate S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) for each one?

Ali x

 

Hello Ali,

 

I do think Black Horse will be difficult regrding giving you information regarding previous loans, if they were with different companies. Maybe try it and see where you get. Be prepared to sent a SAR to the different Companies.

 

As for being stupid in taking up offers to refinance loans, Be comforted by the fact that all of us were not stupid, because they did not disclose the fact that they were ripping us off. It was down to trust and total ignorance in our part. This is why it is now payback time for then and they truely deserve it. They are running scared.

 

As for proof, you are claiming that you were mis-sold the ppi, they have to prove that they didn't mis-sell,

 

Good luck and keep the good fight going

[Dave's gran]

Hello Hell and Ali

Long time no speak, Hell. Haven't given up the fight with Black Horse but have been on hols and then without a computer and internet access and there's been nothing to report, which is precisely my dilemma. I can't get a response out of them! You may recall that I wrote to Black Horse in June and got a similar response to Ali that there was no proof of misselling and they were satisfied their sales rep had followed procedure. Ive asked them for proof of this but they have been strangely silent. How do you make them respond? I don't want to hijack Ali's thread so will continue the saga (been going on since a year last march) on my own thread Dave's Gran v Lloyds TSB - got the companies mixed up so the thread name is wrong). Hell, would really appreciate if you would have a look at it and if possible shed some light on my dilemma.

 

Thanks

Gran

[alibobsy]

Hiya Gran

simular situation here. Think I am going to send a letter recorded asking for a final response so I can go to the FOS and see how they react to that. If still no joy gonna try the FOS first and if no result will consider court action.

Good luck with your claim

ali x

[Dave's gran]

Thanks Ali -

And thanks for your suggestion re the FOS but I've already been there, done that! My loan predates the FOS so they won't act, which is why it's been dragging on for 18 months as it took until Jan to establish that from them. If you've already been through their complaints procedure I wouldn't hang around any longer - go straight to the FOS.

 

Best of luck!

Gran

[reidnet]

If you submit a SAR under the data protection act requesting copies of all information and in all formats that they hold on record for you, they are obliged under the law to supply this Information.

 

When you submit SAR if you have not already done so remember to include that you want copies of all recorded Telephone conversations etc to. If they do not comply then you can complain to the ICO .

 

If you need any more help etc Just shout

 

Good Luck

 

Ian

[Dave's gran]

Hi Ian

 

Congratulations on your victory! You really are awesome and an inspiration to the rest of us!

I have the contract and insurance policy document but will send a SAR asking for copies of all other information they hold and recorded telephone conversations - do you know if I need to sent the usual £10 cheque with this?

 

I think I've taken this as far as I can with correspondence (it's no fun when it's one-sided!) and I think court action is my last resort so would appreciate any tips on how to approach this - don't want to rush in and muck up my chances by not preparing properly.

 

Thanks Gran

ps - I'm also seriously contemplating contacting our newspaper or is this a stupid idea?

[alibobsy]

Sorry about that Gran I didn't realise a loan could predate the FOS. I wonder what happened to complaints prior to that?

My current loan is only from 2005, but I did have previous loans with them. If I do a S.A.R will they have to send all info for all loans I had with them or will I need a request for each one Reid? We even had some earlier loans with chartered trust(bought out by black horse), one of which was quite large and had a high PPI as an up front payment. As always we were told the PPI had to be taken to get the loan. This large loan was secured against our house which had far more equity than the loan.

I'm thinking if we have to go down possible court action to get our PPI back I might as well claim as much as possible at one time.

ali x

PS well done Ian and good luck everyone else

[Dave's gran]

Hi Ali

 

As my loan predates the FOS I'm assuming that the Trading Standards Office would have looked into it - that's what the loan states anyway so I will contact them but don't know what good it will do.

 

I think that with a SAR they must send you all the information on you rather than the facility, so you should only need one, but I'm a novice at this game and wouldn't like you to rely on my advice - I'm sure Ian or someone could set you straight on that.

 

We're in exactly the same posiiton as you - a large single premium for PPI was added to the loan up front and then interest added. The loan was secured on the house and, like you, there was more than enough equity so there was no risk to them in any case. We borrowed £15k but the cost of the PPI alone (with interest) was £10k - from what I've seen reading others in the same boat this could well be a record! (I'm embarassed that we were so desperate and gullible at the time!) We told the sales rep it was rediculously expensive and didn't want it but they have you in a stranglehold, don't they?

 

 

Best

Gran

[reidnet]

When Black Horse had taken over the other companies they would also have taken over all records etc, so you should only require on SAR to obtain your full details. It would not do any harm to mention the previous company names in your SAR so that your request for full information is clear. Remember also to request this information in all formats, eg paper records, computerised records and any Copies of Audio Telephone calls etc.

 

Good Luck

 

Ian

[skbuncks]

Hi Ali

 

Ian is right you only need one SAR and one cheque for £10 to get all the info you need on all the loans you've had with BH.

I used a SAR against Lloyds which got me everything they had on me which you may find useful. Can be found here. Feel free to use it but add in about that you want info from previous company

good luck skb

[alibobsy]

Thanks for that info guys. The current PPI I was after is only around the £800 mark, but now they have annoyed me with their pathetic replies to my letters I have decided to claim as much as I can. After watching Panorama last night and seeing the sales tactics of these so called sub-prime lenders I reckon they deserve all the backlash they get for their dodgy tactics.

ali x

[fishing7]

Can anybody give me some advice. I bought a car from DC Cook. They arranged the loan through Black Horse and told me that I would need a PPI or I would not get the loan. I didn't need a PPI I am in regular employment in Local government get sick pay and redundancy pay if necessary. All the documents came from Black Horse, but they are saying that it has nothing to do with them, they didn't mis-sel it, it was DC cook. But are they not agents for Black Horse, they would have been paid commission by Black Horse? Where do I go from here, I do not need the PPI

[reidnet]

Hi Fishing7,

Black Horse are correct in what they are stating, You have to take up your complaint for mis sold PPI with the company / broker that sold you the policy.

 

Ian

[alibobsy]

I am now thinking as Black Horse have been so unhelpful regarding me reclaiming the misssold ppi on our current loan (due to end in Jan 08) which is only around £800, that I am going to go for a full S.A.R. and reclaim PPI from the previous loans we had with them as well. Everytime we were told we could only have the loan if we took out the PPI even tho hubby and I both work for the government and so have good illness and redundancy protection anyway. I figure if I have to pursue them either through the ombardsman and/or court I may as well go for the whole lot at once.

ali x

[alibobsy]

Wrote to Black Horse about a recent loan and the PPI, still awaiting their reply (they wrote and said they are looking into it). However whilst looking at the PPI on a G.E loan I realised we had used that to pay off an earlier Black Horse loan and the G.E letter showed the account number. So I tried a punt and wrote asking for the PPI, I know definately every Black Horse loan we had we were told without the PPI we wouldn't get the loan. They imedaitely wrote back saying no. Basically the main thrust of their letter is the fact that it was pre jan 2005 so we can't get the ombudsman to look into it. It then waffles on about us having the agreement sent out to look at for 10 days prior to signing and returning, and this was ample time for us to seek independant advice! The loan was paid off 2 years into a 84 month loan, but they state you had the cover for the period the loan ran so no refund.

Good news is they have surely given me more ammo by providing me with the agreement as well. Now I know how much to claim

The letter states they have included the terms and conditions of the insurance, but they haven't so I will be asking for those for more ammo for court, however would appreciate any advice on what else to mention in my next letter. Also the agreement shows that it paid off 2 earlier Black Horse loans and gives the account numbers of those, but they would have been prior to Aug 2001 so over 6 yrs ago. Has anyone had a refund over 6 yrs old? If not it is not worth me asking about these previous loans. Considering if it is worth doing a SAR for all info they have on me and claiming the lot, but if the 6 yrs is a problem it may not be worth pursuing. Any advice welcome as this is my first PPI claim

Thanks Ali

[alibobsy]

BTW What happened to complaints prior to 2005 and is it true there is noone who will look at complaints prior to this date?

Thanks

ali x

[hellhasnofury]

BTW What happened to complaints prior to 2005 and is it true there is noone who will look at complaints prior to this date?

Thanks

ali x

 

Hello Alibobsy

 

How are you well I hope, As regarding claims that are outside the limitations act, You need to apply section 32 of the limitations act, regarding the bit in it to being mis lead and it has only come to light now, with the recent investigations of the fsa and the oft into the mis-selling of payment protection insurance.

 

Start the process of reclaiming back you ppi and if it comes to it. a judge can decide, if it ever gets that far:D

[alibobsy]

Thanks for that HHNF, doing well now baby no 3 delivered on 4th Novemeber so keeping me busy. Sadly she has had a heart issue with a small hole in the centre muscle of the heart, but saw top specialist from Alder Hey yesterday who scanned her and it seems to be closing by itself. Her oxygen levels are good so doesn't need any treatment so far so big relief. Now back to give those DCA's/PPI claims a bashing lol. In that case I think I might do a SAR and look at the other PPI

Hope you are well and giving those banks et al a good hiding

ali x

[hellhasnofury]

Thanks for that HHNF, doing well now baby no 3 delivered on 4th Novemeber so keeping me busy. Sadly she has had a heart issue with a small hole in the centre muscle of the heart, but saw top specialist from Alder Hey yesterday who scanned her and it seems to be closing by itself. Her oxygen levels are good so doesn't need any treatment so far so big relief. Now back to give those DCA's/PPI claims a bashing lol. In that case I think I might do a S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) and look at the other PPI

Hope you are well and giving those banks et al a good hiding

ali x

 

Hello Ali,

 

Sorry to hear of your worries, I have dealt with many babies who have been diagnosed with heart problems, have faith that the human body has great capabilities of healing and she will grow well and strong:D

 

Where abouts are you from, is it Scotland, what makes me wonder is your statement "a good hiding". I originate from Aberdeen and that is what my mother used to tell me she'd give me a good hiding:D She never did