Forteboy Vs Capital 1

[steven4064]

The directions hearing is to decide which track to allocate the claim to and to make any directions to you or Cap1.

 

Your claim for CCi does have a legal basis - there is case law - the Sempra Metals v Inland revenue case.

 

The bit about a very small part of the interest being charged on fees is probably correct - but as you have no access to the algorythm they use you have to guess what that might be. THat hsould be what you have claimed.

 

"this is not a situation wher the bank has had the benefit of the use of your money" what else have they done with it, put it under the bed? The money you paid them in charges (ansd the interest thereon) has been leant to otehr people at interest. If the charges are unlawful, then the money they have made is unjust enrichment. What else can it be?

 

"their actual losses exceed £12" - complete balloney. If they maintain this, then they should prove it by giving an account of their cost base. If their losses are anywhere near £12 (or even £1 come to that) then they would be so uncompetitive they would go bust.

[forteboy]

Thank you Steven,

 

pretty much what I thought, a letter issued to intimidate rather than assist in settling the claim. Back to the direction hearing, do I really need to attend and if so is there anything I need to prepare and take with me, will cap 1 turn up.

 

Many thanks

 

Forteboy:cool:

[steven4064]

You should attend if you can. Otherwise a letter to the court explaining why it should be allocated to SCT and perhaps a bit about CCI and Sempra to inform the court as the case is still quite new. You could also take/send any draft directions you think tthe court ought to order. For example, something based on the 'new' AQ - directions to disclose cost structure, etc. Maybe a draft order to strike out the defence as abuse of process.

[forteboy]

Hi Guys,

 

Has any one already composed a letter to the judge, similar to what steven, above has stated. It will be difficult to attend for me as my job is now around 26 miles from the court rather than the 500 yards it was before i was made redundent. If any one has a real good letter i would like to send to Cap 1 as well, to put the fear of god in them, let them know i mean business and with everyones help off this site finally get my money with the interest i am intitled to.

 

Many thanks

 

Forteboy:eek:

[forteboy]

Hi guys,

 

could someone please advise if they have a letter already completed, as per above, if not I will try and compose one myself

 

Regards

 

Forteboy:cool:

[baslow138]

I thought Cap 1 paid up once you had logged a claim against them in court? Is this a change of tack or just a judge goung against the grain?

 

Bas

[forteboy]

Hi Baslow,

 

They offered most of what i wanted with the exception of Default removal, due to them being a responsible lender and they reckon they they were not unjustly rewarded by my money and so therefore will only offer 8% from when my card was closed and not the 34% they charge mugs like us to use their cards, which by the way was backed by money taken from unwitting customers. I was advised to keep the claim intact if i wanted default removal and all of my cash returned.

 

Hope that helps

 

Forteboy:cool:

[steven4064]

I was advised to keep the claim intact if i wanted default removal and all of my cash returned.

And that's good advice. Experience shows that trying to get defaults removed or interest paid once the charges have been repaid is very difficult.

[forteboy]

Hi all,

 

I think i should change my name to "Idiotboy", I booked half a days holiday on Wednesday and duly turned up at 11am at the court ready for 11.10 start. The problem started then they could not find my claim on the running list, i checked my letter and oh what a surprise the hearing was to be Thursday, the next day, and unfortunately i could not make it. I handed the draft order for directions, and the witness statement along with a mention of the sempra metals case.

 

Now its waiting to see what the judge has ordered, hopefully all in my favour.

 

Merry Christmas

 

Forteboy:cool:

[steven4064]

You are not the only idiot - I did that for an interview once :o

[forteboy]

Hi Steven,

 

Thanks for the moral support, could you advise if the semplar metals issue, is also applicable to current Credit cards as well, reading the case i would have thought so but need to understand it better, if there is an explanation of this could you please advise.

 

Forteboy:cool:

[steven4064]

It applies to all cases - the problem was that, up until recently only simple interest could be awarded in compensation. This was challenged in another case (Westdeutsche v Islingtin BC) on the grounds that, in this day and age, simple interest was nonesense - no one borrows or lends money with simple interest. The argument was lost excpet that the minority view was that compound interest was right. The majority veiw was that CI could only be awarded in cases involving fraud or breach of trust.

 

Where Sempra comes in is that the House of Lords upheld the minority opinion in westdeutsche - that CI could be awarded in cases even when there was no fraud or breach of trust. Sempra gives authority for claiming CI in all cases where money has been taken (or kept) unlawfully, although you have to be a bit careful about the grounds on which CI is being claimed. The main grounds are those of unjust enrichment by the bank and restitution - ie putting them back where they would have been had they not unlawfully taken your money..

[forteboy]

Do you know if this has yet been tested in court on CC as potentially have over 4000 pounds in CI on my one credit card and if i could get this back then great, and to be honest its with the big american bank who have caused major issues with the Credit cruch, so I would really love to put my little boot in to them as well. always kick the bank when their down, because they will surely do it to you if the boot was on the other foot

 

Forteboy

[steven4064]

It has never been tested in court for CC claims for the simple reason that none of the banks will actually let us take them to court. They always settle beforehand (even if it's only minutes beforehand).

 

My only warning is that you must not let the CI claim get separated form the charges claim by accepting payment of the charges alone. There was one case that went to court for CI that was lost. A county court awarded the charges but not the CI. The claimant lodged an appeal with the High Court and lost. This was for two reasons:

 

1) the appeal was ony for the interest (however, so was Sempra)

 

2) (much) more improtantly, the grounds for claiming CI were flawed (the claim was on the grounds of reciprocity and mutuality - which, of course, was why the county court didn't award it). You can read the whole story here plus a lot of the discussion that has gone into our current understanding of the right grounds for claiming CI.

[forteboy]

Thanks Steven,

 

its going to be a good long read, but by the end I hope to have a good understanding of the claim and the interest i am claiming.

 

 

Thank you

 

Forteboy:cool:

[forteboy]

Good Evening All

 

Its been 6 days since i submitted my requests at the Directional hearing, will I be advised if the judge grants my request for full disclosure and if so any ideas of how long before i know.

 

Many thanks

 

Forteboy:cool:

[baslow138]

Hi Forteboy

 

Did you have to submit your requests in person,verbally at the directional hearing?

 

Baslow

[forteboy]

It was a directional hearing at court, but because i mixed up the date, went a day early I had to submit the requests in writing, so last thursday.

 

Forteboy

[forteboy]

Hi guys,spoke to the court yesterday, they advised the claim was in the pile to be typed and would be completed next week, they could not advise what the outcome would be, hopefully full disclosure and evidence to be presented by mid january.Happy New Year.Forteboy

[steven4064]

Happy New Year fortebot.

 

I went to mey local court yesterday and they were shut. They had a notice on the door "Closed until Tuesday 2nd January" - do they know something we don't

[forteboy]

Good evening all,

 

it has been over a month since the hearing, i have chased the court 3 times now, but they can not or will not tell me what the current situation with my claim is. I received a letter from Cap 1 on Friday stating i have a credit balance on my account and they are sending a cheque to clear it. Strangely the value of the cheque they are sending matches the one i returned in December as not sufficient to settle the claim, so they will be waisting their time and energy, i want CI and Default removed or I will see them in court with everyones help.

 

Many thanks

 

Forteboy

[steven4064]

Keep us posted

[forteboy]

Thanks Steven, I will do,

 

thanks for all your assistance to date and hopefully you will be around if or when it goes to court as i will definately need help with the CI and default removal to present the arguements correctly to the judge

 

Regards

 

Forteboy

[forteboy]

Good evening all,

 

well today i have received my "notice of allocation to the small track hearing", it will be with DJ Morton on the 26th march 2008.

 

Now the letter states i have to pay 300 pounds by the 2nd February as a hearing fee, now when I win I assume I can claim this back? the good news is that the court want all relevent documents that I will be going to use during the hearing to be sent to the court and Cap 1 by 29th February.

 

Now I will need some help with the court bundle as I have never had to put one together and also will need special help with the section for Default removal and the CI arguement, so as you can see not a lot really.

 

I know I can count on the people of this great website, and once i have beaten cap 1 i will be able to afford to go after my other 2 cards and the Shabbey as well.

 

I now can begin to see the woods for the trees

 

Regards

 

Forteboy:cool:

[forteboy]

Hi All,

 

still waiting on the courts to see if i am lucky enough not to need to pay the $300 for the hearing. just a quick question I believe the standard court bundle covers the general claims, however I will need help/advise on3 more aspects, claiming on charges more than 6 years old, Default removal and probably the most intense is the CI bit, if any one can help, please feel free to jump in, I Know its not due to the end of Feb, but i really would like this to be completed sooner rather than later and it would give me chance to prepare thoroughly for the case hearing.

 

Many thanks

 

Forteboy