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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Court Date - Have queries! Help Please?


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Yeah but can you pretend you are me? :grin:

 

Want to know what the order means though, hope it's in post tomorrow. WHY have they allowed this to continue, why me and all that!

 

I am petrified now of the court, and what to say, in case I blow it. Can't believe everyone said 'they won't comply with disclosure directions and they'll pay', and it's come to this!

 

Checked the account again just now as well, NOT!!!!!

 

x

Fzrkitten

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I think that they'll settle. I really can't see Lloyds turning up to answer those allegations - there's no defence IMO. If they turn up it will be to apply for a stay, which you should oppose.

 

Post the order when it comes and we'll take it from there.:)

Please remember to DONATE! Help CAG keep up the fight!

 

 

Any advice or opinion is offered informally & without liability. Use your own judgment and if in doubt seek advice of a qualified and insured professional.

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Hi all, and thanks Gary.

 

Wasn't in post saturday, possibly be there when I get home tonight, postie doesn't like early mornings in my area!

 

I'm afraid I just got drunk at the weekend, seemed like a good idea at the time! (Not the whole weekend I hasten to add!).

 

Just been trying not to think about it too much, I'm a bit of a worrier and can make a situation worse before it's happened, and end up with migraines, I just wind myself up! I am a strong person, and happy go lucky most of time, but my brain (fluff) tends to wander off on it's own sometimes!

 

Will keep you posted, thanks for your support all.

x

Fzrkitten

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Hi

 

Its easy to say don;t worry, but I am the same.

Don;t blame you getting drunk - at least you probably forgot all about this hassle for a while (not so much fun dealing with the hangovers though lol!)

Hopefully your postie has delivered today then.

Keep us posted as well. :D

 

Ollie x

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Good luck.

IMO - In My Opinion!

IMHO - In My Humble Opinion!

Night Owl

Keep up the fight against Bank Charges.

 

 

Got Debt problems?

Don't panic, put the kettle on and read this

 

:-) Everything I write comes from my heart and head! The large filling cabinet that is my knowledge of life, however warped that may be!! :-)

 

<<< Please tickle my star!! if I have managed to help you or just made you chuckle!

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Hi,

 

Yes, but not exciting, just plain scary!

Got this:

 

Before District Judge ******* sitting at.....

Upon reading the Claimants ex-parte application dated 3rd August 2007

It is ordered that:

List the claimant's application on notice at the same time as the next hearing on 7th September 2007 at...

Dated 16th August.

 

Ok, so it's the district judge, and I think it's one you mentioned before Gary, can I post it here?

Our application is also in the letter, they must have kept one copy and sent the other back to me.

Why ex-parte in my case? I put 2 copies in, one for SC&M if needed.

I take it on notice means when he asks me to speak!

 

So this means at present, it's still fast track (re-allocated when lloyds put in ex-parte application), and it's still a 'case management conference' on the 7th, so Lloyds got their way.

 

I kind of get a feeling the judges are fed up with both parties? I'm not ecstatic about this anyway, and now am worried about what to say when the time comes.

 

Fzrkitten.:(

Fzrkitten

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Hi Ollie,

 

:D I have no idea on both questions! I suppose Lloyds could now put in for a stay on the day, (as they got their re-allocation), but if they got it I would be very mad and liable to say something I shouldn't in court. :mad:

 

But, on the other hand they might not turn up. Gary thought they might pay before the 7th, but I really don't think they will.

 

The judge is saying he will hear my application for set aside of the re-allocation at the same time as the case management hearing, so I need to be very correct on what I say, which is what I'm worried about! From the 'tone' of the letter, they seem fed up with both parties!

 

Have to say I am fast losing hope, it really hasn't gone my way at all. Having said that, it could just be the way I am looking at it, and the judge wants me to give them what for in court! He might be really nice when I get there. :rolleyes:

 

I just think for the sum of money involved, the court will allow a stay even after everything, until the test case. And if that happens I'm a bit stuck personally too (worded politely!).

 

Hey ho. :)

 

Sorry, bad day for sense of humour, I left it somewhere and can't find it now!

 

xx

Fzrkitten

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Hiya,

 

I'm sure you will be fine and not say something out of order (Just mutter that under your breath!)

Try not to lose hope, you have got this far. You have done everything you were ordered to do by the Judge so thats got to work in your favour.

As I said I am away on your court date as would have come along for support so sorry I can't help out there.

Hopefully Gary is right and they might just pay up before the day but if not, don;t get daunted by it all (easy for others to say I know) just try and go over in your head what you want to say.

And I'm sure your sense of humour is still going strong, :) else you wouldn;t have got this far!! Its probably just having a wee nap!!

 

Let us know if you hear anything before date.

 

Ollie xx :D

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Hi Ollie,

 

Yeah, sense of humour overslept this morning, along with the rest of me! oops.

 

It's just because it's not the normal type of hearing in that Lloyds defaulted but got away with it, they got it re-allocated, I objected, but it's all being heard at same time, so if they don't turn up, fab, but if they do I need to make it such a strong case in my favour. And the one thing I have a problem with is authority. Any kind, anyone telling me what to do, or how to do it! (And it's the District Judge sitting.....).

 

I know you are away hun, thanks anyway - you going somewhere nice? Hope you get your pennies before then!

 

Christina's offered to come too, and my other half wants to come (I'm not sure I want him to though - he's more likely to say something than me!)

 

Will keep you updated, thanks for support.

xx

Fzrkitten

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Hi

 

Believe me, my sense of humour was "left up a tree" many a time. I still can't relax till I get the cheque!! How people have done this with 2 or more banks amazes me!

I am the same about being authoritive. But as I said in my case - we have done nothing illegal by being in front of a Judge - just asking for what we believe is rightfully ours and determined to fight for it!!!

 

Thats good that Christina has offered to go along and it may be nice to have your partner there as well - at least its lots of support...does help.

 

We are off to Swizerland, its my partners parents 50th wedding anniversary and they are celebrating over there. They kindly gave both their children the money to go as they wanted family and friends there to celebrate. Shall also be doing lots of walking etc, so will need a rest when I get back lol!!!

I'm going to have to try and get to the internet when I am away to keep up with your case, as sure I saw a couple of places near to where we are staying. But will still be thinking of you and will get on here as soon as I get back if dont manage to get internet access.

 

Ollie xx :D

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I'd like to echo Ollies sentiments. You haven't done anything wrong you are fighting for justice and have every right to do that. The fact that we are all fighting against big banks (and sometimes it feels like the the court system aswell) makes the whole process intimidating which leads us to question why the hell did we start this in the first place. :confused:

BUT at the end of the day it is your money you are claiming and it IS important to you and it is worth the fight. You have so many CAGers here behind you keeping you going. :)

Fingers crossed still. :)

(I have 2 weeks holiday with my O/H but because we are so skint he has just taken agency work 2 hours away from home for 2 weeks!!!! He will be living in!!! 1 daughter working and 1 in Scotland on holiday with friends.) :(

Don't loose your sense of humour. Put it on a fast wash and spruce it up again. Good as new. :)

Night Owl

Keep up the fight against Bank Charges.

 

 

Got Debt problems?

Don't panic, put the kettle on and read this

 

:-) Everything I write comes from my heart and head! The large filling cabinet that is my knowledge of life, however warped that may be!! :-)

 

<<< Please tickle my star!! if I have managed to help you or just made you chuckle!

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hi ya, my offer still stands i'll come and keep u company if u need it.

 

dont forget the judge will know u have no legal training do any questions he asks u i'm sure you'll the answer to.

 

look at how stressed i got with mine and the next thing i know the moneys been sat in my bank for three days without me knowing lol:D

 

it is draining but stick with it... i'm going after BOS now so yippee x

 

ps champayne cant stay on ice for ever:D

 

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Hi all,

 

So night owl you home alone then? not so much fun for you. Your stay should be up soon - 31st?

 

Ollie I just caught up on your thread, glad GuidoT helping you, hopefully you will get your pennies in time for hols. When you off?

 

ChristinaJane, thanks hun, guess we need to meet up soon and drink the champagne anyways, we can always do it again when it's my turn! Thanks for the offer of coming to court, but I bet you are a busy bunny really. I actually don't think I want other half there, he will make me more nervous I think. Might just tell him to meet me in the pub in town afterwards!

 

Funny thing is, it's not the bank that bother me, it's the judge!:D

 

Oh well, a while to go yet - guess anything could happen.

 

xx

Fzrkitten

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Hiya.

 

Off on hols on 6th Sept. So going with GuidoTs advice on my thread, if I havent had money by 31st Aug - I can send them the letter he advised me to send giving them 7 days to cough up. The only thing is I will be away on the 8th Sept if I have to go for the warrant of execution letter. But hopefully it wont come to that!!!

You know what they say if your nervous at interviews etc...just imagine them naked!!!! You never know, you may get a hunky Judge!!!

 

xxx

 

Got my champagne on ice as well, so we will have to do synchronised opening of the bottles when all our money is back where it belongs i.e with us!!

x

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Hiya Fzrkitten,

 

Just a quick catch up. Off on hols soon so busy sorting our stuff at work for leave etc so might not be able to whizz on here. Just wanted to say I hope it all goes well next week and will be thinking of you and hopefully will be able to find internet access sometime whilst I am away to keep up.

 

Bestest Wishes and Lots n lots of luck.

 

Ollie xx :D

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