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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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ill health and in debt


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All done, letter to t mobile registered post and cc to wescot faxed to both numbers today!

 

I've been so busy trying to get everything sorted for my son I'd neglected my own matters, typical mum I am, but, for anyone who is interested, I've started a new thread for myself, in the debt forum,,,,its an old issue but I'm forging forward now, feel strong and determined.

 

Oh, and Ltsb have till this Friday, 31st to put in a defence for my bank charges............:) onward and upwards! A big thank you to all the people giving their support

 

x

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Good luck honey, I think you're an absolute star supporting your son and neglecting yourself. Typical mum like you say! I have a funny feeling though, that your reward will come when you finally see the weight lift off your son's shoulders. And when it does, it'll be thanks to you. You're a pretty special lady, lots of luck and love, hedgey xxx :)

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Good luck with everything - sounds like you & your son really deserve it at the moment!!

Natwest Bank Plc owe me £1,227.48

06/03/07 - Prelim Sent

16/03/07 - Claim authorised, in full, via telephone...

28/03/07 - Full offer received in writing - YAY

29/03/07 - Offer accepted!

 

Bank of Scotland Mastercard owe me £497.00

11/03/07 - Complaint telephone call logged

29/03/07 - 50% offer received...

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Couldnt agree more. Sometimes the first step is simply about being brave and feeling that youve had enough. Youve done exactly that. Challenged. And as my friend Parkvale keeps telling me. Fortune favours the brave. And that you are my friend, that you are. B R A V E. Fendy xxxx

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Good morning,

 

I was so overwhelmed by the posts I've received, it really does help people this site, thank you.

 

Some brilliant news,,,,,,,,,t mobile rang me yesterday, a nice lady spoke with me for ages about this latest, almost £1400 bill. She apologised for the company not initially listening or negotiating with my son and she said if I paid £300 today (I get paid today), then the outstanding money/bill will be taken off due to the circumstances, the phone will be reconnected, she offered me a cheaper, £25 d/d per month from my bank account, but still in my sons name, a smaller tarrif with the option to top up when the 150 minutes runs out, then its sort of pay as you go till the next month limit, then she said about the default, that she hoped she could get that taken off, I then said I inist on it because if they had initially been offered by my son, more than once he tried, a monthly payment added to his d/d to clear it and they had refused point blank, she then said it takes approx 72 hours to know if they can do that, so my question is,,,,,,,,,,shall I not pay the £300 today (this will take a huuuuuge piece of my wages), until they can confirm they have removed /cancelled any default on my sons credit as I know this sounds silly but I'm really angry about that as he has always paid everything and I do feel strong about it..........

 

Sorry for rambling, but my head is racing and I'm worried I'll pay the money this morning, which will skint me but it will be worth it if to stop this.

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Funny now the tide is turning against them they are starting to listern. You must do what is right for you and your circumstances. Good luck.

A person is only as big as the dream they dare to live.

 

 

Good things come to he who waits

 

 

Its your money taken unlawfully from your account and you have a legal right to claim it back.

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Personally, I would call her again, thank her for help, and say that you have been advised that this new arrangement should be put IN WRITING - when you have received it in wrting then it can all take place. Now that is what I would do, because what proof do you have that she has said any of this to you? If for any reason, they renege on what she has said, then you are back to square one - or possibly past it, as they may still continue to impose penalties and harass you for payment.

 

Just my take it on it - obviously the decision is yours.

Keep posting

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Hi

Providing your son had no evidence of mental illness when he took out ppi and depending on clauses they should pay out. Also reclaiming charges good way to go although it will make the bank mad (good)

 

both my siblings are bipolar and when manic get them into finanacial mess, my sister owed over £6000 to different banks etc negociated full and final payment to all £2900. My brothers last bout of illness the bank gave him a loan even though he was obviously ill after many letters bank finally wrote it off.

 

never pay full amount,remember banks are in business to lend, it may seem personal but business is business and do not be intimidated by banks. I wish you and your son well good luck

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Hello everyone,

 

Sorry for the delay in posting but been trying to keep all the balls in the air, so to speak,,,,,,,but some good news,,,,,,yes more,,,,,,t mobile sent my son a replacement phone and said I could upgrade my one end of the month,,,,,,both are back on line,,,,,,so happy ending:)

 

Then,,,,,,Natwest told me a letter is in the post offering a settlement of approx £600,,,,,instead of £1,100,,,,,,,,can he accept that in part and carry on with the claim?

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wannagethelp,

NatWest are trying this on everyone. The choice is yours, but in my opinion hold out. It is not a huge sum and they do seem to settle these amounts quicker. Is this £1100 just charges or inclusive of interest ? http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/25716-rejecting-offers.html

A person is only as big as the dream they dare to live.

 

 

Good things come to he who waits

 

 

Its your money taken unlawfully from your account and you have a legal right to claim it back.

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Hi wannagethelp,

 

Excellent, things are really beginning to move in the right direction for you! :D

How's your son, is he feeling any better?

 

With regard to Natwest's offer, i would use the link provided by Parkvale to send a letter of rejection. The letter will say that you accept the offer in part payment only, not as full and final settlement, and that you will continue your actions to recover the full amount.

 

Pondfish :)

LloydsTSB - Current Account claim £5,554 settled unconditionally 25.4.2007 :D

If the Pondfish has helped click his scales! ;-)

 

Please donate to this site if you can! :-)

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Hello again,

 

Thanks for the responses,,,,,,I'm not sure which letter would apply yet as offer letter not got here yet,,,but as soon as it does I will get typing and get a letter straight back to them,,,,

 

The £1,1xx.xx was just the charges, so should I keep going?

 

Thanks again everyone who has read my posts and am overwhelmed with the support from this site,,,,,,,feel so empowered, stronger and hopeful:)

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wannagethelp,

 

Yes i think you should keep going. They have offered £600 but you can claim £1,100 + interest. Why let these people get away with the balance?

 

It might take a little longer, but i think you have already begun seen the benefit of standing up against unfair charging. I think you have done an exceptional job in addressing your sons problems so far, and can go on to get this amount back too.

 

As you already know, we'll all bend over backwards to help and assist you on CAG!

 

Pondy :)

LloydsTSB - Current Account claim £5,554 settled unconditionally 25.4.2007 :D

If the Pondfish has helped click his scales! ;-)

 

Please donate to this site if you can! :-)

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Pondfish is exactly right. It's your money taken unlawfully, which you have a legal right to claim back. Good luck.

A person is only as big as the dream they dare to live.

 

 

Good things come to he who waits

 

 

Its your money taken unlawfully from your account and you have a legal right to claim it back.

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Yes, Pondfish is right,,,,,,,I will carry on with the claim,,,,,it doesn't matter if it takes longer does it because I never ever thought I would get this far with everything, and I really don't think I would have got off first base without the tremendous support I've had on this site, so, onward and upward:)

 

I'll keep everyone posted on any updates.

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Hello,

 

New to NafWest forum, but could anyone tell me if there is anyone that has started a claim for pre 6 years,,,,,going back to 1992,,,,

 

and have got their old statements requested from nw from that far back recently...?

 

I'm hoping to start a claim and a bit wobbly because I think its gonna be loads:)

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You should have no problem requesting statements back to 1992. Nattie will be able to confirm this definately.Good luck.

A person is only as big as the dream they dare to live.

 

 

Good things come to he who waits

 

 

Its your money taken unlawfully from your account and you have a legal right to claim it back.

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Hi Wannagethelp

I sent the SAR letter to the Nat West, re account closed, they have sent a standard tick box letter back, ticking the .. we do not have details about this account, although on my sar letter which they sent back they have written the sort code and date it was closed.(1993)

I'm going to try again, as like you I had a huge amount of charges with this bank.

debbi

Debbi

 

 

 

 

Woolwich S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) sent charges 2500 offer 1894 accepted as need the money ! but the rest will go all the way !!:)

 

Woolwich (daughters) SAR sent charges 170.00 , no offer ?! :-| 14 day letter sent

 

Abbey S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) Sent pre 6 ryrs claim - one to watch !!

 

Black Horse £548, offered £262, awaiting balance got balance =paid in full:D

 

Barclaycard S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) sent

 

Halifax SAR sent

 

Citibank Sar sent - blah letter sent back. sending a SAR default notice at end of 40days

 

Capital one SAR sent, statements recd, 14 day letter sent

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