Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • He was one of four former top executives from Sam Bankman-Fried's firms to plead guilty to charges.View the full article
    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

Definitive answer on CCA request please!


MAVE
style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 6340 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

Can someone please give me a definitive answer on whether a DCA has actually completed my CCA request? I do not know whether to proceed otherwise.

 

 

In answer to my CCA letter, all I got back was a very dark, very illegible front page of a storecard application, completed in store. I cannot see any words mentioning 'consumer credit act', 'credit agreement' etc. There is some small print, just before my signature, but it is so dark it is totally illegible.

 

The 40 days was up ages ago, and I have already paid them about half of the debt. I have no contact details for the store who issued the card and have not sent an SAR, but wondered if Icould proceed first with the DCA.

They have provided me with copies of all correspondance relating to the debt, but no actual 'deed of assignment' either, from the store card company, stating that they have sold the debt.

 

I have calculated that I must have now paid off all the debt that is not charges/interest accrued whilst I was living away when I was under the impression that it had been settled. So I am loathe to pay more, if the DCA has not even complied with the CCA request.

 

How should I proceed? Any ideas anyone?

 

I was going to pay the rest and send a letter from templates asking them to confirm that I would not be liable again for this debt etc etc.(The 'full and final settlement' letter).

 

But I have just realised that they may not have complied with my earlier request so wonder what are my options?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello sequenci and thanks

 

The agreement was taken out in 1998 but I think that in being stupid and replying to an initial letter from the DCA last August, I 'activated' the account again and it would not be 'time barred'.

 

There was no contact from the storecard company to me and vice versa from about 2000 as my now ex-partner said he would pay it off for me and I stupidly entrusted him to do it and was working abroad for years.

 

Do you have any ideas on how to proceed at all? I would be v grateful!

Link to post
Share on other sites

an application is not a credit agreement.

 

the credit agreement is sent when your application is successful and they want you to sign so they can send you the cards etc.

 

since they have not sent this then they are in default and can only chase the debt in court, but are unlikely to as they have most of the money now anyway.

 

you can try and look through the forum to seek advice about claiming back all that you have paid them, since they were not entitled to collect anything from you (no deed of assignment or copy of the original agreement).

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello Tifo

 

Thanks for that. I had suspected as much, and I have another debt with the same DCA and I am just at the CCA stage - and sent a SAR to the credit card company on that one- so this helps a lot.

 

However, judging from a lot of stories on here, the debt agencies often seem to ignore people's letters even when the letter says that a debt is unenforceable.

 

Fingers crossed!

 

Does anyone know a template for sayng this?

Link to post
Share on other sites

The creditor has to send you a legible copy of the agreement, not the

application to even begin to conform with your CCA request.

 

As they have not done that, they have committed an offence. You are now

within your rights to cease payments. The only way they can get you to

restart paying is by taking you to Court, producing the agreement form and

the deed of assignment. And the reason why they did not supply you with

the info when asked. And to pay a fine for not supplying the info. So they

may not be in a hurry totake you to Court. Doesn't mean you can reclaim

monies paid though.

Stop paying and do nothing else-do not write to them-let them work it out

for themselves. When/if they write, point out they are in breach of your

request [no agreement] and it will now require a Court Order to reinstate your payments.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks again Lookforinfo

 

So you don't think a letter is a good idea? I don't think they do relaise that I know what they sent back doesn't comply. I have been slow as I have only just now re-looked at it and realised, so I would like to make them aware that I am aware- if you get my drift!

 

Also, they are now sending me letters from a legal firm (which I notic has a PO Box address almost the same as theirs!) so I would like to nip all this in the bud and maybe send a letter telling them that they are in breach of CC law, and maybe asking them to accept what I have paid already as a 'full and final' settlement because of this.

 

Do you think this makes sense?

 

Does anyone know of this kind of letter? Or just one telling them in legal terms that they haven't complied? I have looked on templates but none seem to be right.

Link to post
Share on other sites

without items like a consumer credit heading, the names and addresses of all parties, the APR, statements of consumer rights etc & signature boxes the agreement would only be enforceable by leave of court. in addition as the agreement is variable it WILL need the rate of interest, the "APR" is not sufficient and would make it totally unenforceable.

 

if the agreement doesn't tell you the credit limit or the way in which it would be determined it would be totally unenforceable.

 

there are a few other aspects which might cuase it to be totally unenforceable too - but without seeing the agreement i'm not sure how relevant they will be!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Your last post puts a different light on the situation Mave.

Write a letter to the DCA pointing out that they will be well aare that what they sent in response to your CCA request felll far short of their legal

requirements. So to restart chasing you for the outstanding amount

without a Court Order is a serious offence.Accordingly you have notified

your local Trading Standards office.

Then send either a copy of that letter to TS, or one outlining your problems

with the DCA so far, including a copy of todays letter and a photocopy of

the storecard application.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello again

 

I have sent the DCA a stern letter saying that they have not complied with my CCA request and what they have sent is not sufficient.

 

However, in the meantime, they, or rather their legal people, have sent me an official looking letter headed 'Notice of Intention To Pursue A County Court Claim'.

 

Should I wait for a reply to my letter? Any ideas?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello again

 

I have sent the DCA a stern letter saying that they have not complied with my CCA request and what they have sent is not sufficient.

 

However, in the meantime, they, or rather their legal people, have sent me an official looking letter headed 'Notice of Intention To Pursue A County Court Claim'.

 

Should I wait for a reply to my letter? Any ideas?

 

point out that under s127 their "agreement" is lacking a prescribed term is totally unenforceable and therefore you would have a perfect defence.

 

sections 60-66 of the cca cover the form and content of agreements, if the stuff they sent you is their "agreement" then you should be able to argue it quite easily.

Link to post
Share on other sites

it seems that there is no point in writing to this particular DCA

 

would it be in MAVEs interest to let the DCA try to 'pursue a county court claim'?

 

i mean, if they try to do this, wouldnt they have to produce a legible CCA in court?

post office WON 12/11/06

 

abbey.LBA sent 30/10/06.MCOL claim submitted 8/11/06.allocation questionnaire sent 16/12/06.schedule of charges sent 16/12/06.WON

 

2nd abbey claim SAR sent 3/1/07.WON.complaint letter sent 18/1/08

 

alliance and Leicester.WON

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the info

 

I am worried about this. I do not wish to have a CCJ against my name, but if they continue to ignore me, I don't know what to do.

 

You quoted a section of the CCA. Doesanyone have an impressive looking letter to send? Nothing in templates matches this.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Also, before I realised that what they sent back did not comply with CCA, I sent a payment by postal order to them. They have said nothing about having received this, and I am not sure how to check receipt and encashment of postal orders. Does anyone know? I was advised to send this, not a cheque, as people said it was wiser.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Sharmal- much appreciated. Will do. Now I just have to see what to do about this threat of a CCJ and wait for a response to my letter about their 'non compliance', though judging from other, similar posts, DCAs seem to just ignore this fact a lot and push on with the legal threats.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...