Proserve ANPR PCN - Felixstowe Docks

[whitelist]

Good friend of mine just sent me an email after he got a ticket from this lot demanding £250 while doing a delivery at Felixstowe Docks

 

It seems this cowboy outfit are not members of the BPA etc or any Accredited Trade Association 

 

This i believe was subject to a judicial review with DVLA releasing keeper detail

 

What is the current status with not being a member of a trade body and DVLA  as well as dealing with these crooks?

 

Is this statement correct?

 

Companies which are not accredited by either the British Parking Association (BPA) or the International Parking Community (IPC) can’t take you to court by getting your details from the DVLA

[DragonFly1967]

Not exactly. Anyone can take anyone else to court. Winning at court when they do on the other hand 

The problem that these clowns are going to have is that Felixstowe, like pretty much every other docks, has it's own bylaws.

 

whilst you certainly could be given a "penalty charge" which would be enforceable in Magistrates Court, some cowboy outfit sending off an invoice for £250 and hoping that you roll over and pay up without asking too many questions, is an entirely different matter.

I've not read these, but have a good old read. I dare say that parking on the dockyard is covered in there somewhere. 

Felixstowe Docks - General_Bye_Laws.pdf

[whitelist]

Can these people get details from DVLA not being members of an accredited trade association>>??

[DragonFly1967]

Yes, anyone can (for a reasonable cause) on payment of a fee to the DVLA. £5 if memory serves.

What they can't do is ignore the bylaws.

They'll try it on of course (read any VCS - No Stopping thread (different singer, same song)) in the hopes that someone will pay them.

 

But a nice reply to them quoting the bylaws and the relevant acts of parliament *should* at least let them know that you're not going to have the wool pulled over your eyes.

[whitelist]

https://www.gov.uk/request-information-from-dvla

Private car parking management companies that give out parking tickets or trespass charge notices can only request information from DVLA if they’re members of the British Parking Association or the International Parking Community.

 

[DragonFly1967]

Indeed, but they'll claim that they're a Security Company and not a Private Parking Company. They'll find a way around it, and DVLA are complicit by not really doing any checks.

If you have a goose that lays golden eggs, the last thing you want to do is ring its neck.

 

Have a look at this and have a good read 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/search/?q=proserve&quick=1&type=forums_topic&nodes=65

[whitelist]

Am currently reporting this outfit to action fraud

 

They are not acting as Bailiffs or as a security company but a parking management company

Edited August 5, 2020 by whitelist

[DragonFly1967]

You're preaching to the choir whitelist.

This post may be of a particular interest 

 

[dx100uk]

unless he has a letter of claim

you ignore them.

 

please complete this:

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/391121-have-you-received-a-parking-ticket/

[whitelist]

Many thanks

 

schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012 has not been mention with the NTK

 

What is the relevance>

[lookinforinfo]

Should the csae go any further your friend might find this site of interest.

http://www.trucknetuk.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=119015

 

Apparently back then they applied to the DVLA for trucker details on the grounds of trespass, then amened it to breach of contract in Court. 

[brassnecked]

They have a very shaky case if they tried court, if he had legitimate business as in was delivering, a Permit to park isn't applicable to delivery drivers, posties and milkmen etc. been said in court by Judges before that. fill in the questions on the sticky DX  posted then ignore until a Letter before Claim.

[dx100uk]

pers i thought peppio had more sense  ...byelaws! which no ppc can ever enforce rule.

[ericsbrother]

as they target commercial vehicles it isnt usually necessary to get the keeper details, they just demand money from the company that has their logo plastered on the side of the lorry.

There is also different law surrounding their demands as the POFA doesnt apply and it isnt a consumer contract. You will unfortunately need to do a lot of reading up about these people as they ahve had mixed success in the courts so a bit of a lottery as to what bits of previous cases to use as being relevant.

 

However, the signage is on your side as ity mentions removal of vehicles, which means that unless the byelaws specifically allow it (and then the cost of removal doesnt necessarily ahve to be borne by the vehicle owner) then it is  unlawful and possibly illegal so that makes the whole contract void as it is a criminal compact

 

Proserve have a very complicated arrangement with the landowner and that means they have to pay the landowner for every trespass and then claim the money back form the vehicle driver/owner. in practicve they dont pay a peny in advance (can you imagine how long they would be inbusiness if they ahd to fork out hundreds of thousands a week with little prospect of recovering those advances?)

 

they also stop vehicles entering the docks if the company that owns it refuses to pay or has beaten them in court before despite not having any powers to do so. A vindictive, dishonest outfit.

[whitelist]

What is interesting is the sign they use as it is  all over the place in that is says you have either committed an offence of Trespass or entered into a contract. So which is it? if a contract the POFA applies along with getting details from DVLA, or if trespass you have to quantify any loss sustained

 

Take it Ex turpi causa non oritur actio will also apply to this mob?

Edited August 6, 2020 by whitelist

[brassnecked]

Think that sign will tie any solicitor in knots  on an either all attempt at a catch all POC, by trying to conflate criminal law with Civil,.

[ericsbrother]

see the previous reports on this bunch.

 

I have explained they have a complicated agreement with landlord so damages for trespass would apply if it was actually true.

 

As they only go after lorries the POFA doesnt apply, the charging for removal is a difficult one as i dont know what the byelaws say and they would have to show that the vehicle is preventing lawful access to others otherwise just a notice applied to the vehicle would be the most they could do for someone waiting to unload.

 

However, the signage is as clear as mud and by including both sets of conditions they have really killed any chance of getting anywhere with a claim and that is why they resort to preventing access the next time you visit.

 

As their contract is peculiar suing their masters would be the way to resolve this but as that is fraught with danger as a commercial venture rather than a simple small claim of an aggrieved consumer

 

I have found an old case, Merriveen v Proserve and there is another that was spat out by HHJ Moloney, he of the Beavis case fame so Proserve's case must be garbage.

 

That decision was based mainly on the signage so there you have it. 

Ransomes Park v Anderson appears to be the required reading along with what happened afterwards

[honeybee13]

This has links to byelaws, EB.

 

https://www.portoffelixstowe.co.uk/company-information/marine-information/

 

HB

[brassnecked]

Links here To Prankster gives an indication of what's what

 

https://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2014/11/merriveen-v-proserve.html

 

https://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2014/12/ransomes-v-anderson-judgment-available.html

 

[ericsbrother]

so parking covered but the only penalty is possible removal

No mention of a group of bandits claiming hundreds of quid from you